Ok so I got to grips with a lespaul I suspect to be from Bazaar of China. Lets just say that I'm re-thinking whether I want one.

First off the headstock. Note the font of the serial no' very close to my eye.



Unfortunately the tuners are all over the place on the treble side. The bass side look fairly straight though.

The front of the headstock looks great, except the font on the truss cover.


You can see that the guitar is fretted over the binding. Something gibson should do. Recently they cant marry the binding up to the fret end from what I've seen. This guitar is far better around the neck edges. No joke, I've wondered how to word that diplomaticaly and decided sod it, I'll just tell the truth.

Onto the body all is good. A thick 5/8" maple cap, not the prettiest join I've seen but nice non the less.







Ok there are problems here too. Unneccesary, silly problems that could really be solved without too much trouble at the factory. The pickup mounting ring screws are all scewed, the routing on the bridge pickup is off shape. The pickup doesnt sit right when its all fitted, the wall of the route pushes against the bridge side of the pickup. A easy fix with a stanley knife blade, or a chisel if your feeling heavy handed.

Ok my job was to set this guitar up and get it playing right. I learnt a lot of what I know about guitars as a kid. As a poor kid I always had crap guitars. All my mates had good ones, I spent hours and hours getting these bad guitars to play good through trial and error. This fake wasnt leaving without me having it play like a gibson. Not an easy task and brings other issues to light too. The fret level is truely abysmal, ok I'll re-level em. The trussrod doesnt respond how I'm used to, it's all in the 1'st/2'nd frets and 20'-22' frets. I got it straight in the end, on with the straightedge and feeler gauges. Got it straight, crowned and polished, got it restrung. Set the pickup heights, the 10th fret high E is still sounding dead???? Strings off again, get the magnifying glass out, it's still a smidggen low of the 11th???? Then the 11th is a gnats kneecap low of the 12th. I finaly chased it out and got the guitar back together.

Plugged it in, played it. What a stonker really really good sound. The bridge pickup is a little microphonic, but I like that on a guitar. The neck is a seymour duncan of some kind. It gives that creamy bland seymour duncan tone, so I steer clear. The thing plays and sounds brilliant all is good. My mate leaves smiling.

Late that night I get a SMS, the guitar has gone dead from the 12th fret up. What the bloody hell has gone on now? I dont know I'm expecting it back in today.

In conclusion I wont be buying one. Their great and good, value for money for sure. Looking at the construction and some of the needless mistakes listed above, you just dont know what your going to get till it arrives. What if it's not a scewed mounting ring screw on the next one? What if its a scewed tailpiece post? Whats going on with the trussrod? I have no doubt thats the cause of the problem that developed lastnight. It reacted really strangely. Why? A trussrod is a trussrod right? I think it could only be down to the neck wood.

The search continues for a good fake aside from Tokai.

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Keep me posted mate. I want to know when ,where, what, and how about a good fake that I can afford. The problem being is that I'm no tech. like you so..

I'm really looking for a great Casino that doesn't cost close to 3 grand! If I've got to spend that much I'll just but a Gibson ES-335 in red or tobacco burst!!

The bigger problem is that theres no QC with these guitars. Like that with the tuners. One side are spot on, the other side look like a mountaintop. What would it be on the next one? Fretboard hanging off maybe? Its like they were built by someone whos never played a guitar. That they have a gibson in the factory and that they just keep turning out these xerox copies, without understanding what does what. Another 5/10 years and these will be a real problem for anyone else making guitars. They'll have got full understanding of the mechanics of it by then. The other thing I noticed were the fretedges and crown. Absolute perfection, really good, comparable to Customshop quality. Yet the fret level was abysmal. Where their good their great, where their bad their terrible.

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Some employees really take pride and do their work well and the next one is collecting a paycheck. Maybe later on they will be as good as a Fender MIJ!!! Hopefully!

They'll surpass that mate trust me. It really was brilliant where it was good, honestly.

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I'm sure they will! It is already happening in other products! Why not guitars. I bought some tires for my truck the other day. I looked at all kinds and the cheapest and best built I bought. It wasn't until I got home and starting reading all the warranty stuff that I realized that I had bought tires from China. Believe me they were head and shoulders better than the others I looked at that were higher priced!!

Hi Nick: just from the photos - am I reading it right? Where you have the bridge pickup out it looks like that is a full depth maple cap rather than a veneer? Man, nothing cheapo about that. Either side of the Atlantic a lump of maple like that is about $140 up (cheaper for a factory, naturally):

http://www.stewmac.com/shop/Bodies,_nec ... dbody.html

On the other hand, it looks like there is an amazingly obvious center join line in the top between the two pickups - again, am I seeing it correctly? Is that a line of filler? If so, wow: that's a crap job!

Bizarre combination of good and bad workmanship - just as you say.

Also: what is the neck wood? The back of the headstock doesn't look like either mahogany or maple...

Fascinating. Thanks for posting.

Cheers - C

Does it look like oak of some kind? I'm not good with woods but looks like a oak top table I have!! Naw!! Can't be?

That is why I won't be buying one. They don't have a showroom that you can test drive your guitar before buying it. And I have been
REALLY tempted. I already have a bunch of great guitars including a sweet vintage Gibson SG. So laying out $2k for a Gibson Les Paul is
just not a reasonable use of the "family budget". But for $300-400, to get a guitar that is only a few tweaks away, that is another story ... But -- as Niki said -- you
don't know what you are going to get. With my luck, I get a horrible lemon that only looks like a Gibson that would remind me every time
I picked it up that I should have just stockpiled the money away for an eventual purchase of the real thing ... But I am still tempted.

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Laughing out loud with fear and hope, I have a desperate plan ...

Well, it really looks like that, doesn't it? Do they have oak in China? I don't remember seeing it - but then it was all mostly bamboo in the gaps between the skyscrapers where I've been.

Something similar to oak, anyhow. It really doesn't look like mahogany, does it? Glad it's not just my eyes...

Cheers - C

Dunno what it is, but it certainly has me wondering whether the neck wood is affecting the way the trussrod acts. A very strange affair. That line you see on the maple top is as near invisible in person as not to matter.

Also the rear of the guitar is veneer'd, strange that.

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If you don't mind and it's no trouble I'd love to see pictures of your guitars. Or do you have a link to them? Thanks for all your help my friend!!

someone may have said this but the fakes dont have the binding over the end of the fret like a true gibson would.

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Blues with a feeling.

GUILD GUITARS: MADE TO BE PLAYED!

The binding doesnt go over the fretends on Gibsons. It meets side to side, the binding is shaped. I was looking at buying a lespaul in Nov' and couldnt find one new worth buying primarily because of the problems that joint causes. Hence my intrest in fakes, I'm not spending £1800 on a guitar to have to refret it imediately.

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you're correct and i was trying to elaborate that but did soo poorly, side by side on the binding

When you say you want a fake do you mean a look alike or just a les paul style, because the Agile LP knockoffs are really good quality guitars.

good luck with your search!

_________________
Blues with a feeling.

GUILD GUITARS: MADE TO BE PLAYED!