Do you have it? Do you feel it gives you extra feel for music or is it messy due to the tampered nature of guitar tunning?

I ask this because I wanted to "improve" my ears/brain for listening and playing. I can tell the difference between intervals most of the time. I can't identify the tone just by listening. I am wondering if the "Perfect" pitch can give you something extra can this be learned?

Daniel

I think absolute perfect pitch is quite over rated. I have spent years developing my ears. I don't really need a tuner. I have Strobosoft for my Iphone and TB tuner for my PC. Both measure my versions of notes to be within +/- 4 cents. Not a fat lot wrong with that from a uneducated knuckledragger. Sadly it's of little importance.
The most important thing you can do is to learn to recognise intervals, rather than recognise notes. I dunno about anyone else but when I listen to music, I don't get a flurry of notes passing through my mind. Something I'm quite glad about as I think it would ruin music. Rather I hear a overall key then get a idea of intervals within that key. That must be from near endless excersizes in listening to intervals in the major scale.
It's really not worth the effort in todays world. The internet has made so much information available you don't need it. When writing if something sounds right to you, it's right. Thats what matters.
It's a good thing to have, but not all it's cracked up to be.

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No no and no

The first thing I'll say here is that Perfect Pitch is almost impossible to obtain, very few people have it.

I say this because what most people believe to be "Perfect Pitch" is actually relative pitch. We associate our interval system in relation to the tuning standard for the region we learn / perform in. True perfect pitch would be the ability to distinguish tuning at the hertz level, which very, very few people can do.

Most of he Western orchestral world tunes to A440, most musicians in the west base their tonal abilities around this.

As an example, The Berlin Philharmonic tunes to A445, which completely negates the "perfect pitch" of someone who's spent their life associating with tonality based on A440.

Relative Pitch is useful but interval proficiency is more practical. Being able to associate intervals in relation to what you're hearing will carry you extremely far, especially in the world of improvisational music.

Also don't forget, the better you get at interval relations, the faster you'll be able to transcribe tunes. Figuring out the starting note to a tune doesnt take long, and after that you can learn the entire thing through interval analysis rather than picking out each individual note.

your talking about that course in the guitar mags?
if so, that guy has been around for decades doing this course.
i had a friend take the course. i dont know if this was the key, but his
playing really improved over the next several months.
figuring out songs and riffs became second nature for john.
was it natural talents, the course, both, i dont know, but he sure swore by it though.

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63supro
"The good thing is in a club situation, most of the patrons are trashed and really can't tell the difference."

I was not referring to course in guitar mag, it's just a curiosity.

I can hear the intervals well, but the issue I have is if I am jamming on the song that I am not familiar with and nobody let's me know the key we are in (*in open jams here music just flows from one song to the other and the original song can be written on the spot). I have to visually see the chord or the first note from whoever is leading a jam to figure out where i am or just hunt around the fretboard until I get it.

If I am the jam leader I have a habit to announce the key.

It would be nice if I had that capability to recognize at least the first chord/note without looking at someone's instrument, so I was thinking that training for the absolute pitch is necessary.

Would you guys recommend the actual ear training course to shed, perhaps some light on the current situation or should I keep focusing on the intervals and the things will settle naturally.

Thank you guys for help

First off, if you're in a Gig setting, you shouldn't ever be playing a song you're not familiar with. Its bad for the Audience and its bad for your own personal reputation as a performer. If you're in practice, asking people what key they're playing in is perfectly acceptable, as many non-vocal tunes frequently get transposed to other keys for performance / rehersal purposes.

If its an Open Jam where people are basically improvising non-standard tunes, they should at least have the courtesy to call out the key they're going to be playing in, as you can't expect a Rhythm Section or a Soloist to instantly pick up on what you're doing.

Playing one or two chords doesnt say much about what you're going to be playing, unless you're outlining Tonic / SubDom / Dominant extremely clearly to set the tunes key. Tell the guys at the Jam session to stop being jerks and start announcing keys... or find a new open mic night.



How long have you been playing ? Generally one thing that tends to happen over a period of time while doing proper instrumental study is your body will naturally tend to recognize pitches in relation to where they fall on your instrument.

You'll start to hear sounds and automatically gravitate to that note on your instrument. Past that point you can figure out the key based on either playing a few chords to see if they fit, or run a fast scale and see what notes fall in place.

Most of what you're looking for comes with years of intense study (or many many many years of hobbyist style playing) and requires some knowledge of music theory, and mastery of Major/Minor Scales, Triads, and 7th Chords. Knowing your modal scales wouldn't hurt either.

Honestly, taking a "course" on how to train your ear will help you to understand what you need to do to improve, but its just that, information on how to improve. You can't get better unless you put a lot of effort into what you want to accomplish.

Best thing I ever did for my own ear training was having a friend sit down with their own instrument or a piano and playing follow along. Have them play a note / chord / scale / lick and, without looking at their hands while they're playing, listen and repeat it back to them. Do this for a few weeks and your aural recognition will improve substantially.

killer advice bro.

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63supro
"The good thing is in a club situation, most of the patrons are trashed and really can't tell the difference."

These are very nice guys, but sometimes they get carried away when the "good" thing happens during the jam.



Awesome advice and in a way follow along is what is happening on these open jams, but I get it. The "quiet" version is a great idea.

Thank you sir (sorry, assumption here not too many women on the board)

Well, when the "good" stuff happens is during the tune, not before it. It takes 5 seconds to call out a key before the tune starts. Now.... if they're modulating keys during their playing, *that* is a whole new ballgame and requires them to either a) all play together on a regular basis and know how each other play / think of b) notate a modulation ahead of time. It may also be a case of c) The rhythm section hates the soloist and decides to switch keys on them mid solo.

If they're changing keys mid tune on the fly with no warning, thats something you really don't want to mess with unless you know the guys you're playing with on a personal level (i.e. you are musically involved constantly, not once a week at random jam time) as it requires far more musical knowledge to keep involved with players at that level.

The reason the "quiet" version is infinitely better is that you get the ability to learn your instrument in relation to the other instrument you're playing with. Theres no background noise, no drums pounding in your ear, no crowd, no TVs, ect.

Once you feel comfortable with your own instrument, theres not much you can't accomplish when you're in a jam session, but you have to be confident before you walk in the door. If you second guess yourself while you're playing, its just going to fall apart.

Edit: I saw in your other post on the poll thread that you've been back into playing for about 3 years after an 18 year break (from when you were 12). Most of what you're looking to do are skills practiced by people that have been constantly playing since they were young to the present day.

Just to give you an idea, I've been playing Alto Sax since I was 5.. I started getting serious my freshman year of highschool, practicing about 2-3 hours a day. Once I got to college, I spent 5 years practicing on average 6-10 hours a day in addition to Classes, School-Required Ensembles, Jazz Ensembles, and everything else in my schedule. I mean 6-10 hours of by-myself-in-a-practice-room style playing.

Hundreds of hours of transcribing music by ear onto both paper and through my primary instrument, as well as hours spent peering through Theory textbooks and notes i took in masterclasses with some of the best musicians recording today.

That all got me to where I am now with my ability to play by ear, and some people take longer / less time to accomplish the same thing.

For you though, I'd say that some serious time investment into your basics (Scales Maj/Min / Triads / Maj7/Min7 Chords) would do you an extreme amount of good in what you want to accomplish in regards to Jam sessions.

It really just depends how serious you want to get. A $40 used textbook on music theory can do wonders for you. Theres lots of great material on Scale Patterns, Chords, Jazz Changes, and Jazz Theory that will take your playing to a whole new level if you dedicate the time to it.

Don't confine yourself to stuff specifically for guitar either. Listen to non-guitar artists and try to play back their music. It'll give you great ideas on how to play a melodic line. Get scale pattern and lick books for other instruments and transpose them across all the keys.

Theres a ton of stuff you can do that takes less than 30 minutes a day that will improve your playing far beyond what you ever thought was possible.

The most important thing to remember is repetition, practice the same thing over and over until you get it down pat. Then practice it for 5-10 minutes a day and start working on something new over and over until you get it down. Soon you'll find you've created a 2 hour practice routine without even knowing it, and in 6 months you'll go back and say "Wow..... I didn't think I could play like this!" Even if you don't play for 2 hours a day, you'll have a *massive* pool of stuff you can play when you do get some free time, and figuring out what do work on will be second nature to you.

Double Post - Forums Lagged.

I can't identify a note if I hear it but I can pretty well pick up a guitar and tune it to standard pitch without consulting a tuner and get it in the right key.

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'65 Strat,65 Mustang,65 Jaguar,4 more Strats,3 vintage Vox guitars,5 Vox amps,'69 Bassman with a '68 2-15 Bassman cab,36 guitars total-15asst'd amps total,2 vintage '60s Hammond organs & a myriad of effects-with a few rare vintage ones.

I know a handful of people with what is called perfect pitch, it is a gift for sure. I took a couple of semesters of sight singing and ear training back in the bronze/iron age and it helped then. Unless you are tuning pianos for a living that class or one like it should do you just fine Bro.

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you can save the world with your guitar one love song at a time it's just better, more fun, easier with a fender solid body electric guitar or electric bass guitar.

I don't know if I have what is called "perfect pitch", or not. On a number of occasions when I was lucky enough to immediately catch the tune on radio for instance...I have noticed the songs I hear in my mind are exactly in pitch to the real thing. I've done this with cd's too. I've also compared my singing with no accompaniement. I can even tune my bass perfectly to songs I hear in my head. This is more of a complaint, really. Nothing is worse than having "Break On Throught(to the other side)" in your imagination for days on end.

I think it is important to play with your ears as much as possible, especially if you are improvising. Having a good idea of how you want a section to sound and then getting it close is a good feeling. Saying that if my singing voice is anything to go by I am a long way off perfect pitch.

Joe.

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