We played a show with Barrington Levy last week and the promoter paid us $0.

I get a call at about 6:30pm the day of the show:
"The promoter wants to know what kind of amps you have."
Why?
"They don't have any gear with them, they need to borrow your amps."
You mean, they need to RENT a backline, right?
"uh, yea."

Our band provided Barrington Levy's band 2-guitar amps, 2-keyboards, a bass amp, and drum set.

***We didn't used to charge for a backline. Used to be, we would just let people use our gear. But things were getting broken sometimes chords or guitar stands etc.. stolen. So who was left to pay that bill? Touring bands would be long gone by that time.

I was already bummed because we had to be in Bakersfield the next day to play a show. I just wanted to play our set and get out of there. Now I had to stay until the whole show was over.

After our set which already started late (we were scheduled to play at 11pm, we went on at 1am), Barrington Levy's guitar player throws a FIT and says he's leaving. Doesn't want to play the show. The band fights with each other on stage for over an hour. They had some kind of internal spat going on, and the guitar player kept shouting " HE ASSAULTED MY FACE MAN!!" referring to their Bass player.

We didn't get out of there til 3:30 am, and I had to get up at 7am to get to Bakersfield. Wasn't happy at all.

When we got back to Vegas, I asked one of my other bandmembers:
"where's the money for the backline?"
The promoter never paid us.
"Did he pay us anything at all?"
Nope..

I get in contact with the promoter:
"What's up dude, did you pay our band anything at all?"

Here was his response:
"talked to Ryan on the phone last night. The whole weekend lost around 5 grand. I dont have anything I can give you guys for the show, but I can give you guys a $100 guarantee (plus 60% of the door after 24 paid) for your show on the 23rd at Bunkhouse. "

What show on the 23rd??? I never even knew about another show on the 23rd. Neither did Ryan. I guess our keyboard player was making a deal with the promoter to do another show after not getting paid for this one.

Never have I wanted to reach through a computer screen and start choking people more than after reading this.

So his solution is to have us play ANOTHER show for him and he'll pay us for that one???

Where do these people come from?? These wannabe promoters who have no money to begin with. Just kids from other bands thinking they can hold shows, This kid didn't have $5,000 at one time in his whole life. They just hope and pray on the door money (which was mainly all of our fans to begin with).

According to our keyboard player, this guy paid Barrington Levy $6,000, and paid ALL THREE local openers $0... And even he feels like we should just be glad we got to play with Barrington Levy. I've got 2-words to say to that, and I think you all know what those 2-words are.

No money for the backline, no money for our performance (along with 2-other bands), and he wants us to play (and promote) another show for him.

Man.. Some people have a lot of nerve.

_________________

HaleAmano- House Of Sharks (Now On iTunes)
http://www.reverbnation.com/haleamano
http://www.haleamano.com

The AC-DC song Big Balls comes to mind.

_________________
'65 Strat,65 Mustang,65 Jaguar,4 more Strats,3 vintage Vox guitars,5 Vox amps,'69 Bassman with a '68 2-15 Bassman cab,36 guitars total-15asst'd amps total,2 vintage '60s Hammond organs & a myriad of effects-with a few rare vintage ones.

Chalk it up to "live and learn" - - it comes with the territory...learn who you can trust and who you can't. It's a crazy biz!

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Being able to play and enjoy music is a gift that's often taken for granted.

Don't leave home without it!

It's worth keeping your temper and agreeing to being abused (cos thats what it is) on the promise of a high profile gig (with good pay regardless of on door takings) when one arises.

I've done that a couple of times. To be honest, it's still sour grapes but atleast you salvage something from it.

When you're playing leftfield stuff a lot of this rubbish happens. No money in, no money out.

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No no and no

+1!

Or Bruce Cockburn's "If I Had A Rocket Launcher".



Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY

I know dude.. It sucks. I do understand what you're saying, we've done it before ourselves. But at least in those cases, it was known the we were playing them under the term of "exposure", and expected it.

Just in this case, the guy wasn't honest with us up front. Of course, promoters typically don't tell us what deals are made behind the scenes. Ask us if we'll play a free show, and we'll consider it as such, and agree to it or pass.

After the fact, our keyboard player tells us that Barrington Levy wanted $10,000+lodging, and had in the contract that a backline was to be provided (including a Fender Twin Reverb, and 4 specific keyboards that nobody within the other bands had).

The promoter agreed to the terms without having a clue where to get this stuff. And on top of that chose a venue that only holds 200 people. The $10,000 was for 2- back to back nights. But even then, if he charges $25 per ticket, he had to fill the venue to capacity both nights JUST to make the $10,000 not including the lodging. Plus he had agreements to pay the other bands percentages of the door and agreed to pay us for the backline (day of show). No matter how you look at it, it doesn't add up.

It's obvious to me, that by looking at all of this, the promoter knew that we (and the other bands) wouldn't get jack for this show, lied to us, and dragged us all under the bus regardless.

That kind of stuff makes me want to kick people in the teeth.

_________________

HaleAmano- House Of Sharks (Now On iTunes)
http://www.reverbnation.com/haleamano
http://www.haleamano.com

I used to be a carpenter and any tradesman will tell you NEVER lend your tools to anyone, unless you trust them more than your brother, maybe not even then. Even today there's only one contractor I will lend my tools to, and he can even borrow them without asking. But nobody, NOBODY else.

The promoter fooled you once. Shame on him. If he gets you again, it's your own d*** fault.

shredd,
WTF? you should know better bro. contracts contracts contracts.
get'em signed bro. lesson learned. dont want to hear this kind of BS happening to you again. your band works to hard to be screwed and taken advantage of. CYA twice bro.
i also agree, NEVER ever loan your gear out to anybody. those are your tools of the trade. sure shiot happens and it does to everybody, but when something like this happens, its wear on your gear, and if it gets broke, in the end your the one thats out.
get things in writing bro.
so this guy got paid big bucks and didnt have his own gear? what kind of crap is that?
i also would have a good talkin to with that keyboard player. ya get screwed and hes over there making friends and setting up another date? are you kidding me?
oh man the things i want to say about that but cant.
dude, just set down and write you out a solid contract. its got to be worded as a win/win for you and the folks that hire you. leave things blank in the agreed upon money areas. (to be filled in when signed by both parties)
sometimes you want to be flexable and use a sliding scale with that. some places it might be worth it to do a gig for a little less if the conditions are right and in your favor ya know? im sorry to hear that this happened to you guys. there are thieves out there waiting to take advantage of you every time you turn around. CYA brother man.
if you dont nobody else will.

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63supro
"The good thing is in a club situation, most of the patrons are trashed and really can't tell the difference."

Right. I do agree with the gear situation to some degree. I learned my lesson letting people use my HRDV. Even people in pro bands will just unplug and drop the cable on the floor without switching to standby first. POP!! After a few times of that, goodbye tubes. Guess who was left footing that bill?

They wanted to use my HRDV as well, and I wouldn't do it. I'll only backline a SS amp. (Not to mention, the venue was too small for that). I usually want something for it though. It's hard for me to say no altogether considering that people are usually willing to backline amps for us when we need it. I'll give someone money out of my own pocket for backlining me if they want me to.

We have a good relationship with Hawaiian bands. When they come here, we'll typically help backline for them. When we go there, they'll help us out. It cuts a lot of the costs down. You know... Taking an amp on a plane and all. Our Hawaiian tour consisted of 6 flights.

_________________

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http://www.reverbnation.com/haleamano
http://www.haleamano.com

Believe me brother, I'm working on that as I'm sitting here. You know, a brunt of our shows have been contractual Casino shows that we sign. I'm looking at some very good solid stuff right now. As far as Barrington Levy not having his gear and getting paid big dollars, that WAS in his initial contract with the promoter. It's up to the promoter to accept those terms or pass. And yes, he passed it on to us on a verbal agreement to save his own $@!.

But instead of even being half a stand-up guy and saying, "I'll hold a few more events and pay you guys later", he wants us to play more shows for him. We're one of the biggest draws in Vegas. Don't bite the hand that feeds you then.

_________________

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http://www.reverbnation.com/haleamano
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if you have a working relationship like that thats fine shredd. its good to have this
and its a win/win ya know. but if its some joe bozo........ not a good idea especially
if its to cover another guys agreement. again contract it and damages before hand if you want to be involved in that.

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63supro
"The good thing is in a club situation, most of the patrons are trashed and really can't tell the difference."

Shred, that truly does suck, and I think we all know the "two words" you are thinking of.

But If i may give you three little words that would have helped here and will the next time.

"Cash In Advance"

You want to use my equipment, you need to cough up the cash first.

i do not know if this "Dude" has allot of nerve, but i know if i were you and this happened to me, he would have a two broken legs.

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Marriage is like playing cards...

At first all you want are Hearts and Diamonds.

But in the end, all you really want is a Club and a Spade.

exactly. if he was standup enough he would admit he screwed up and maybe book you 3 more times and pay ya a little extra each time to cover his faults.
thats what he should do. this way it evens out in the end for everybody.

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63supro
"The good thing is in a club situation, most of the patrons are trashed and really can't tell the difference."

would make a great add for snapon prybars wouldnt it? lol

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63supro
"The good thing is in a club situation, most of the patrons are trashed and really can't tell the difference."

Well, in a sense, that's what he's trying to propose here as a solution. There are problems with that though.

In the message he sent me, he's proposing $100 guarantee, and 60% of the door. But that's only $100 guarantee. The rest of the money would be 60% of what we promote ourselves to get our fans there. So he's asking us to work for him/his own gain, again. He's not saying where the other 40% is going. We've held our own shows at that venue, and I already know that they give the promoter 100% of the door.

What about the other bands that got screwed that night? You know, they are dear friends of ours as well. If he's proposing that he'll pay us 60%, what would be the cut for them? 20% and 20%? 15-15 and 10 for him? I wouldn't dare do that to the other bands involved either. They're like family to us. We played with one of them last night.

Is he making the same proposal to the other bands? This goes deeper than just us. It's spanning 3-bands.

I have a feeling about what's gonna happen here. He's never going to pay us, and we just aren't going to play anymore shows for him. His guarantee is too small. He's crap-shooting the door money and not taking responsibility if the draw fails. He doesn't have the pull we have. We can make our own money faster than he could ever pay what he owes us. Why have a middle-man at all at this point?

I guess my main point to all of this is, I can't believe the nerve of some people. To blindly make agreements to unrealistic situations, lie to people, screw everyone involved, and turn around and say "Sorry, you all failed with me, but I can book more shows for YOU to play." Basically trying to use us to pay his own debt back and still make himself look good.

This is the con-game of promoters with nothing to lose. He has no money to begin with.

_________________

HaleAmano- House Of Sharks (Now On iTunes)
http://www.reverbnation.com/haleamano
http://www.haleamano.com