it may not be the whole reason or economy suck but i promise you this, there is no light at the end of the tunnel because of it. we cant even see the end of the tunnel.
we wont begin to bounce back until we draw our troops home.

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63supro
"The good thing is in a club situation, most of the patrons are trashed and really can't tell the difference."

That's what seems to be the case. All previous deals are Null and Void, and who are they going to have to bargain with next. This whole situation in the middle east has been a long time coming.



If it's broken, Fender has a great 5 year warranty.[/quote]

Hmm, nice one all Ceri you are a legend! very informative- just what I needed. News coverage in my area is clouded by earthquakes both in Japan and here- all I am seeing is missles and planes otherwise I assume there would be more coverage in your part of the world.

BBC have the best coverage but comes on at 1am in the morning after network closure..


Anyhooo- Thanks everyone for keeping the discussion above the table Much appreciated

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I want to have a one on one talk with any one that wants to send American service men and women into harms way. After that conversation lets see what happens.

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you can save the world with your guitar one love song at a time it's just better, more fun, easier with a fender solid body electric guitar or electric bass guitar.

From what I have just seen, it seems America is taking a back seat in this, yet offering support to the coalition. I assume they mean France, Italy and UK

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sbls, thats what the military does bro.

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63supro
"The good thing is in a club situation, most of the patrons are trashed and really can't tell the difference."

We're looking at historically French interests here. Let's hope they fare better than they did a Dien Bien Phu, so that we don't have to find ourselves immersed in one of those 'shores of Tripoli' deals again.

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"Another day in paradise!"

France never had any historical interest in Lybia. The British ruled Lybia for a while.

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http://www.guitarmotel.com

France was never in Libya.

They have some economic connection, about 6% of Libya's economy (oil) comes through exports to France. And Sarkozy signed a contract for building a nuclear power plant in 2007. But I think this was never built.

Cheers

David

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"Humans think they are smarter than dolphins because we build cars and buildings and start wars etc...and all that dolphins do is swim in the water, eat fish and play around. Dolphins believe that they are smarter for exactly the same reasons."

My error. It was Italy.

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"Another day in paradise!"

The "good guys" (I use that term liberally) of the US, EU and UN have tolerated/ignored Ghadafi because they feel they can marginalize and contain him, as well as use what resources he controls. Likewise for the Saudi government, Hugo Chavez, Iran's leadership, etc.

They ignore China's abuses because they can't contain or marginalize them, and they hope to get a piece of that's country's ever-growing "pie".

The situations in Zimbabwe, Rwanda and (formerly) Yugoslavia were all ignored for the same reason: those countries don't have enough oil to make it worth their while.

It was just a movie, but an exchange between Felix Leiter and his boss at the CIA (from "Quantum of Solace") rings true:

Felix Leiter: You know who Greene is and you want to put us in bed with him?
Gregg Beam: Yeah, you're right. We should just deal with nice people.

Although this situation will eventually be changed--not fixed, not finished, just "changed"--the political scene of the world will always be in a state of flux and upheaval. Several thousand years ago, we were warned:
"It does not belong to man who is walking to direct his step." --Jeremiah 10:23 (NWT)

If a single individual cannot even make a right decision on his own (without some type of spiritual guidance), how can the problems (mostly man-made) of the world be adequately addressed?

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Good Vibes To Y'all!



Screamin' Armadillos
Texas Roadhouse Music
Guitar/Slide Guitar/Harp/Vocals

dude thats so on point its scary.

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63supro
"The good thing is in a club situation, most of the patrons are trashed and really can't tell the difference."

I would say you might want to look back in history, before WW-II which was an extension of WW-I.
Back to the days of the Kaiser and the rest of the euro Monarchy. An interesting footnote was that most of those dynasty's were interrelated by marriage's.
Not much different today.
What then started as a family squabble ( I'm overly simplifying ) evolved into assassinations and a 1st major World War. That Armistice was a mistake as the germans were not only humbled, but humiliated and by the sanctions, plunged into a depression.
A perfect recipe for Hitler and others before him to validate revenge. It must be added that at 1st A Hitler was regarded as a nut case, jailed repeatedly and basically dismissed as a failed artist and crackpot. That was until he aligned himself with a handful of psychopath's and preceded to gain power by eliminating the opposition.
By the time anyone realized the gross mistake, it was too late and we all know the rest.

This situation in Africa and the Middle East could easily expand into a major regional armed conflict, so I am pleased to see some kind of restraint as far as dealing with the problem.
It is not just Gadaffi, it is other's more or less able to ignite the entire region.
So how do you push for human rights reform without inciting chaos

This did not come to fruition yesterday, it has been in the works for quite some time.
If Egypt and Tunisia were the model than perhaps we'll see a much better part of the world with minimal bloodshed. ( That it seems cannot be avoided as long as the leaders of those regimes have no hesitancy about crushing anyone who dares to question and dissent from the status quo..

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"C'est parti mon Kiki "

Gosh, there's some fascinating misinformation flying around on this thread already.

Just for the record, Libya was never part of either the British or French Empires. It was annexed by Italy, from 1911 to 1942. Britain and Germany fought their way back and forth across North Africa in the Second World War between 1940 and 1943. But neither of them was ever the colonial power in Libya.

Italy currently gets 20 percent of its oil and 10 percent of its gas from Libya which, in addition to historical sensitivities, is why this action is so tricky for them. They have made seven air bases available and both British and Danish fighter aircraft have started operating from them in the last 24 hours, saving us both a 3000 mile round trip each mission. But currently Italy is otherwise uninvolved.

This is overwhelmingly a French and British lead action and their aircraft are flying the large majority of missions, though not all. Countries actively accompanying them include, so far: Canada, Denmark, Spain, the USA and shortly Qatar (the first Arab nation to participate).

For those so worried about American involvement: absolutely nobody on this planet wants American boots on soil in Libya. The entire world joins you in shuddering at that thought.

Fret not, it isn't going to happen.


Thank you kindly! No legend, but I do know the Middle East some and keep an interested eye on what goes on there.

Unusually, in addition to factual discussion perhaps I'll offer a quick moral suggestion - just for once.

We absolutely do not have any right to choose other people's governments for them. But when a government is doing terrible brutality to its population and when there is something achievable we can do to stop it, then we should.

That's what's going on right now and so far without the shadow of a doubt a large number of lives have already been saved. Well done us.

Cheers - C

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Ceri--

Although you have been spot-on for this entire thread, on this particular point you underestimate the stupidity of American politicians. All it takes is a small group of policy-makers to persuade some of his brethren that an invasion is in "the best interests of the United States..."

If a politician's backers can make a buck off of this, and that politician has enough power in certain committees/task forces, there could be some terrible repercussions for everyone involved.

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Good Vibes To Y'all!



Screamin' Armadillos
Texas Roadhouse Music
Guitar/Slide Guitar/Harp/Vocals