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Post subject: Re: When does an "upgrade" become a downgrade?
Posted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 2:06 am
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ted j wrote:
When people artificially "relic" a guitar (including Fender)

I don't care if a master craftsman has done it, they have taken a decent looking guitar and ballsed it up and no matter which way you dress it up with"vibe" or anything else, it's a fake and to me will always look like crap


Don't get me started on "relics". It's like the entire guitar industry these days is based on making guitarists think they're something they're not. Never done a gig? Well why not buy a "road worn" guitar and pretend you've been out of your bedroom!

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Post subject: Re: When does an "upgrade" become a downgrade?
Posted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 2:07 am
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ted j wrote:
When people artificially "relic" a guitar (including Fender)

I don't care if a master craftsman has done it, they have taken a decent looking guitar and ballsed it up and no matter which way you dress it up with"vibe" or anything else, it's a fake and to me will always look like crap


Agreed on that one. I absolutely love a guitar that looks like it's been towed behind a truck, kicked around by roadies, and possibly even slightly on fire at some point if that's what actually happened. Each mark has a story to tell.

Not quite the same when it came like that from the factory, it just seems a bit pointless to me. I'd rather cause my own damage. :mrgreen:


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Post subject: Re: When does an "upgrade" become a downgrade?
Posted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 2:08 am
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Squiers with fake Fender decals :evil:

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Post subject: Re: When does an "upgrade" become a downgrade?
Posted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 2:54 am
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GilgaFrank wrote:
ted j wrote:
When people artificially "relic" a guitar (including Fender)

I don't care if a master craftsman has done it, they have taken a decent looking guitar and ballsed it up and no matter which way you dress it up with"vibe" or anything else, it's a fake and to me will always look like crap


Don't get me started on "relics". It's like the entire guitar industry these days is based on making guitarists think they're something they're not. Never done a gig? Well why not buy a "road worn" guitar and pretend you've been out of your bedroom!

Cosmetically Challenged..Accidentally Dropped..Abused ( slight or serious), Uncaring Owners..Thrashed to within....far easier for sales if we lump them all under one banner :)


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Post subject: Re: When does an "upgrade" become a downgrade?
Posted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 5:32 am
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I think an 'upgrade' or 'downgrade' is nothing but a change. Some for the better, some for the worse.

modwiz wrote:
Part of the Brave New World is Newspeak. Corporations and governments, now one and the same, engage in this naming game. It is pure mindfark and meant to laugh in your face as you are told a turd is a tootsie roll. Once more become aware and begin some form of boycott, things can improve. Of course, people will have to stop watching TV and gazing into their palms for the change to take place. The programming and Newspeak go hand in hand.


Wow- I'll hand it to you modwiz, I don't know or have a clue on what you just said but it seems pretty deep & thoughtful- care to elaborate on this? or we're you just having a 'moment'..? :wink:

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Post subject: Re: When does an "upgrade" become a downgrade?
Posted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 6:01 am
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Based on personal taste, one will consider a certain accomplishment to be an "upgrade". To the next person's, this will be considered a "downgrade". To the ambivalent, this would be a "modification". And then there's all sorts of conditional criteria in terms of good/bad percentages with outright neutrality of the change as yet another factor. One simple example: Rewiring the lower tone pot on a Strat in order to attenuate the pickup's highs in the bridge position. Many would argue it is necessary, many others would argue it isn't necessary and/or that it defeats Leo's purpose. And then there's many more who really don't care either way. Yet, when faced with this change, this third group would then be subjected to having to evaluate its validity as it concerns them. The criteria can go on exponentially. Surely, a Venn Diagram can be made on the logic of this subject where in the first and final analysis, the antecedent condition(s) dictate "modification".

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Post subject: Re: When does an "upgrade" become a downgrade?
Posted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 6:50 am
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modwiz wrote:
Part of the Brave New World is Newspeak. Corporations and governments, now one and the same, engage in this naming game. It is pure mindfark and meant to laugh in your face as you are told a turd is a tootsie roll. Once more become aware and begin some form of boycott, things can improve. Of course, people will have to stop watching TV and gazing into their palms for the change to take place. The programming and Newspeak go hand in hand.


Modwiz:

You are so right. Having worked in a newsroom I can only say that when all is said and done and the public craves for more than what is newly available- simply put a new wrapper on it and promote it or expect that there are new recipients who have yet to discover the original.

Of course, there will always be limited use for the old to be re-introduced; but, the producer sometimes does a lame or over produced approach and often flogs the product to death in making us believe that it is something we all must have.

As for Strats, some old versions reproduced are welcomed. There are those of us who wouldn't mind a '57 Chevy modernized repro and others who would prefer perhaps a T Bird or similar repro. But there aren't many who want a beaten up version (unless original) like some of the axes newly made. Go figure.

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Post subject: Re: When does an "upgrade" become a downgrade?
Posted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 7:08 am
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I go online now and then to check the inventory at the local Music-Go-Round, saving myself the trip across town. I never cease to be amazed, when reading the descriptions of the used guitars they are selling, at how many of those guitars have been "upgraded."

Usually, the upgrade consists of changing out the original pickups and frequently this is done in many of the Squier guitars M-G-R has in its inventory. Odd, also, that many of the Squier guitars have naked headstocks, too. Another of their favorite ideas of an upgrade is the previous owner's "custom paint job!" Yikes!

On the good side, I once bought a nice MIM Strat at M-G-R for $229 with coupon special. When I got the guitar home and proceeded to swap the pickguard (red toroise rather than mint green) I found a complete set of Kent Armstrong TweedTone pickups had been installed in that guitar. No wonder that thing sounded so nice when I played it there!

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This was one of those rare occasions when I think a guitar really had been upgraded, but the boys at M-G-R didn't know it and I got a sweet deal.

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Post subject: Re: When does an "upgrade" become a downgrade?
Posted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 7:53 am
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When the upgrade is an S1 switching system with a cheap plastic button that looks like something off a 1970s cassette machine

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Post subject: Re: When does an "upgrade" become a downgrade?
Posted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 8:47 am
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Dalembic wrote:
If you're modding your instrument...imo you are likely to sell it later on anyhow.


That is an idiotic statement. :roll:

Did SRV sell his #1?

Did Clapton sell the orginal Blackie?

Did David Gilmour sell the Black Strat?

I could go on and on. Yes, some people did sell or give away their guitars, but I seriously doubt that was their intent when they modded them in the first place.

I certainly have no intention of selling any of my guitars or amps anytime soon. 8)

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Post subject: Re: When does an "upgrade" become a downgrade?
Posted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 9:35 am
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Modifications: The result of a mans need to poke around with stuff. While we may not all agree on the work they had done, for the guitars' owner it was entirely necessary at the time. :wink:


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Post subject: Re: When does an "upgrade" become a downgrade?
Posted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 4:22 pm
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I've bought a lower end Gretsch with "upgraded" CTS pots, also a Strat Classic 50's with a bone nut and Custom Shop 50's PU's. With guitars like this an upgrade is ok with me. However I would never consider purchasing a higher end guitar that has been messed with.


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Post subject: Re: When does an "upgrade" become a downgrade?
Posted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 7:56 pm
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Martian wrote:
The criteria can go on exponentially. Surely, a Venn Diagram can be made on the logic of this subject where in the first and final analysis, the antecedent condition(s) dictate "modification".

Easy, easy. :shock: I retired last June so I could finally stop thinking. :wink:

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Post subject: Re: When does an "upgrade" become a downgrade?
Posted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 10:04 pm
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ZZDoc wrote:
Martian wrote:
The criteria can go on exponentially. Surely, a Venn Diagram can be made on the logic of this subject where in the first and final analysis, the antecedent condition(s) dictate "modification".

Easy, easy. :shock: I retired last June so I could finally stop thinking. :wink:


Congrats, ZZDoc! :!: Your guitars must be happy to have you a little more full time.


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Post subject: Re: When does an "upgrade" become a downgrade?
Posted: Mon Apr 08, 2013 4:15 am
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Toronado wrote:
ZZDoc wrote:
Martian wrote:
The criteria can go on exponentially. Surely, a Venn Diagram can be made on the logic of this subject where in the first and final analysis, the antecedent condition(s) dictate "modification".

Easy, easy. :shock: I retired last June so I could finally stop thinking. :wink:


Congrats, ZZDoc! :!: Your guitars must be happy to have you a little more full time.

Not quite yet. Hope to have my study/studio completed by the end of June. Then I'll get back into it with a bit more regularity.

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