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Post subject: Has Fender ruined the Jackson brand?
Posted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 12:01 pm
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There has been discussions on other guitar forums about how Fender has ruined the Jackson brand by flooding their line with cheap $250 guitars. Their CS is about a two year wait, and the quality of their mid range guitars has gone down. An used $350 90's MIJ Jackson is better than anything new from Jackson on the $400-600 range. Many Jackson fans believe it's Fender's fault for trying to make a quick buck out of the Jackson name they have lowered the quality drastically.

Jackson has moved from THE must have axe for metal to the budget metal axe. I think ESP and Ibanez has left Jackson in the dust by now. What do you guys think? Any pointy guitar love here?

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Post subject: Re: Has Fender ruined the Jackson brand?
Posted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 2:46 pm
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It is more market conditions than anything FMIC did. A guitar that cost $600 to make 20 years ago costs around $1500 to make now. Plus today you have the EPA, Fish and Wildlife, the US Justice Dept, tree huggers and US Customs breathing down your neck 24/7/365.

Fender didn't ruin Jackson anymore than the designated hitter ruined baseball. Wait, the designated hitter DID ruin baseball. Ok skip that analogy. Fender didn't ruin Jackson anymore than David Lee Roth ruined Van Halen. Whoops. OK no more analogies.

It's just the economy. People want cheap guitars right now. The same question could be asked about Fender with their Modern Player series and other cost cutting moves such as the elimination of some left handed models and whittling down color choices. It is all the economy. You can make more money by selling ten $400 guitars made in some country with a low pay scale than you can selling one USA made $2000 guitar. It's business.

As to the quality of the instrument, I think it is more the quality of the player that matters. I saw a guy summer before last that played a Squier Strat within an inch of it's life. He is one of the best players I've ever seen live. I don't think anyone but me even realized he was playing what some consider a substandard instrument and I would not have enjoyed it more if he'd been playing a USA made Fender. If anything I respected his skill more, but I would not have enjoyed it more.

People seem to equate the price of an instrument with your ability to play it well. The fact is that the older you get and the more you get around watching players who can really play well, the more you will realize that there is absolutely no correlation whatsoever between the price of the instrument, what wood the body is made out of, whether the pickups are ceramic or alnico, where the instrument was made, whether there is nitro or poly paint on it and a user's actual ability to play. I think this guy could have been playing a First Act guitar off the shelf from Wal-Mart and knocked everyone out just the same. It isn't the instrument, it is you. I think today's Jacksons, even the lower end ones, are very decent instruments for the money and actually better than many other brands in the same price range. Just my opinion. So make the most of what you have to work with.


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Post subject: Re: Has Fender ruined the Jackson brand?
Posted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 3:04 pm
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Haha loved your analogies. I think Jackson should make a low end name like Squier, Epiphone or LTD (ESP guitars low end). I remember back in the 80's and early 90's when the guitar shredding gods proudly wielded Jacksons making it an icon of the hard rock/metal world. Now they hang at the lowest part of the Guitar Center wall right next to the Squiers and below the Ibanez and ESP's.

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Post subject: Re: Has Fender ruined the Jackson brand?
Posted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 3:17 pm
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If wikipedia is to be believed then Jackson were turning out budget instruments in the far east long before the Fender buyout.

I was never really taken with the Jackson brand. In the 1980s all I wanted was Strats and more Strats. And maybe a few Teles. And maybe, just maybe a Kramer Elliot Easton.

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Post subject: Re: Has Fender ruined the Jackson brand?
Posted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 5:04 pm
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Think it's more of the direction Jackson was already on. They were 80's metal, and they haven't changed. Sales declined, corners got cut.

I'm almost surprised they aren't still coming out in crackle finishes.

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Post subject: Re: Has Fender ruined the Jackson brand?
Posted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 5:08 pm
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As far as Jackson/Charvel is concerned, I only liked their Surfcasters with the lipstick pickups--the pointy-headed heavy metal shred machines never appealed to me.

Back in the late 80's I had a (somewhat) girlfriend who had a red Kramer bass. I liked that one...or maybe I just liked looking at her trying to play it. :lol:


Happy that one didn't work out--she's on husband #4 now. :?

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Post subject: Re: Has Fender ruined the Jackson brand?
Posted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 5:28 pm
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Screamin' Armadillo wrote:
--the pointy-headed heavy metal shred machines never appealed to me.

Me too, Matt

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Post subject: Re: Has Fender ruined the Jackson brand?
Posted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 5:52 pm
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I think it was musicyo.com that was offering 5 jackson guitars for 399.00 or something like that. It was ridiculous. This was 10 or 12 years ago prior to Fender acquiring the name. Jackson certainly isn't what it was in 80's but Fender has done OK with the brand in my humble opinion.

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Post subject: Re: Has Fender ruined the Jackson brand?
Posted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 5:59 pm
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their $1000 + guitars are still quality.

I wouldn't say the guitar's quality matters as far as how someone sounds, but usually there is better tuning stability. Sometimes the individual can notice the tone differences and that can help them play better, even if the differences are only noticed by themselves.

Also, the higher end guitars, and particularly some brands of guitar in the high end hold their resale value better.

Personally, I like some pointy guitars, but not all. I tend to gravitate towards more traditional looking guitars since my mid 20's.


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Post subject: Re: Has Fender ruined the Jackson brand?
Posted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 1:28 am
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brotherdave wrote:
It's just the economy. People want cheap guitars right now. The same question could be asked about Fender with their Modern Player series and other cost cutting moves such as the elimination of some left handed models and whittling down color choices. It is all the economy. You can make more money by selling ten $400 guitars made in some country with a low pay scale than you can selling one USA made $2000 guitar. It's business.


This is one of the reasons Fender cheapened their American Deluxe series in 2010 by deleting key features such as the locking bridge option from the HSS Strat, the abalone fret position markers and the futuristic 22-fret electric bass designs.


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Post subject: Re: Has Fender ruined the Jackson brand?
Posted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 5:45 am
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If memory serves, I don't recall Fender ever offering a line which featured the kind of 'fast' neck profiles these other brands attract shredders with. They've basically gotten their marque out of the market of Floyd trems and the lot and focused on what their customer base follows them for. It's Charvel/Jackson which they've essential handed that baton off to.

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Post subject: Re: Has Fender ruined the Jackson brand?
Posted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 12:27 pm
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Not anymore than Gibson ruined Epi.


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Post subject: Re: Has Fender ruined the Jackson brand?
Posted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 12:40 pm
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yep, Gibson ruined Epiphone, a once great company with a rich history. They've also trashed several other companies, just look at the list: :cry:

http://www.gibson.com/press/brands.html

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Post subject: Re: Has Fender ruined the Jackson brand?
Posted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 1:06 pm
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strings10927 wrote:
yep, Gibson ruined Epiphone, a once great company with a rich history. They've also trashed several other companies, just look at the list: :cry:

http://www.gibson.com/press/brands.html


I can't believe anyone could run Trace Elliot into the ground. I had a Trace bass amp in the late 90s, that thing absolutely shook the floor. And then suddenly they're gone.

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Post subject: Re: Has Fender ruined the Jackson brand?
Posted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 3:04 pm
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ZZDoc wrote:
If memory serves, I don't recall Fender ever offering a line which featured the kind of 'fast' neck profiles these other brands attract shredders with. They've basically gotten their marque out of the market of Floyd trems and the lot and focused on what their customer base follows them for. It's Charvel/Jackson which they've essential handed that baton off to.



They have done in the past with the Heartfield line and Showmaster series and did very well at it.. I'd put this up against any Ibanez or Jackson in the 90's era anyday.. Problem is, ESP and Ibanez nowadays pretty much own the market. All Jacksons I see now are all cheap.


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