It is currently Mon Mar 16, 2020 11:26 am

All times are UTC - 7 hours



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 163 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 11  Next
Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 11  Next
Author Message
Post subject: Music theory!!!
Posted: Thu Feb 11, 2010 2:54 pm
Offline
Aspiring Musician
Aspiring Musician
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2009 6:21 am
Posts: 362
Location: Zrenjanin, Serbia
We have guitar building threads, photography threads, and different open discussion threads, a lot of new stuff coming our way here, so I believe we need a "Music theory" thread!
Kind of like FREE on line music course. A friendly one. There are a lot of new players (and some older ones alike) out there that may have some questions about technique or playing or music in general, so I have decided to give this a try!
I always get lots of questions like "how to play E9 chord" or "what does it mean when the chord is major or minor", and so forth. Not being from an English speaking country, I'll try to be understood, and keep it as simple as possible. And free of charge!
Actually, our forum friend Infa Red reminded me the other day of the lack of this kind of "information". So, thank you Infa!
Well, I hope Brad will allow this to live. 'Cause I don't know whom to pay for the copyright on the knowledge. So, please Brad, don't shut this down!


OK! We'll start with the relation of the notes and chords. I want to show you an easy way of building chords, IN ANY TUNING you might choose! With no need to remember and memorize any chord position(s)!
I want you to be able to know how to play every chord from your head. I read somewhere awhile ago that there are around 4.500 chords! Well, I don't know that, but I know I know them all! And so will you.
I'll try to avoid complicated terms, and keep it simple.

For those that have survived reading through here, let's begin:

Every chord constitutes of at least three notes (there are exceptions, but about it later). Those three notes are: root of the chord (the note by which the chord gets its name), the third (major or minor) and the fifth (augmented or diminished). What "the third", "the fifth" and so on mean is that it represents the place of the note in the given scale. In music it is called an "interval". So, "the third" means that the note we are talking about is the third one in the scale, going from the first note (by which the scale or the chord is named after) upwards. Let's take the C major scale as an example.

C major: C D E F G A B C

If you play those notes on any instrument, any instrument at all, it will always be C major scale. Now, let's say that you want to play a C major chord on, to you, a new instrument. The one that you have never played before. Knowing that for a simple, basic, C chord you need the root, the third and the fifth note of the C major scale, you now know that the notes you want and need are: C - the root (thus C chord), E - the third note from the root C, and G - the fifth note from the root C. Now, all you need to do is find those notes on that new instrument and you got yourself a beautiful C chord. Sounds simple?! It's not! But it is rather interesting!
If you are self taught, and used only to memorizing chord positions and don't know what notes are on fretboard, you got yourself in a big trouble. But, don't worry! Yeah, be happy! Because, I will help you with that as well!
I assume most of you reading this are guitarists, so I'll concentrate on guitar. Guitar is a chromatic instrument, roughly meaning that all notes are mixed together, right next to each other, not divided like on piano (black keys - sharpened notes).
If your guitar is tuned E A D G B E, then every next fret gets you the note next to the the note played on an open string. If you play, say, open low E note, the first fret will give you an F, the second F#, the third G, and so on.
The same applies to all strings.
A, A# (or Bb), B etc.
There are only twelve notes on this earth, and they are:
C, C# (or Db), D, D# (Eb), E, F, F# (or Gb), G, G# (or Ab), A, A# (or Bb), B, and all over again! The symbols in the brackets mean, in a way, the alternate name of the chord. It is called enharmonic. It means that the notes (or chords) sound the same, but are written differently. Like C# which is exactly the same note as Db. There are also enharmonic chords, like C# major and Db major. That happens with sharpened or diminished notes (or chords).

Alright, enough for today! Just something to get you started! Next time I’ll write about the thirds, the fifths, the sevenths…intervals in general. And scales of course! Shall try to make it more simple and easier to understand.

I promise an easy way of finding and creating sevenths, nineths, and other “taboo” or “jazz” chords! Patience please!
I hope some of you may find this useful. If you have any questions at all, I am happy to answer. Or here or via e-mail.

I thank those who survived this reading!

Cheers!

Goran

_________________
"If you're on a path that's beaten, it's not your path." Joseph Campbell

"Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me."

"All that is impossible remains to be achieved."
Jules Verne

www.stratcollector.com


Last edited by Goranm on Wed May 02, 2012 2:15 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Top
Profile
Fender Play Winter Sale 2020
Post subject:
Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2010 9:40 am
Offline
Rock Icon
Rock Icon
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jul 16, 2007 6:51 pm
Posts: 25350
Location: Witness Protection Program
Great idea!

_________________
Being able to play and enjoy music is a gift that's often taken for granted.

Don't leave home without it!


Top
Profile
Post subject:
Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2010 9:54 am
Offline
Aspiring Musician
Aspiring Musician
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2009 4:01 pm
Posts: 633
Location: Virginia USA
Check this out http://guitar.about.com/library/weekly/aa031401a.htm

_________________
08 Fender Highway One Tele-Sunburst
09 Squier Custom Tele II-Blonde
04 Squier Standard Strat Antiqueburst
07 Washburn D10SCE natural with Rosewood backing
Fender Mustang II amp


Experience is the best teacher


Top
Profile
Post subject:
Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2010 10:05 am
Offline
Aspiring Musician
Aspiring Musician
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2008 11:24 am
Posts: 422
Location: Raleigh, NC
more, more! Thanks for sharing. I'm a self taught guitarist and appreciate little things like this to help remember notes/chords.


Top
Profile
Post subject:
Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2010 10:11 am
Offline
Aspiring Musician
Aspiring Musician
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2009 4:01 pm
Posts: 633
Location: Virginia USA
Dan Cross on about.com on the site I mentioned before could teach just about ANY guitarist something if they check out how indepth his free course is..chords, music theroy etc.

_________________
08 Fender Highway One Tele-Sunburst
09 Squier Custom Tele II-Blonde
04 Squier Standard Strat Antiqueburst
07 Washburn D10SCE natural with Rosewood backing
Fender Mustang II amp


Experience is the best teacher


Top
Profile
Post subject:
Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2010 11:57 am
Offline
Rock Star
Rock Star
User avatar

Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2009 3:06 pm
Posts: 3545
Location: Brooklyn N.Y
I am all for this thread and will help out as much as needed. Goranm just ask me what you would like me to contribute be it the modes, arpeggios or whatever. I figure since you started I will help when asked but we have to have it structured.


Top
Profile
Post subject:
Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2010 12:11 pm
Offline
Aspiring Musician
Aspiring Musician
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2009 10:53 am
Posts: 560
Great idea. I picked up a book on musical theory but you explained it much better. Thank you.

_________________
2015 Epiphone Casino Goldtop
2011 Taylor 814ce
2009 EC Custom Shop Merc Blue
2008 Schecter ATX
1964 Epi Granada E444T
Fender Super Champ XD


Top
Profile
Post subject:
Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2010 2:07 pm
Offline
Aspiring Musician
Aspiring Musician
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2009 6:21 am
Posts: 362
Location: Zrenjanin, Serbia
Well, first thank you all for your support on this!!! I’ ll get right to another little thing for us fellow musicians!


straycat113 wrote:
I am all for this thread and will help out as much as needed. Goranm just ask me what you would like me to contribute be it the modes, arpeggios or whatever. I figure since you started I will help when asked but we have to have it structured.


Thanks, I may reach out for “help”. But, not until I am done with a couple of more things left to say. I imagined this as an open discussion thread about whatever you may find worth knowing about music in general. So, after I am done with this (don’t know how long it will take, certainly not too long), I suggest general discussion and questions. And I might not be the one to answer all those questions by myself. In other words, I want to make this a complete learning thread. I want to hear what others have to say, and I too want to learn from you. In example, when we get to rhythm, why not listen what our friends from different side of the planet have to say about it. I want different cultures to educate different cultures. After all, we here represent the whole world.

OK! Scales! Yeah, scales!

Another taboo! Alright! There are many, many, many different kinds of scales, but I want to concentrate on only one kind of scales. For now. Because, as our friend Mr. Straycat113 mentioned, those same scales have many different modes. But, don’t let that fool you! I promised an easy way of learning, and I am going to keep that promise. You don’t really have to know all those names of the modes! I have completely forgotten a couple of the names myself, because I realized I know how to play them, and create them myself, so those “fancy” names are, for the sake of our collective mental health, only there for showing off, and for sounding smarter. So, we’ll exclude them! For now!

Ok! The C major scale! The holy grail of the scales for teachers world wide! We’ll repeat it again: C D E F G A B and C again
You may notice that this scale has seven notes. The last C note makes it eight, but as it is the beginning, or the root of the C major scale, that last C note again represents the beginning of the new C major scale, only an octave higher. Oh, yes, an “octave” means, what’s the word…hmm…an array of eight notes. I think that’s the word.. So C D E F G A B C is an octave. But, let’s not wander off our path here, so we’ll leave that for some other post.

That way constructed scale is a diatonic scale. Oh, I’m sorry, it slipped through! I promised to keep it simple! But, I don’t want you to be embarrassed and not knowing what you actually do know, so there are some terms that we must consider remembering. And, diatonic scale is one of them. Why that scale?! Because I consider it the root for all others (yes, it has its origin and roots too, but you don’t need to know what they are. It’s too much information! You see where I’m going with this? You won’t be taking the test, you just need to play the way you want to play; God, I talk too much!). Maybe the most known “baby” of diatonic scale is the famous…Geez, my brain stopped…yeah, pentatonic scale. That’s the one! Pentatonic meaning the array of five notes. Yeah, you got it, coming from diatonic scales! I do hate pentatonic scales, they sound so…empty! Lack of notes! For those wondering, diatonic scales are used by Yngwie Malmsteen, Ritchie Blackmore, Eric Johnson…to name a few. Maybe that will help motivate you.
Diatonic scales come from classical music.

C major:

Major diatonic scales are built like this:
the root of the scale
C
Whole note space between the root and the second note of the scale, so it’s a
D
Again whole note space between the second and the third note, so it’s an
E
But, now the space between the third and the fourth note of the major scale is only half a note, so it’s an
F
Because space between E and F is half a note, regardless of the lack of sharp (#) or diminished (b) symbol.

The space between the fourth and the fifth note is again the whole note, which is a
G
The space between the fifth and the sixth note is the whole note, and is an
A
The space between the sixth and seventh note is the whole note, and is a
B
And between the seventh and the last eighth, which is too the beginning of the new, higher octave is again
C

So, we get something like this:
C whole note space D whole note space E half a note space F whole note space G whole note space A whole note space B half a note space C

On guitar, “whole note space” means the second fret from the note you are currently playing. So, if you play C note on the third fret of A string, whole note space will be the fifth fret. You see, one fret apart! And that one fret is of course “half a note”. As I mentioned earlier, guitar is a chromatic instrument, meaning that if you want half a note up or down from the note being played, it is one fret up or down. If you want whole note up or down, it is two frets up or down.

Half a note – one fret (up or down)
Whole note – two frets (up or down)

C major scale on guitar will be: Third fret A string (C note), fifth fret A string (D note), second fret D string (E note), third fret D string (F note), fifth fret D string (G note),
second fret G string (A note), fourth fret G string (B note) and fifth fret G sting (C note).

Please, learn the position of the notes on the fretboard! It will make this much more easier! For you!
Now, if you know the position of the notes on the fretboard, wherever on guitar you find those notes and play it in that order (or mixed together, but we’ll come to that), you have played a C major scale! After trying and practicing the scale a little, you can try and play that same notes in order you choose! Once that you learn what notes create C major scale, play with them. Make them sing! Play a C major chord for example and try to make some simple melody over it. Of course made of notes from the C major scale. KEEP IT FUN!!!
Amuse yourself that way! Enjoy making melodies over, for now, one chord!

I thought I had something more to say, but I can’t remember now! My concentration seems to be vanishing. Oh, well, next time! I am off to play a couple of notes myself!

KEEP IT FUN!

Goran
[/u]

_________________
"If you're on a path that's beaten, it's not your path." Joseph Campbell

"Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me."

"All that is impossible remains to be achieved."
Jules Verne

www.stratcollector.com


Last edited by Goranm on Sat Feb 13, 2010 1:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
Profile
Post subject:
Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2010 2:44 pm
Offline
Aspiring Musician
Aspiring Musician
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 14, 2009 7:26 am
Posts: 616
Thanks Goranm interesting reading, like most on here i have some books etc but its cool when a forum member posts this stuff.

Copied to a word doc so i can read it over later.

Thanks again 8)


Top
Profile
Post subject:
Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2010 2:50 pm
Offline
Aspiring Musician
Aspiring Musician
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2009 6:21 am
Posts: 362
Location: Zrenjanin, Serbia
Al 87 wrote:
Thanks Goranm interesting reading, like most on here i have some books etc but its cool when a forum member posts this stuff.

Copied to a word doc so i can read it over later.

Thanks again 8)



From a word doc it came, to a word doc it goes!

Thank YOU!


PS I actually write this in Microsoft Word and then copy it here, because I had lost a post a couple of times due to "network timeout" or something like that.
And, I found out that it's much more reliable doing it in Word first when it comes to long posts like these on this thread!

I hope it helps!

Thanks!

_________________
"If you're on a path that's beaten, it's not your path." Joseph Campbell

"Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me."

"All that is impossible remains to be achieved."
Jules Verne

www.stratcollector.com


Top
Profile
Post subject:
Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2010 3:45 pm
Offline
Rock Star
Rock Star
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 26, 2008 6:13 am
Posts: 3317
Location: The Alpha Quadrant.
Goranm my man, what you are doing here is amazing. People need this. As a self taught player who has been pro for 12 years nearly I still do not know all I should. I can play like a demon on fire but I dont know what I just did if you follow.

People need to know these things as I would have more options had I learned such theory. I would love to session but I cant as I just learned Exile On Main St, Appetite for Destruction and Izzy and The Ju Ju Hounds when I was a kid and I get by on that.

Keep your options open new players. It will do you well in the long run knowing this stuff!!

Good man!

CC

_________________
Fender Stratocaster (parts build)
Fender Telecaster 72 Custom RI
Fender Telecoustic Deluxe
Gretsch Electromatic Pro-Jet
Gibson Les Paul Standard Plus
Gibson ES-135
Zenith Type-17
Marshall 70's JMP Superbass 100w
Blackstar HT-5


Top
Profile
Post subject:
Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2010 4:10 pm
Offline
Professional Musician
Professional Musician
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 21, 2009 8:16 am
Posts: 1171
Location: Rutland, Vermont
I am saving these lessons for future reference. Thank you so very much for teaching us!

I use OpenOffice.org... free is good. Free lessons saved using free office suite software. :lol:


Top
Profile
Post subject:
Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2010 4:41 pm
Offline
Aspiring Musician
Aspiring Musician
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2009 6:21 am
Posts: 362
Location: Zrenjanin, Serbia
Celtic Cyclonus wrote:
...I can play like a demon on fire but I dont know what I just did if you follow.
CC


Of course I follow! That's one of the reasons I started this! Why not make it more easier for others!
Thank you for your kind words CC! I mean it!If I remember correctly, you're a Tele player?! Sorry if I'm mistaken. It doesn't matter at all really, because if you make music in any way (except by computer), you're my man!

VT BlackStrat wrote:
...Thank you so very much for teaching us!


Hmmm..."teaching". Well, I don't know about that! I am not sure I like that word and if it stands here! I see here a lot questions about what we're now talking about, and most of them shy! One might ask, why free...well, why not!!! I mean, I learned a lot on this forum, I know this, so I figured...why not give something back. I can't build guitars, I can't sing (I hate to sing, I'm an instrumental guy), I can't take good pictures, but I know this and just wanted to share. And was hoping it would mean something to somebody out there. I don't know. I'm glad you find it useful! Thank you! It's keeps me inspired to continue!

PS I am 25 now, and I still get chills when someone mentions music teachers! In my case, it may sound too self promoting, but teachers were always too slow and not willing to share this stuff. So, I have decided to share this with you here, and tell you, in short (yes, in short!), simplified version of it all. And without making it so official whatsoever, as they do in music schools. In my schools anyway. I am not criticizing schools here, I'm talking about my own experience. So, I am trying to put it in my own words and try to make it friendly. More fun!
This is what they teach you at Berklee or Julliard! We can't all go there, can we! So, we're here!

I'd like to jam with you guys some day!

_________________
"If you're on a path that's beaten, it's not your path." Joseph Campbell

"Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me."

"All that is impossible remains to be achieved."
Jules Verne

www.stratcollector.com


Top
Profile
Post subject:
Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2010 5:16 pm
Offline
Rock Icon
Rock Icon
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 30, 2008 10:47 am
Posts: 15336
Location: In a galaxy far far away
Goranm


Great thread, truely brilliant. Something I've been after for quite a while. Scales and chord structure I understand but like a constant reference as I'm self taught.
#
#
I petition this thread be made sticky. Brad you got a guy here capable and willing to do the work for you, for free.

_________________
No no and no


Top
Profile
Post subject: Re: Music theory!!!
Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2010 5:45 pm
Offline
Amateur
Amateur
User avatar

Joined: Thu Dec 17, 2009 4:44 pm
Posts: 142
Location: USA - somewhere in the middle
Goranm wrote:
We have guitar building threads, photography threads, and different open discussion threads, a lot of new stuff coming our way here, so I believe we need a "Music theory" thread!

Goran

Excellent! As a beginner, I THANK YOU, Goran!

Even though it's utterly frustrating at times, I'm in no hurry to be a fantastic player because I know I've picked up a life-long journey. (Although at 52, I have no illusions of becoming the next rock star.) Given that I'm no hurry, I'm also committed to learning theory right along side actual playing skills so this couldn't have come at a better time!

From the beginning, I've understood learning notes on the fretboard is essential. So far, I can work out the notes via the slow and kludgy alphabet counting method - both forwards and backwards, but I've also been learning the 5 note shapes where I can easily find the same notes anywhere on the board depending on which string I'm on.

I've been using the book Guitar Fretboard Workbook and it's helped quite a bit.
http://www.amazon.com/Guitar-Fretboard- ... 0634049011

I look forward to future installments! (I'm just jazzed that I actually semi-understand what you're talking about- so far anyway) :lol:

I second the motion to make this sticky.

_________________
Then again, what do I know ... I've only been playin' for 6 months ... ! 8)


Top
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 163 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 11  Next
Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 11  Next

All times are UTC - 7 hours

Fender Play Winter Sale 2020

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: