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Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 1:11 pm
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fhopkins wrote:
ZZDoc wrote:
Tanner1994 wrote:
ZZDoc wrote:
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way cool jr wrote:
and doc brings us the hammer of bad news.....

Interested parties ought to search out that thread, sit down with a brew, and prepared themselves for a few minutes :roll: of heavy duty reading. There may even have been, if memory serves me correctly, more than one thread on this issue and made the TBO thread look like a children's bedtime story. :wink:


i dont think this is the exact one but it has some similar talk about fake COAs and neck plates.

http://www.fender.com/community/forums/ ... t=fake+coa

That's one of them, but this one was mild. Should be read again, though. The other is really heavier duty. :? Might find it in the earlier part of the year like Jan/Feb. :wink:


It was quite a long debated conversation Doc! If I remember it correctly it got very heated at times. Discussion/opinions of law, morality, etc.!! :wink:

I think Brad eventually locked the thread you're talking about.


I did about an hour of searchign and still couldnt find the thread...

What part of the forum was it in?


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Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2010 4:13 pm
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What part of the forum was it in?
[/quote]
Look at Eldred Forum Jan 6th "Confirming a fake'..read it all...
There's more around... I'll find it. If not, the two post here are
decent representations of the issues and how we kicked it around.
Food for thought for some.:wink:

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Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2010 11:46 am
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This is breach of trademark law and should not be tolerated unless the seller is has Fender permission in writing and is paying Fender royalty on every piece which uses their name and logo.


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Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2010 12:31 pm
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I fail to see the big deal being made over a custom neckplate. I really do. How many other larger companies technically make Fender neckplates and don't pay licensing fees?

It's a four bolt neck plate which the production of does not infringe on any copyright or trademark laws. I believe some folks here need to make themselves better informed on what constitutes infringement in the case of musical instruments.

In fact, this guy probably buys the neckplates from Allparts or Warmoth and then engraves them himself. Again, what's the issue?

Now if this guy were making fake Fender necks, decals and all, then there would be something to make a big deal over.

Otherwise, I'd advise everyone to enjoy the service he's offering. I may even buy a custom neckplate off of him for the MIM ...

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Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2010 1:42 pm
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phoenix-caster wrote:
It's a four bolt neck plate which the production of does not infringe on any copyright or trademark laws. I believe some folks here need to make themselves better informed on what constitutes infringement in the case of musical instruments.

Familiarize yourself with the already extensive threads which exist in archives on this very matter. You might also have a look at my recent comments on the Frankenstrat thread with respect to the use of logo. My comments in all of these instances are supported by discussions with one of the world's most foremost attorneys in the field of patent law, trademark, and copyright, with whom I travel into Manhattan practically every morning of the week. Every single dotted 'i' and crossed't' of argument which passed through these pages, expressed by participating members was reviewed by him. Hence, the fabrication of any device already patented by, or which bears an inscription copyrighted by FMIC without license from the company, and creation of such a device with the expressed knowledge that it can be used to perpetrate a fraud (which he has to be aware of simply by virtue of the business which he is in) constitutes not only infringement but potentially an accessory to or enabler of counterfeiting and fraud should the product wind up on a bogus guitar. Think or do what you will, but IMHO, and those of others on the Forum, these offerings do nothing but a dis-service to serious minded players and collectors, as well as the uninitiated, unsuspecting or uninformed. Their enterprises should be shunned utterly.
Doc :wink:

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Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2010 1:51 pm
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JSJH wrote:
This is breach of trademark law and should not be tolerated unless the seller is has Fender permission in writing and is paying Fender royalty on every piece which uses their name and logo.


I don't think in this case it is.
First, no were on this plate does the word "Fender" appear.
Second, the term "Custom shop" is to generic to be trademarked, there are simply to many companies that have custom shops, some far larger then Fender.
The "V" taken from the old Ford V-8 badging, It was very popular in the 50's.

This guy has a shop that make custom plates, so he has a custom shop, as long as the word Fender does not appear nor a direct copy of one of the Fender custom shop plates he should be ok.

He does sell ones with a picture of Jimmi and Stevie, but there estates would be the ones who would need to either sell him the rights or take legal action if he is selling these without permission.

To my mind, as long as it is disclosed or removed prier to a resale there shouldn't be any issue.

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Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2010 1:52 pm
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Ah, so it's the "Custom Shop" script and "V" on the pictured neckplate that's causing all of the ruckus?

Makes sense now.

Although I should note that Cadillac used a very similar "V" on cars years and years ago ... :wink:

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Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2010 2:04 pm
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phoenix-caster wrote:
Ah, so it's the "Custom Shop" script and "V" on the pictured neckplate that's causing all of the ruckus?Makes sense now.
Although I should note that Cadillac used a very similar "V" on cars years and years ago ... :wink:

......and that very use on the automobile was a point raised, accompanied by an excellent front end photo of a magnificent vintage vehicle which raised the interests of collectors herein. 8)

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Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2010 2:13 pm
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Jeffytune wrote:
JSJH wrote:
This is breach of trademark law and should not be tolerated unless the seller is has Fender permission in writing and is paying Fender royalty on every piece which uses their name and logo.


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I don't think in this case it is.

The test at an infringement trial would be for the plaintiff(e.g FMIC) to show that anyone of us would look at this product and immediately identify it with the Fender Custom Shop. It is not necessary to take the time or space to get into the details as to how discovery is accomplished in this regard but there are experts in the field who make awesome money working for plaintiffs or defense attorneys putting together the kinds of evidence to support/refute such a contention.

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