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Post subject: Re: Why do people think rock is dead?
Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 2:39 pm
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I reckon eighties to early 90's had the last of music that I would be impressed with. Sure I like some music today, but none of which impresses me that much.

Bands like U2, Van Halen, Guns n Roses (not current line-up).. Motley Crüe etc.. They were a different breed but still rock regardless.. Impressed me. Nirvana was alright as I was a teenager, however I've seen them become more popular after Kurt died. Green day has had a good career with music also

Still today we have ACDC, Robert Plant & Led Zepp, Rolling Stones etc... Most of it is still there. The effect that the Internet has had on music has shown itself too, although more artists can promote themselves today. Gone are the huge arena shows from yesteryear. Only the old bands can pull those type of crowds.. Least in my part of the world anyways.

Question: with the bands of today- who will we see still playing 20-30yrs in the future?

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Post subject: Re: Why do people think rock is dead?
Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 7:33 pm
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I've been around enough to know that in all genres of commercial music everything runs in cycles.

Folk groups and folk instruments had a huge surge in the late 50's and early 60's. Now Neo-Folk is really heating up with acts like Mumford & Sons, the Avett Brothers, Felice Brothers and Band of Horses bringing back folk instrumentation, arrangement styles and harmonies. Dobros are "cool" again. The ukulele is also back in fashion yet again for like the fourth time. 30 years ago the Blues Brothers made Stax/Volt/Atlantic acts hot again after languishing as music history footnotes for years. Everything about the music business, and especially the public's taste, runs in cycles.

As a lifelong soul music fan, I haven't much liked the direction R&B has gone in lately either with very few exceptions like Gnarls Barkley and frankly that project was not all that recent. R&B today is awash in drum machines and synth bass loops churning out one hit wonders. But I know that real R&B music will make a comeback.

To me, today's urban/rap is more a form of poetic expression than music. It is very much like the 1950's beat poets and their coffee house performance art form. Neither is very musical but both speak to the times and to a focused, segmented and receptive audience. Again another cycle repeats.

Country music goes through cycles also. Earthy acoustic & bluegrass gave way to Western Swing which yielded to Nashville horns then to Bakersfield guitars which lead to LA strings only to have Luckenbach, Texas traditionalism bring back the basics and since then it has been rinse and repeat. Highway 101 rocked country nearly to death and so did Brooks & Dunn and Hank Jr. Now bluegrass is going through about it's 5th resurgence and bluegrass festivals pack in bigger crowds than ever. Bakersfield regularly makes chart impact and Nashville can't seem to make up it's mind whether country is pop or if pop is country. Many long time country fans are just as critical of today's country as long time rock fans are of today's pop rock.

The difference now in rock music isn't that it is dead, it is that for the sake of so many new sounds the corporate suits pushed it aside.

Cycles speeding up, slowing down and even genres fracturing into sub-genres (Acid Rock/Outlaw Country/Urban/Grunge) is something we've seen before. However this time everything seems accelerated because the music business itself has gone through and in fact is continuing to go through sweeping changes that even as recently as the mid 1990's seemed as far fetched as time travel. If you'd told me in 1995 that the number 1 single on Billboard would be by an act not signed to any major label I would never have believed it possible and yet last week that is what happened with Macklemore's current single.

Most if not all musicians, me included, thought Prince lost his mind in 1993 when he changed his name to an unpronounceable symbol and told WEA he didn't need them anymore. Yet he was right and I was wrong as his purple highness earned millions, toured relentlessly and even did the Superbowl halftime show all without having a major label behind him.

While Prince has recently signed a deal again with Warner, the fact remains that he and other independent artists proved they can today sell hundreds of thousands of copies and never sign with a major label. They can do it without label pressure to use this producer or that studio. Recording technology capability that cost hundreds of thousands of dollars 15 years ago and filled rack upon rack with hardware can be downloaded onto your laptop for less than the cost of one hour of studio time in the old days. A large diaphragm condenser microphone costs $100 now instead of two grand.

Out there somewhere right now the next Boston, the next Led Zeppelin and the next AC DC might be recording in some garage, basement, warehouse, storage locker, attic or living room. By no means is Rock dead. It is in the recycle loop and you can be certain it will reinvent itself yet again.


Last edited by brotherdave on Sun Feb 10, 2013 12:31 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: Why do people think rock is dead?
Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2013 11:01 pm
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Maybe because Pete Towsend sang those very words?

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Post subject: Re: Why do people think rock is dead?
Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 12:42 am
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M*Campbell wrote:
Maybe because Pete Towsend sang those very words?


That would be a very long song.


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Post subject: Re: Why do people think rock is dead?
Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 5:56 pm
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It's been declared dead about 800 times. I have a Guitar Player from the early '70s where someone writes a letter in saying that rock guitar music is dead. Wow, they were so right.

I love it that synth music was so big in the early '80s, yet Texas Flood was a hit.

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Post subject: Re: Why do people think rock is dead?
Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 7:32 pm
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It's only the US that's thinks it's dead, because it's saturated with Cowelltastic pap in every media. We are too, but the machine is more highly greased in the bigger markets.

Grass level music just doesn't get the same space. You have to go looking for it. It's still there, but it's not marketable enough for an industry that wants instant disposable 'stars', that mass audiences can emote with on 'their journey' (which lasts as long as they make money).

Ask Dave Grohl the same question and he says he can't fill stadiums fast enough in the UK, Eur and Australia. I live in a noweheresville WA pop 1.5m, but the Foos get over here every couple of years or so, do a couple of nights, and still get 50,000 people in.

Doesn't hurt that Bon Scott lived, and is buried just down the road, so we know what we like.


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Post subject: Re: Why do people think rock is dead?
Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 10:08 pm
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Drubbing wrote:

Doesn't hurt that Bon Scott lived, and is buried just down the road, so we know what we like.


+1

I have to say Australia has pumped out some top class acts- acdc, midnight oil, inxs, silverchair to name a few. Never a shortage of good music downunder that's for sure.

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Post subject: Re: Why do people think rock is dead?
Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2013 10:24 pm
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brotherdave wrote:
M*Campbell wrote:
Maybe because Pete Towsend sang those very words?


That would be a very long song.

I meant the actual words, "rock is dead".
Though, now that I think of it, I beleive it was Roger that sang that part of the song.

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Post subject: Re: Why do people think rock is dead?
Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 2:23 am
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spacewolf wrote:
rileymcc wrote:
spacewolf wrote:
This is a very long thread, so I'll admit I haven't read every post.

There are still a few great rock bands around, but IMO Buxom's friend is right. The Golden Age of rock was the '60s and '70s, and it's been all downhill since then. Rock was dangerous back then, it had a rebellious and anarchistic spirit fueled by the Cold War and the feeling that the world might end tomorrow. Even the glam schlock of the '80s had the "live for today" spirit. But times have changed, the culture has changed, and everything has become commercialized and over-exposed. Most rock bands today are safe and tame and lame.

Just my opinion.

Of course, only if you bother to look at what pop culture has to offer :roll:
If you think some sh1tty band like the foo fighters is as dangerous as it gets nowadays, then my god you've gotta look somewhere else.


You seem to be putting words in my mouth. When have I ever said anything good about the Foo Fighters? I know they have a lot of fans on this forum, but the Foo Fighters bore me to tears, and I would definitely classify them as safe and lame and tame. Tool was great, but they haven't done anything new in years. The only bands that really trip my trigger these days are underground bands like Electric Wizard and Earthless, which is the whole point. Hiphop and pop divas have been driving the music scene - at least over here in the States - for decades now. The only rock bands that achieve commercial success these days are the ones churning out radio-friendly commercially acceptable 'product'. Rock and roll is becoming more and more marginalized, as opposed to the '60s and '70s when it was in the forefront of musical culture.

I was just using them as an example, never put any words in your mouth.
And again, I'll say it in other words; Rock music is as strong as ever today as it was back 40 years, you just can't rely on the radio to feed you music. The rebellious bands are all not as big or 'mainstream' as then, yes, but in a way I think it's good that they're not. Saying that there's no band that stands up for something or says a big $@!& you to the man is just naive :roll:

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Post subject: Re: Why do people think rock is dead?
Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 9:36 pm
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rileymcc wrote:
spacewolf wrote:

Of course, only if you bother to look at what pop culture has to offer :roll:
If you think some sh1tty band like the foo fighters is as dangerous as it gets nowadays, then my god you've gotta look somewhere else.

I love the Foo Fighters, but then, I'm over the hill and don't have anything to be angry about anymore - that's mostly excess testosterone anyway.

It's their stuff that got me finally wanting to play guitar, instead of listening to it. Ask my wife - the Foo Fighters have turned out pretty %$^@#%&# dangerous...


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Post subject: Re: Why do people think rock is dead?
Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 9:59 pm
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Rock is not dead. Rock is stronger than it has ever been, and it is FAR from safe and homogenized;


This came out just this week: http://soundcloud.com/subpop/pissed-jeans-cathouse

This came out last year: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TE2dHvwA4bo&hd=1

etc



And to the guy who said nothing new has happened since 77; Please, do show me some sludge from 1977, or some post-rock, or, since you didn't even specify rock music, some ambient techno, hardcore hip hop, trance, glitch, trip-hop... In other words, you sir, have no clue what you're talking about.

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Post subject: Re: Why do people think rock is dead?
Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 10:01 pm
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spacewolf wrote:
rileymcc wrote:
spacewolf wrote:
This is a very long thread, so I'll admit I haven't read every post.

There are still a few great rock bands around, but IMO Buxom's friend is right. The Golden Age of rock was the '60s and '70s, and it's been all downhill since then. Rock was dangerous back then, it had a rebellious and anarchistic spirit fueled by the Cold War and the feeling that the world might end tomorrow. Even the glam schlock of the '80s had the "live for today" spirit. But times have changed, the culture has changed, and everything has become commercialized and over-exposed. Most rock bands today are safe and tame and lame.

Just my opinion.

Of course, only if you bother to look at what pop culture has to offer :roll:
If you think some sh1tty band like the foo fighters is as dangerous as it gets nowadays, then my god you've gotta look somewhere else.


You seem to be putting words in my mouth. When have I ever said anything good about the Foo Fighters? I know they have a lot of fans on this forum, but the Foo Fighters bore me to tears, and I would definitely classify them as safe and lame and tame. Tool was great, but they haven't done anything new in years. The only bands that really trip my trigger these days are underground bands like Electric Wizard and Earthless, which is the whole point. Hiphop and pop divas have been driving the music scene - at least over here in the States - for decades now. The only rock bands that achieve commercial success these days are the ones churning out radio-friendly commercially acceptable 'product'. Rock and roll is becoming more and more marginalized, as opposed to the '60s and '70s when it was in the forefront of musical culture.

EW is one of my favorite bands ever.


Check out Pallbearer, my favorite doom record of 2012. The melodies and riffing and simply unlike anything else I've heard in the genre.

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Post subject: Re: Why do people think rock is dead?
Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 10:14 pm
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Floyd_The_Barber wrote:
Rock is not dead. Rock is stronger than it has ever been, and it is FAR from safe and homogenized;

This came out just this week: http://soundcloud.com/subpop/pissed-jeans-cathouse

This came out last year: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TE2dHvwA4bo&hd=1

and to the guy who said nothing new has happened since 77;


Cathouse is pretty cool, I like that. But it could very easily have come out of 77. Plenty of punk outfits produced such a sound. That makes it derivative - certainly not edgy or unsafe. It's a retread.

The doom metal thing? Well, you find a lot of people thinking it's got nothing to do with music. Sure plenty of people (young men) love it, but thrashing away in a wall of noise, wailing about Lucifer, well not edgy - Sabbath did that 40 years ago, and better. If they took even more speed, instead of dope and acid, they might have sounded a bit like that. I for one am glad they didn't.


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Post subject: Re: Why do people think rock is dead?
Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 10:23 pm
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Drubbing wrote:
Floyd_The_Barber wrote:
Rock is not dead. Rock is stronger than it has ever been, and it is FAR from safe and homogenized;

This came out just this week: http://soundcloud.com/subpop/pissed-jeans-cathouse

This came out last year: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TE2dHvwA4bo&hd=1

and to the guy who said nothing new has happened since 77;


Cathouse is pretty cool, I like that. But it could very easily have come out of 77. Plenty of punk outfits produced such a sound. That makes it derivative - certainly not edgy or unsafe. It's a retread.

The doom metal thing? Well, you find a lot of people thinking it's got nothing to do with music. Sure plenty of people (young men) love it, but thrashing away in a wall of noise, wailing about Lucifer, well not edgy - Sabbath did that 40 years ago, and better. If they took even more speed, instead of dope and acid, they might have sounded a bit like that. I for one am glad they didn't.

No, Sabbath did not do what Satan's Satyrs do. No, more drugs would not have caused them to do so. Yes, Satan's Satyrs are influenced by Sabbath. No, it is not trying to be edgy. No, the lyrics about Satan, in this band especially, are not meant to be taken seriously. No, young men are not their only fans. No, it is not just a "wall of noise". No, even if it were, this would not be a bad thing. And finally, YES, it is music, regardless of what a bunch of Beatle-worshipping (or exclusively radio-listening) jackasses have to say on the matter.



Oh, and more things you won't be able to show me in 77: Black metal, death metal, grindcore, chillwave, post-hardcore, noise rock, stoner/dessert rock, crossover thrash



I could go on for a while.

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Post subject: Re: Why do people think rock is dead?
Posted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 10:29 pm
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https://soundcloud.com/ishotreagan

Recent release. I'd buy their album.

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