Yeah...Talking about Lambs to The Slaughter....

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"C'est parti mon Kiki "

I hadn't thought of them....
I think I still have an old football helmet somewhere.....

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"C'est parti mon Kiki "

Well, of course the idea is that there is no professional army, but a militia, formed by the people. If everybody has to join the army for let's say 14 months in his life, the army *is* formed by the people.

If you leave the weapons with the people, no funny government or military putsch can ever take over the country. That's the idea behind it and it has been proven very valid for several times in history.

Cheers

David

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"Humans think they are smarter than dolphins because we build cars and buildings and start wars etc...and all that dolphins do is swim in the water, eat fish and play around. Dolphins believe that they are smarter for exactly the same reasons."

No. I'm stating we have the right to bear arms to protect ourselves from domestic and foreign enemies and a tyrannical government. Unfortunately, this means we need to arm ourselves with military grade weapons as these are the types of arms we would have to protect ourselves from. And, this is not an obsession -- it's passionate act of patriotism to discuss and preserve our God given and unalienable rights.


The data I'm reading shows the highest crime rates occur where there *is* gun control. Would you please share the information you are reading with us?

Here's the information I'm reading:

While the United States is victimized by embarrassing episodes of criminal degradation, the twentieth-century European experience suggests that tyrannical governments kill far more than private criminals. In 1933, the Nazis seized power via massive search-and-seizure operations for firearms against "Communists," i.e., all political opponents. In 1938, in preparation for and during the Night of the Broken Glass, they disarmed the Jews. And when the Nazis occupied Europe in 1939-41, they proclaimed the death penalty for any person who failed to surrender all firearms within 24 hours.

There may be various reasons why the Nazis did not invade Switzerland, but one of those reasons is that every Swiss man had a rifle at home. The Nazi invasion plans themselves state that, because of the Swiss gun ownership and shooting skills, that country would be difficult to conquer and occupy. The European countries occupied by the Nazis usually had strict gun controls before the war, and their registration lists facilitated confiscation of firearms and, in many cases, execution of their owners.

By being able to keep out of both world wars in part through the dissuasive factor of an armed populace, Switzerland demonstrates that possession of firearms by civilians may help prevent large numbers of deaths and even genocide. The Holocaust never came to Switzerland, the Jewish population of which was armed just like their fellow citizens. In the rest of Europe, what if there had been not just one, but two, three, many Warsaw Ghetto Uprisings?

Traditionally, the Swiss Cantons had few firearm regulations. The first federal gun control law ever to be enacted became valid in 1999. Carrying of machineguns, but not possession thereof, is prohibited. Semiauto conversions of military machineguns may be bought with a permit, except that the retiring soldier needs no permit. Purchase of some types of firearms from a commercial dealer requires a permit, but private sales do not. Repeating rifles, both military and hunting, are exempt. Carrying a loaded weapon requires a permit. Surplus assault rifles may be purchased by any Swiss citizen from the Military Department, which has 200,000 for sale.

The bottom line is one of attitude. Populations with training in civic virtue, though armed, generally do not experience sensational massacres or high crime rates. Switzerland fits this mold. But the United States does not. As H. Rap Brown declared in the 1960s, "Violence is as American as apple pie."

http://www.stephenhalbrook.com/articles ... swiss.html

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"The individual is handicapped by coming face to face with a Conspiracy so monstrous he cannot believe it exists. The American mind simply has not come to a realization of the evil which has been introduced into our midst." J. Edgar Hoover

In Switzerland, we also have shootings with army rifles. Usually it's men killing their whole families. The discussion has been going for years now in Switzerland and there's a strong force wanting the rifles to be kept in the armory.

But you are right with what you wrote: it's difficult to overtake a country when everybody has his rifle in the cupboard. But that has a military context. Nobody would want a private person to have a private hand-gun or semi-automatic. This has to be strictly limited to soldiers - and in Switzerland, every man has to join the army. We don't have a professional army, we have a militia.

Cheers

David

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"Humans think they are smarter than dolphins because we build cars and buildings and start wars etc...and all that dolphins do is swim in the water, eat fish and play around. Dolphins believe that they are smarter for exactly the same reasons."

It is our God given and unalienable right to bear arms within The United States of America. It is not a privilege delegated to soldiers.

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"The individual is handicapped by coming face to face with a Conspiracy so monstrous he cannot believe it exists. The American mind simply has not come to a realization of the evil which has been introduced into our midst." J. Edgar Hoover

Yes, and that's the difference to Switzerland and that's the reason why your comparison falls flat totally. The justification for arms at home can only be derived from military purposes. And I think that's the spirit behind the 2nd amendment.

"“A well regulated Militia being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms shall not be infringed.”

It says "Militia", it doesn't say everybody and his brother.


Cheers

David

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"Humans think they are smarter than dolphins because we build cars and buildings and start wars etc...and all that dolphins do is swim in the water, eat fish and play around. Dolphins believe that they are smarter for exactly the same reasons."

ummm...David...you've made my argument:

It's "the right of the people to keep and bear arms" and this right "shall not be infringed." ...end of story!

Any effort to restrict gun access within The United States of America equates tyranny under our constitution David! The intentions of our forefathers were clear:

"I ask, sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people...To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them." -George Mason, during Virginia's ratification convention, 1788

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government."
-Thomas Jefferson, Proposed Virginia Constitution, 1776, Jefferson Papers 344

"The said Constitution shall never be construed to authorize Congress to infringe the just liberty of the press, or the rights of conscience; or to prevent the people of the United States, who are peaceable citizens, from keeping their own arms..." Samuel Adams

...even Gandhi knew the importance of the right to bear arms:

"Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look upon the act of depriving a whole nation of arms, as the blackest." -- Mahatma Gandhi

...even today's law enforcement know this:

Lt. Lowell Duckett: "Gun control has not worked in D.C. The only people who have guns are criminals. We have the strictest gun laws in the nation and one of the highest murder rates. It's quicker to pull your Smith & Wesson than to dial 911 if you're being robbed." Special Assistant to DC Police Chief; President, Black Police Caucus, The Washington Post, March 22, 1996.

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"The individual is handicapped by coming face to face with a Conspiracy so monstrous he cannot believe it exists. The American mind simply has not come to a realization of the evil which has been introduced into our midst." J. Edgar Hoover

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zsMaN7mdSWs

No, it's not - and you know it. There are long, ongoing and intense discussions about this sentence. Your interpretation is just one, there are others.

I agree with you as long as you say "the people" should remain armed. That's what we do in Switzerland, everyone agrees to that. But there is no need for each and everyone to have a semi-automatic gun in public without questions asked.

Cheers

David

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"Humans think they are smarter than dolphins because we build cars and buildings and start wars etc...and all that dolphins do is swim in the water, eat fish and play around. Dolphins believe that they are smarter for exactly the same reasons."

ummm...yes it is:

"As ratified by the States and authenticated by Thomas Jefferson, Secretary of State:
A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.[8]
The original hand-written copy of the Bill of Rights, approved by the House and Senate, was prepared by scribe William Lambert and resides in the National Archives."

...ummm, regardless of the long and intense discussions about the right to bear arms, it's a right as part of our Bill of Rights -- and that makes the right to bear arms an unalienable right!

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"The individual is handicapped by coming face to face with a Conspiracy so monstrous he cannot believe it exists. The American mind simply has not come to a realization of the evil which has been introduced into our midst." J. Edgar Hoover

he might practice by arguing with a fence post

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That's not the point. yes there are nutters everywhere but undoubtedly they have easy access to firearms in the US. Just look at a list of all the school shootings and gun tragedies down the years that have happened in the US.

Are you seriously trying to tell me if all private ownership of firearms was banned and the policing of that ban strictly enforced that a lot of these gun tragedies would still have occurred?

If all these things were banned and draconian sentencing brought in for anyone caught with one or selling one to a member of the public it would cut this issue massively.

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Luck won't do it and ignorance can't

George Van Eps.

I hate to say it but think it would decrease a little, but not enough to be worth the trouble.
the amount of poisonings, stabbings, bombings and other forms of murder would increase to compensate. and I wouldn't have a defense against someone that pointed an illegally obtained firearm at me or my family.
In a perfect world maybe, but the world will never be that way.

and like many have said, its not the guns. guns have been around for a very long time. these school shootings are a parenting and social issue.
you don't blame a pen for misspelling a word.

and yes these tragedy's would have still occurred. they just would have been done with explosives instead. anyone that does that much planning is pretty damn determined.

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take Switzerland for example, they have nearly as many guns per person as the us yet have a very low gun crime rate. most of what is there are assault rifles to boot.
like i said its a social thing, there is some other underlying issue. DISCIPLINE

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/1566715.stm

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