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Post subject: Wood Variance Within the Same Wood Type
Posted: Fri Aug 17, 2012 10:23 pm
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There's an online retailer that sells it's new guitars by weighing each one, listing the serial number, and showing pictures of each individual guitar as opposed to a stock photo, and let's you pick which one you'd like to purchase.

One guitar has very wide, distinct ring patterns, and weighs almost a pound less than the same make/model/color of the other guitar that has very little ring separation, and seems much more uniform in appearance.

My question is: how do the differences in weight and ring pattern translate into sound characteristics? The wood is alder if that's relevant at all.


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Post subject: Re: Wood Variance Within the Same Wood Type
Posted: Fri Aug 17, 2012 10:45 pm
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Generally speaking, lighter hardwoods have less moisture content (which is why vintage instruments weigh somewhat less than contemporary guitars constructed of seemingly similar lumber). The lighter bodies tend to resonate more dramatically.

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Post subject: Re: Wood Variance Within the Same Wood Type
Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2012 11:04 am
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To bounce off of what Arjay said... (very good Arjay... you get a sticker) 8)
The ring patterns differ depending on how close or far away from the center of tree the piece of wood was cut. The closer to the center, the more uniform the grain and the more dense the wood is. Knots are less likely toward the center also, because a knot is just a place in the tree where a branch started to grow out of. The tree grows from the inside out, so the farther away from the center, the looser, older, and dryer the grain, and that makes for a lighter piece of wood.
Most run-o-the-mill acoustic guitars have spruce soundboards which is a soft wood because the soft wood transmits sound better than hardwood. The sound vibrates on the saddle and bridge, resonates on the soundboard, bounces off the hardwood sides and back, and comes out through the the sound hole.
Seems to me, with electrics though, the sound has more to do with the electronics than it does with the wood. Most guitar manufacturers are more concerned with whether or not a particular wood will maintain it's shape over time, and not what kind of effect it will have when somebody throws a DiMarzio in it.

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Post subject: Re: Wood Variance Within the Same Wood Type
Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2012 3:16 pm
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Although I believe that there are many dynamics other than weight and wood density that add to the overall tonal response of a guitar,I once had a 1978 Strat made of Black Ash that weighed an amazing 11 lbs and it sustained like a Steinway Concert Grand.Whether or not the weight and/or wood density had a lot to do with the guitar's incredible sustain, I don't know but it certainly makes you give it pause for thought.

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Post subject: Re: Wood Variance Within the Same Wood Type
Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2012 3:46 pm
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Retroverbial wrote:
The lighter bodies tend to resonate more dramatically.

This is also my experience - and if the body is ash- it tends to react even more wildly :wink:

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Post subject: Re: Wood Variance Within the Same Wood Type
Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2012 6:39 pm
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guitslinger wrote:
Although I believe that there are many dynamics other than weight and wood density that add to the overall tonal response of a guitar,I once had a 1978 Strat made of Black Ash that weighed an amazing 11 lbs and it sustained like a Steinway Concert Grand.Whether or not the weight and/or wood density had a lot to do with the guitar's incredible sustain, I don't know but it certainly makes you give it pause for thought.

There are many different types of Ash.

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Post subject: Re: Wood Variance Within the Same Wood Type
Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2012 7:19 pm
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^^^That's why I specified that it was Black Ash as Black Ash is generally heavier and has a higher density than other types of Ash.

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Post subject: Re: Wood Variance Within the Same Wood Type
Posted: Sat Aug 18, 2012 7:53 pm
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Green and White Ash are typically heavier than Black, all three are heavier then Pumpkin Ash. (swamp) White is usually the heaviest of all but black is easier to work with.

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Post subject: Re: Wood Variance Within the Same Wood Type
Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2012 12:03 am
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Good info.

@Frankie - that definitely falls in line with the differences between these two guitars. The heavier one actually has, what appears to be, the heart of the tree in one of it's two planks.

And that's another thing, I noticed the body of the heavier guitar is made of two planks, and the lighter one is made of three.

So, with all this info in mind, which one would you guys get: the lighter, wide ring, 3 plank or the heavier, center cut, 2 plank?


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Post subject: Re: Wood Variance Within the Same Wood Type
Posted: Mon Aug 20, 2012 12:16 am
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lurineener wrote:
So, with all this info in mind, which one would you guys get: the lighter, wide ring, 3 plank or the heavier, center cut, 2 plank?


If you're standing onstage for four hours playing that guitar, you'll quickly solve the riddle.

My swamp-ash Mary Kaye hardtail is the finest Stratocaster I've ever owned, and the most resonant. It weighs a skosh under 7 lbs.

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Post subject: Re: Wood Variance Within the Same Wood Type
Posted: Tue Aug 21, 2012 7:58 am
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lurineener wrote:
There's an online retailer that sells it's new guitars by weighing each one, listing the serial number, and showing pictures of each individual guitar as opposed to a stock photo, and let's you pick which one you'd like to purchase.One guitar has very wide, distinct ring patterns, and weighs almost a pound less than the same make/model/color of the other guitar that has very little ring separation, and seems much more uniform in appearance.My question is: how do the differences in weight and ring pattern translate into sound characteristics? The wood is alder if that's relevant at all.


This is an oft debated and frequently hot topic on this forum. I have been assembleing stratocasters for about 3 years now. From Squier parts to MIM and MIA parts. I have heavy squier strat bodies that feel like they are made from pure lead and the resonate very well and I have light ash bodies that do the same. I have bodies of all weights and sources and I cannot at this point tell you in good conscience that a lighter or heaver wood makes any difference. No particular type of wood seems to own vibe and tone. For instance I have a MIM alder body that resonates like an organ and I have another one thas kind of dead. I do think a good vibrating piece of wood adds to the basic tonal qualities of a clean non-distorted plugged in instrument (did I say that? but thats my opinion and there are folks here that will strongly disagree) once you add in all types of distortion and effects they all kind of sound the same, the human ear just cannot distinguish, especially given the volumes that most folks play at.

So in the end what you buy is a shot in the dark. It may be a 4.6 ash body that sounds great or a 3.12 alder body thats kind of dead, or visa versa. This might sound crazy but in my short experience some particular neck might love a certain body and sound great with it and on a different body sound just average. There is some fascinating mystery to it all. But in the end probably just Physics. The guitar is much like a tuning fork.

The advice to go with the lighter one if you plan to be on stage is probably the best measure.

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