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Post subject: Rule of Thumb: Hell's Bells Do Ring
Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 12:21 pm
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Aspiring Musician
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Here is something I've seen more times than I care to count and it seems to be the case at least 90% of the time:

You see & hear a band that has several really good musician-singers in it, all but one.... it is almost guaranteed that the weak member put the band together and runs it. That person is usually the one who solely communicates with the agent OR is getting-booking (most) all the jobs. They probably are also the one with the vehicle that carts the equipment, owns the PA and Lighting, etc., although not in every case. However, these people generally have a minimum grasp of real musicianship &/or music theory, plus they more than likely have a 'tin ear' and struggle to play their parts beyond the basics. (IE: "A Diminished chord? What's THAT? Don't you mean Demolished?" LOL) It really doesn't matter if they have a crap job and make little money or a top job with big bucks, they just don't have the capacity to truly realize or understand that they have very limited talents musically. If confronted with the idea that they seriously need lessons, (and even if they engage a teacher), such physical &/or mental training has nowhere to go and is bound to fail in a very short time. In a few odd situations, the weak member is related to (probably) the strongest one, or has some other connection that ties them in with little or no hope of extrication other than death..... LOL >You may also notice that sometimes the one who is running the group may be under the thumb of a spouse (or some other relationship) that no one else in the band can get around, circumvent, over-rule or in any way avoid the unwanted and abrasive input. This might consist of: What songs to play (or not), what to wear (or not), what jobs to take (or not) and so forth. > Recognize anyone yet? .... Let's hope it's not you. LOL

I've also seen situations where a weak musician put together an excellent band and finally realized that they couldn't keep up, so they replaced themselves and became the manager, then directed the group into tunes and shows that were so wrong for them, I was surprised the band didn't puke on stage. Then again, there are tons of managers and agents that are the epitome of the 'wanna-be' musician who 'perform vicariously' through their charges. This is very common place. Otherwise you have a true business person who has NO CLUE what being a musician is all about.... all they know is that music can make them money, nothing else.

Anyone who has been in the music business for a while can tell you that it is difficult to find other musicians who have the same goals (musically and otherwise) as you do. Almost every band has a 'black sheep' or someone who is a bit off from the rest of the group. One example: They may be super-talented ON stage, but a nut case off. Even with the perfect band, you still have to deal with Managers, Agents AND people who run the venues where you perform. So, before you play a gig anywhere, find out if the place has:
1- An actual stage, 2- If that stage is big enough for your group, 3- If the place has proper electrical outlets. (Enjoy blowing fuses? Or... does your equipment not run right because of low voltage?) 4- A spot for your sound & light people to work from? 5- Decent (dressing) Rooms, other than the public toilets? > There's more, but I think you get it. Prioritize your own list.

Final note: Sadly, there is literally no middle ground here. To find a collection of musicians, managers &/or agents that ALL have the proper talents and abilities to do their respective jobs in harmony with everyone else is expecting a miracle. If you are ever able to, just ask any musician who has made a career of it and they'll tell you more horror stories than you want to know about. (Richard Marx!) Of course, NO career in any field is smooth sailing, but the pot-holes on the road to achieving your goals in the music business can be pits to hell, being forced to deal with (at probably more than one point in time) no-talent idiot-morons.
> And the general public wonders why so many great musicians get into (& even die from) booze & drugs....... Duhhhhh! Nirvana anyone?

BTW: Don't let any of this bum you out, just make note & be forewarned.

What say ye? Any comments on this?


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Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 12:54 pm
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Feel better now?

n.


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Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 1:22 pm
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My goal here was not to vent, but inform. The road to stardom CAN be a gauntlet. It's better to know this ahead of time and be prepared than not. It is far too easy to let all the great things about being a musician cloud ones vision of reality. Life's a beach & the sand gets in places you didn't even know you had!


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Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 1:54 pm
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I don't think it's right for you to "inform" anyone about what they may encounter on "the road to stardom," as it it obvious that you have not traveled that road.

While not famous, I am a professional musician, and I work with a lot of full time pros, and none of them would agree with your initial post. What you described is the kind of crap that happens among amateurs, and professionals don't hang with it.

If the ultimate message of your post is, "The road to stardom is a mighty rough one," well.... duh.


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Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 2:53 pm
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While not famous, I am ALSO a professional musician, and have worked with plenty of full time pros.... I spent over 20 years out on the road..... however, I'm apparently not living in an area that is resplendent with 'non-issue' musicians. YOU are lucky. I didn't post the above to haggle with anyone.... You've had your experiences, I've had mine.

Of couse I was covering the time frame from amateur to pro. Unless you are someone like Dweezle Zappa and get to hob-nob with the top people in the business from birth, the rest of us ALL go through the amateur stage(s)..... everyone's road is different. I wasn't prepared and wish someone had educated me about all the pros & cons.

As far as 'not having traveled that road' (to becoming rich & famous).... I suppose that long, personal, face-to-face talks with successful people listed below (NO BS!) doesn't count, eh? I can't verify the exact order or dates of these encounters, nor what was discussed, but they DID happen, just as I was 22 at the time I got to chat with musicians backstage at the first Woodstock in '69. (Yes, I'm 61 now)

Leslie -Weinstein- West (when he was in the Vagrants, NYC)
Ronny James Dio (from Cortland, NY.... when he was in ELF)
Joe English (drummer for Wings, from Rochester, NY.... in Jam Factory)
Joe Walsh (he was in the James Gang at the time)
The Moody Blues (partied with them TWICE)
Members of the Carpenter's band (mainly, the 'open tuning' guitarist)
Kenny Rogers (near the end of tours with the First Edition, '74)
Paul Stanley & Vinnie Vincent (we 3 had lunch in Jan. '83 - Norfolk, VA)
*Met but didn't get to chat with Gene $immons or Eric Carr: But did have long talk with head of KISS security.... He has some insane stories!*

... and the list goes on, many I can't recall at the moment, but I've even had the privilege of working with musicians who went on to gig behind people such as Lou Rawls and Joe Bonamasa. No, not all had negatives to tell, as we mostly just talked music, but I certainly was told some eye-openers here & there and I've just encapsulated them with my own.

BTW: Have you read the Richard Marx book, or anything on the music business authored by Kenny Rogers? If nothing more, they ARE an insight that backs up much of what I've posted, be it worded gently or very blunt. I'm sure you MUST be aware that these are not the only printed matter available with info that testifies to such pro & con accounts in them.


Last edited by Guitarman1117 on Mon Apr 21, 2008 3:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 3:18 pm
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When's your novel coming out? JK :P :D


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Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 3:31 pm
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Its the music business, if you don't generate the venue or label any business, they will not pay you to stay in the music business. After working in commercial radio for nearly 10 years, it oftentimes has nothing to do with musical skills or talent, but more with marketability. You can have a brilliant musician, but if they aren't too photogenic, they may often get passed over for someone with less talent, but whose picture may look better on a billboard. Also, many records coming out only have 1-3 good songs on them at times, because basically the record companies these days just need a good song or 2 on the record to get airplay, and hope to sell records based on the success of the singles and not sell records based on the actual album as a whole. I could go on about it, but I'll shut up for now.

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Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 3:39 pm
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As quirky as your question may be, murdochart, you aren't the first to ask such a thing. Even though I write, it wouldn't be a novel (as most are fiction) and undertaking your implication would be a huge project that would definitely be truth, which would require far too much time and research to complete. Besides, as many wonderful memories as it would bring up, the crap I went through to have a story to tell would be too depressing..... especially parts about all the female 'fans'..... LOL.


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Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 4:13 pm
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If I was going to write a book, it would be about a Great Blues Guitarist who goes to the Crossroads in search of Fame and fortune, only to find a Strip Mall, with the Devil serving up Capuccino's at the Starbucks in Barnes and Noble.

"Are you the Devil," the Bluesman would ask? Searching the Barista's apron for an abscent name tag.
"Yes," he'd reply. "How many Shot's in that?"
"I'm not here for Java," say's Bluesman, leaning heavily on the cold formica, so he could stare evenly into Satan's eyes.
"Dude, not cool," Satan replied nervously, "my manager's right in the back. I get off in about an hour and a half, meet be by the green Geo Tracker, and we'll talk."

And thus, would begin, my epic novel.............

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Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 5:34 pm
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WOW...


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Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 5:37 pm
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Dude, I had that trip once!

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Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 5:48 pm
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I think I can sum all this up in a few lines.

The road to fame is no doubt a tough one to travel. Unfortunately some will have it harder than others. You just have to wait and cross those bridges when you get to'em.


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Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 7:44 pm
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It makes me wonder...which one should I watch tonight? 'This Is Spinal Tap', or 'That Thing You Do'? Maybe both.


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Posted: Mon Apr 21, 2008 9:25 pm
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In many, if not most respects, your issues with the music biz are no different than a million other professions, and life in general. If you're not where you want to be, you have choices to make... work harder, give up, change your appearance or attitude, look for something else to hold you over while perfecting your craft, go back to school, realize that it might actually be you that's the problem, etc etc. ( Just as I should try different numbers for next weeks lotto drawing instead of the same ones every week? :? )

Sorry you've encountered such obstacles but if at 61 you have nothing but negatives to report, perhaps you harbor some regrets at not doing things different. For whatever reason, it clearly isn't happening so, make a change and enjoy the road ahead.

n.


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Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2008 6:28 am
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twangee wrote:
It makes me wonder...which one should I watch tonight? 'This Is Spinal Tap', or 'That Thing You Do'? Maybe both.


I think i will watch the ultimate story of a music legends rise and fall and rise again.........Walk Hard: The Dewey Cox Story!!!


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