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Post subject: Re: Is a paint over possible?
Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 2:30 pm
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Ceri, that will help definitely and as you can tell I'm in need of some help, lol. I'm going to ask Twelvebar about a heat gun, I think that he is stateside.

Twelvebar, I was looking at some heat guns and realized I don't know which one is for stripping paint off of wood. May I ask which heat gun you are using?

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Post subject: Re: Is a paint over possible?
Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 6:23 pm
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It's the 1200 watt dual temperature one. there has to be a newer model, as mine's a few years old. You should be able to get a comparable gun for well under $50.00 I think I paid around $20.00 (Canadian,) on sale, at Home Depot.

the key is to keep a few inches from the work, and not hover in one place too long. I have done several bodies this way, but I scorched my bass a little. I got distracted. It will eventually get a solid paint job,so it's no big deal, but it would require a bit more sanding to make it palatable for a sunburst or any other transparent or semi-transparent paint.

I use a couple of different width drywall scrapers like :
Image

I round off the corners, so that I can get under the paint, and push the scraper without gouging the wood. I also sharpen the edge. As you heat the paint you can get the knife under,and if you are patient and careful you can heat the paint just ahead of the blade, and it will peel off in strips. I always start off on the back, as the starting point is the highest danger of scorching the wood.

Depending on that the undercoat is, you might or might not get to bare wood this way. I use a Ryobi "Random Orbital Sander" after I get the main paint off. You can use it to get whatever is left of the sealer off, and to prep your wood.

The Random Orbital sander is what you want, because the sanding disc not only spins,but it is offset and moves in an ellipse. This means the grit on the sandpaper you attach never travels the same path twice, so it really minimizes (if not outright eliminates,) swirl marks,and also means you don't have to go with the grain.


pay attention, or you may do what I did :(

just a cheap used Mexican Precision Bass. And i wish i could say it was the first body i did, but it was actually the last one I did, which means about the 10th, and the first I damaged in any way. i was talking to my brother, and stopped moving the gun.

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Post subject: Re: Is a paint over possible?
Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 7:24 pm
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Thank you Twelvebar, I was looking at the Ryobi heat guns, I will look at the orbital sander as well. The heat gun had 2 or 3 nozzles, one was flatter and wider than the others. Would that be useful or should I stay with the round ones?
The bass I'm going to work on is a cheap used Korean model, lol, I will post a before pic to show it's battle scars. The thing that I have a hard time understanding is why, the older, more beat up, the better they sound. I will pay attention, I don't want to fry this bass, it is my first time so if I cook a couple of spots, please tell me how to patch them up. I'm going to round the corners on the scrapers. I've got one like you have in the pic, should the other one have a narrower blade?

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Post subject: Re: Is a paint over possible?
Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 7:37 pm
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Yeah, i have 3 of em, one wide like the picture, and a couple narrower. You'll know where you have to switch.

I actually don't attach any of the nozzles on my heat gun, they're still in the wrapper. They focus the heat, and to my mind that's more dangerous as far as overheating.

If you could find something to practice on that would be a good idea. Doesn't have to be anything with poly. something like an old painted cupboard door from the workshop or whatever. So you can get used to gauging the heat.

With a little practice you can tell when the poly is heated enough to remove but not scorch the wood. With different paint you will learn when the wood will scorch.

I start with the high setting, and then switch to the lower, but at first I only used the lower heat, until i got the feel for it. It takes longer, but way more room for error.

I can't stress enough the need for safety glasses, sometimes the poly can pop like popcorn and molten bits will fly at you.

And SBLS make sure you look at the "Random" Orbital Sander, sometimesit's called the Dual Action Orbital Sander.

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Post subject: Re: Is a paint over possible?
Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 7:50 pm
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Twelvebar, I'm looking for something to practice on, that is a good idea too. I'll get a narrower scraper and I've got the safety glasses that look like a scuba mask. I'll go with a lower heat setting until I get used to the process. I'll look at the sanders when I get to home depot and let you know what I find there.

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Post subject: Re: Is a paint over possible?
Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 10:59 pm
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Keep in mind latex paint (and most other non polyurethane/polyester paints,) will come off differently than the paint on your guitar. IMO more messily, and thus a little more difficultly, but at lower temperatures. They will melt and smear more, where the poly paint will lift off in sections.

But what you will be trying to get the feel for is when the wood will scorch.

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Post subject: Re: Is a paint over possible?
Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:05 pm
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Check this out :

http://www.stewmac.com/tsarchive/ts0151.html

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Post subject: Re: Is a paint over possible?
Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 4:02 pm
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Great article Twelvebar! I couldn't get anyone to ride me to home depot today but the president of my high school reunion committee picked me up for a brunch meeting with the committee secretary (our 45th is coming up) and after, he and I went to GC. I ordered pickups and bought strings for the project bass (I'm getting ahead of myself again, lol) even though the tech told me 2 months for the painting to be completed. Hopefully I'll get a ride to home depot soon, I don't want to take a taxi but I suppose I could. Thanks for that link Twelvebar.

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Post subject: Re: Is a paint over possible?
Posted: Sat Feb 25, 2012 4:16 pm
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Ceri wrote:
Solid Body Love Songs wrote:
Ceri, I may have to ask for some pic's Bro.

Hi again SBLS. No probs. I have a polyester covered Tele body I've been meaning to strip so I'll see if I can get round to that sometime next week and post some pics for you. I'll be doing it by the heat gun technique, but I have no disagreement with the other methods people have suggested here. All good, different routes to the same end.

BTW: I absolutely understand your guy not wanting to put anything but nitro through his spray guns. I have a feeling you are in the hands of someone who knows what he's doing there, so that's fine.

I think we're all singing from the same song sheet on this thread, so between us we'll get that bod prepped and ready for your fella to paint. Neat! 8)

Cheers - C

" I have a polyester covered Tele body I've been meaning to strip so I'll see if I can get round to that sometime next week and post some pics for you." That will be great Ceri!

Ceri, here is the tech's link:
http://kurtwilsonguitars.com/

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Post subject: Re: Is a paint over possible?
Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 5:40 pm
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SBLS wrote:
Ceri wrote:
I have a polyester covered Tele body I've been meaning to strip so I'll see if I can get round to that sometime next week and post some pics for you.

That will be great Ceri!

Hi SBLS: sorry it's taken me so long to get round to this - things to do, people to see, yadda yadda.

Anyhow. The following took me almost exactly an hour, just like Twelvebar said. In fact, 12B and everyone else have covered it all in such good detail I'm not sure there's much to add. Except pictures. So here we go.

This is a Tele type body I bagged on Ebay for next to nothing. Which was the right price because the most casual glance tells us it's a copy, not a real Fender. That's fine, it means it is ideal for some major Ceri-modding mayhem later on:

Image

For stripping any kind of guitar finish I like the heat gun method we've been discussing. This is a bog standard cheapo decorator's heat gun, around $20 from any hardware store:

Image

And regular decorator's scrapers are exactly right too. The one in the middle is especially good because you use it on the pull stroke, which seems to work well for guitar paint. On the right is an ordinary smallish chisel, which can be handy for getting into pickup cavities and such like:

Image

The type of scraper on the left also works well. Like 12B said, it is good to have the corners rounded off a little so as not to scratch into the wood, but bringing the front edge to a not very sharp point also helps to work in close beneath the paint:

Image

I think it is good to start on the sides of the guitar, because the paint on the front and back will protect those parts from the gun while you work on the edges. I'm holding the body in this crappy workmate a builder left behind years ago - good for stuff like this where you don't want to damage a better piece of kit. The blanket down below is just in case the guitar falls, to help prevent dents:

Image

The paint turns out to be thinner on this guitar than on a normal Fender polyester finish. What's more, it quickly becomes clear this isn't the first time it has been heat stripped. You can see there are scorch marks beneath the finish here from someone else's paint removal efforts. No wonder it was so cheap on Ebay - this body has had several lives already. Hopefully your Fender body will look better than this as its clothes come off:

Image

I do the fiddly bits in the cutaways first, using the blade of the scraper to protect the already bare wood from the heat of the gun:

Image

And then on around the rest of the sides:

Image

You can see that beneath the black paint there is another layer of primer of some sort. It is a little tougher than the top coat, but comes off perfectly easily:

Image

Very soon we have the sides fully stripped. Don't worry about the odd little bit left behind. That will come off very quickly with sand paper later on:

Image

Next it is good to do the cavities, because again the paint on the flat surfaces will protect them from scorching while you're working on the detail:

Image

Here you can see where the paint on the front has blistered with the heat but protected the wood beneath while I was working in the pickup cavity:

Image

Next, on to the easy bit; the flat front and back. Here's a little sequence to show how you let the heat of the gun start bubbling the paint and then as soon as it begins to lift you have at it immediately with the scraper:

Image

(I was photographing this on my own with one hand while paint stripping with the other, so I hope you'll forgive the clumsiness of that demo.)

A good tip around the edges is to have the gun pointing outwards from the middle so that surplus heat fires off into space rather than scorching the already stripped sides:

Image

You soon get a rhythm going with the gun and scraper and keep the whole thing moving steady along. It took me about five minutes each to do the front and back:

Image

And about another five minutes with some P80 sand paper to get rid of the previous guy's burn marks in the last stage of that sequence.

(BTW, it was getting dark by the end of that sequence. Why do I always find myself racing to do these things as the sun goes down? D'oh!)

Next step would be to sand the whole thing clean and smooth all over with P80 paper. Then move on in stages through P120, P180, P240 and finally P320. It is tempting to jump straight from the course to the smooth paper but missing out the steps in between actually just makes the whole job take longer. Each grade of paper quickly removes the scratches made by the previous one. Progressing through the grades is the fastest way of getting the job done.

I'd say about an hour for stripping the paint and another hour or more to prep sand it ready for the new finish.

And there ya go! Easy-peasy.

Good luck - C

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Post subject: Re: Is a paint over possible?
Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 5:48 pm
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Ceri now you gotta do another build thread.


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Post subject: Re: Is a paint over possible?
Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 5:51 pm
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tbazzone wrote:
Ceri now you gotta do another build thread.

Hi tbazzone: it's in the pipeline. Strangely, the next one does not involve that Tele body. That's for later. Stay tooned...

Cheers - C

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Post subject: Re: Is a paint over possible?
Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 6:43 pm
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Ceri, thank you Bro, the step by step pic's help's me to feel less nervous about taking this on. Now I must get a couple of before pic's up and then start the process.
Cheers, and lots of love,
SBLS

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Post subject: Re: Is a paint over possible?
Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2012 10:01 pm
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So the bass in my pic has a top loading bridge. Now that it is naked, my brain keeps suggesting I turn it into a 'through body' bridge. I blame Ceri!!

No real reason to do it, but the only reason not to, would be destroying it.

Well, one reason to do it, would be to make and try a painfully obvious seeming jig to do the job.

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Post subject: Re: Is a paint over possible?
Posted: Fri Mar 02, 2012 9:15 am
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Twelvebar wrote:
So the bass in my pic has a top loading bridge. Now that it is naked, my brain keeps suggesting I turn it into a 'through body' bridge. I blame Ceri!!

:D I happily accept that blame, Twelvebar - on condition you share any solutions you come up with. Nothing looks crappier than the back of a through-body with string ferrules that are nearly but not quite perfectly positioned. However, drilling those compound holes dead on ain't so easy. Obviously a jig helps, but making the jig accurately is a task in its own right. If anyone can come up with useful ideas on the subject it's you. Go to, fella!

By the way, Stew-Mac sell some handy jigs for drilling peg holes, such as this:

http://www.stewmac.com/shop/Tuners/Tune ... _Jigs.html

And it has always surprised me they don't do something similar for string ferrule positioning, which is significantly harder than tuner holes. But they don't. Odd.

Cheers - C

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