Have fun guitar hunting. Will like to see the result.

On a similar note, I tried out the yamaha ncx700, ntx700 and ntx 900 the other day. They were pretty much the only classical guitars i could find within half an hour of driving. They were really nice, the ntx's a bit thinner (i know they're not really classicals, and won't buy one, it was just for comparison), the ncx had a nice projection to it. Anyone got anything to say about these guitars?

So yeah, im guitar hunting too. will keep you updated.

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"reach for the sky and aim for the moon, for if you miss you will end up among the stars"

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I have played a guitar from the Yamaha NT700 range and was very impressed by it. Much of the quality of the 1200 range but for considerably less money. I recall Guitarist magazine thought highly of them as well - the reviewer had acquired his own NT700 based on his reviewing experience.

My big news today is that I've just bought home the more expensive of the 2 Raimundo guitars I've been thinking about for the last few days. I part exchanged my Rodriguez model A and got a fair price I could live with. My Raimundo 138 has a cedar top, ebony fretboard and solid walnut back and sides. It's a great sound - halfway between rosewood and mahogany. I can't believe how loud it is - 30% more than the Rodriguez - and how many different tonal voices are in there. It's a little bit 'Shouty' at the moment and has to be approached with caution(!), but will soften a little as the cedar top eases up and relaxes.

Can't believe I got to 50+ before owning an all solid wood classical guitar! Sad to say goodbye my old Rodriguez girl, but in truth, I'd started saying goodbye the moment I started auditioning the Raimundos. It will be a good quality student guitar for someone - I hope they look after her..

I know pics of new guitars have to be supplied! Will post one later.

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Here's my new Raimundo:

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Thats really nice, it has a very nice grain on the wood. The fretboard looks really good too. Thanks for sharing. When it's settled down, perhaps we could hear it? It's never fun getting rid of a guitar though!

I have a question for you. I have been doing some research, and the yamaha NCX700 has a solid spruce top, with nato back and sides.

Now firstly, is a spruce top a good choice? Or is there a different wood that is better, around a similar price? I would try them out, but there aren't many classical shops around to be honest.

And secondly, what is nato? Is it another type of wood, or is it just another name for laminated wood. Or is it better than normal laminated wood, but not solid?

I am also considering these three guitars:

http://www.londonguitarstudio.com/estev ... ve-guitars

http://www.londonguitarstudio.com/alham ... ra-guitars

http://www.londonguitarstudio.com/alham ... ra-guitars

Does anyone know what Ovengkol wood is? and the back of the esteve is Special laminated Ovengkol-what is special about this? Indian rosewood seems a popular fingerboard option-could you explain its merits and disadvantages too?

The two alhambras have identical pictures, I'm not sure what the difference between the CW and the CT is. They have the same specifications too-electrics and everything. If anyone has any idea what the difference between these two is, then that would be great.

Thanks for the help, I don't know that much about classicals

_________________
"reach for the sky and aim for the moon, for if you miss you will end up among the stars"

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I like the look of those guitars you're contemplating - never played one though. "Alhambra" guitars have a good reputation.

Nato wood is often referred to as Eastern Mahogany, and is being seen more and more often on instruments from the Middle and Far East. It shares many of the characteristics of traditional mahogany. Ovangkol is African in origin and is said to be tonally similar to rosewood. I wouldn't be put off by the use of these tone woods - and we can expect to see them more and more often as guitar makers run out of the traditional tonewoods which are becoming unavailable and prohibitively expensive. As you may know, Brazillian Rosewood is virtually no longer an option for luthiers. It's use is now very tightly controlled and licensed because of it's increasing scarcity.

Whatever the tonewood, it's solid equivalent is much more desireable in a guitar than the same wood laminated, ie compressed thin sheets of timber heated and pressed together to make a useable piece. Solid wood gives you more volume and tone. For instance, my Rodriguez guitar had a solid top - which was good - but the back and sides were laminated (rosewood). One of the reasons why my new guitar is so much louder -more resonance and more push. I'm not saying laminated is bad, but solid wood will always be better - be it any of the traditional tone woods, or the newer timbers like Nato and Ovangkol..

As for classical guitar tops, Spruce or Cedar are usually the only 2 options, although I understand some steel string acoustics are now made with solid mahogany tops. Very generally speaking (and it is a big generalisation) - Spruce is harder and brighter and therefore a little more detailed in tone, whilst Cedar is softer warmer and more soulfull. And just as you can have laminated backs and sides on some guitars, you can also have laminated wood tops. But again, solid is better than laminate. And I also think cedar topped guitars happen to smell marvellous!. Yellow coloured classical tops are Spruce, and the more red-orangey tops are Cedar.

If you think the grain on top of my Raimundo looks good, you should see the back! 2 perfectly book-matched halves of slightly flamed solid walnut - lovely.

Good luck with the shopping..

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So where it says Nato, it is a solid wood? The yamaha has all solid woods? because when I tried it, it had a tag saying solid top, but it didn't say solid back and sides too. Thats confusing... But thanks for explaining it to me, it does make a lot of sense.

Did many classicals use to come with rosewood backs/sides/tops? Do they sound good like that?

thank you very much

_________________
"reach for the sky and aim for the moon, for if you miss you will end up among the stars"

Zoom MS50G
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2011 standard strat
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You'd have to check the individual guitar specs very carefully. But sometimes they can be less informative about backs and sides unfortunately. Often they dont specify solid or laminated. Tops are a different matter and are usually specified in detail.

I don't actually know if Ovangkol or Nato can be laminated into larger pieces like the traditional tonewoods (Rosewood, Mahogany etc), but I don't see why not..

For many people even to this day, say "classical guitar" to them and they'll respond: Solid wood rosewood back and sides, spruce/cedar solid wood top and ebony fingerboard. It's just very traditional. And they kept making them like that simply because they did sound so good.

But in my opinion, laminated or solid wood backs and sides are less critical with electro classicals, because you have the electrical pickup and pre-amp systems to make up for any lack of power or tone in the wood. But even for electros, solid wood tops are still seen as highly desirable/essential..

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Thanks very much for that. It's a confusing world to start with, but I understand a lot of these things now.

I will be going to check out these guitars soon, so will keep you posted.

And congrats on your new Raimundo!

_________________
"reach for the sky and aim for the moon, for if you miss you will end up among the stars"

Zoom MS50G
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2011 standard strat
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Thanks Teledeluxe..

Did a little research for you. The NTX 700 and the NCX700 Yamahas have solid spruce tops, but the back and sides are laminated (not solid) Nato. The 900 series also has laminated (maple) back and sides and the 1200 has solid Rosewood back and sides.

When you're looking at the Specs of any classical/acoustic/electro etc, assume that back and sides are laminated tone woods unless the spec sheet actually uses the word SOLID..

Hope that helps, Adey.

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OK, that helps a lot. I can see now that the esteve could be very good value for money and sound very good, because of the solid sides and top. And special laminated back, but I will ask about that at the shop... The yamaha does play very nicely, and have a good projection, but I haven't been able to try the others yet.

Thanks again

_________________
"reach for the sky and aim for the moon, for if you miss you will end up among the stars"

Zoom MS50G
72 tele dlx RI
2011 standard strat
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Taylor Big Baby

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Hadn't noticed (until I was reading this month's Guitarist magazine) that Fender are making a range of 'Classical' style guitars (including a cut-away elctro model - CN240SCE for under £300.00). I don't know anything about them other that what's in the specs. I counted one all solid wood instrument which is incredibly cheap. Maybe you already knew about them? I certainly didn't.

Check out the CN range here in the acoustic guitar products section. I'd be interested to try one just to see how close Fender have got to making a good sounding, playable nylon strung guitar (electro or otherwise). Though judging by the prices, I suspect cheap and cheerful is the name of the game.


I'm working on 2 Eric Satie pieces at the moment, both are piano pieces arranged for the guitar. Just sorted out the haunting and enigmatic "Gnossienne no 1" to performance standard, and now starting work on the "Gymnopedie no 1" that most people will know..

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Funnily enough, I was also reading this months Guitarist magazine, and happened to see the article on the CN. Apparently, it is not really a classical, more a nylon strung guitar aimed at steel string and electric players. This means that the string spacing is apparently quite small, and the guitar feels more like a steel strung. Apparently classical players would find the neck a bit cramped.

As enticing as the amount of solid wood may be, I'm not sure it's really what I'm looking for.

And I'm hoping to spend a bit more too, to get into the next, sort of band of quality. I think you got it with the cheep and cheerful.

I would like to hear one of your peices-Gnossienne no 1 or Gymnopedie no 1, at some time. Perhaps next time you perform or something, you could record it? I would be interested to see where I am, as a student, compared to a performer.

Thanks for the heads-up.

_________________
"reach for the sky and aim for the moon, for if you miss you will end up among the stars"

Zoom MS50G
72 tele dlx RI
2011 standard strat
Blackstar HT-5R
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http://www.youtube.com/user/Almungo/videos?flow=grid&view=0

As a student, you're performing all the time - to your teacher, to your examiners, to your family..

I've been looking for some local guitar societies/clubs etc in my local district, so I can measure my own playing against some other players. And maybe to play a few duets/trios. But no luck so far. Maybe this is something you might like to consider..

I certainly hope I haven't misrepresented myself as a virtuoso concert guitarist! My playing is only just getting back upto scratch, after a 20 year layoff playing mainly keyboards and electrics. In all that time, my classical playing had maybe half an hour a week in a vain attempt to keep my technique in some sort of shape. It's only for the last 5 months or so I've been doing an hour a day of properly structured practise. I'm back to being about 90% of the player I was.. I might even take some advanced tuition to help iron out one or two gliches I've identified in my right hand playing..

Anyway, I will record the Eric Satie "Gnossiennne 1" piece in the next month or so and post it here for you, and any others who are interested in this style of playing. I'd also like to hear how my new Raimundo classical guitar records.

Thanks for your interest TD, and for helping me keep this thread going..

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I have this same problem with practice-between school, band practice and homework-and theres a lot of that-I normally manage to find 30mins a day, but not everyday, as some days I have other things I have to go to. It's annoying, because I hear about people on here who can practice for 3 hours a day. Still, I seem to be improving, so I must be doing something right And after that, I have to try and find some time for electric guitar. That's even worse-sometimes I go a week without playing at home, although there is band and music at school.

_________________
"reach for the sky and aim for the moon, for if you miss you will end up among the stars"

Zoom MS50G
72 tele dlx RI
2011 standard strat
Blackstar HT-5R
Taylor Big Baby

http://www.youtube.com/user/Almungo/videos?flow=grid&view=0

Practise. The only way to get good on ANY instrument. As I've said to one or two people I've taught informally, half an hour every day is better than just 7 hours on a saturday. It's all about generating a wave of momentum in your playing so that it slowly becomes unstoppable.

Good luck finding the time.

I remember being a schoolboy, regularly playing for 3 to 4 hours every day. My school work suffered as a result..

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