Haha.....pwned and patronized.


...still, pay your taxes all.

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-Kc
"Payin' dues."

That stinks.

Sympathies for Gibson getting out of the mess okay. American companies have enough grief as it is.

+1 BigJay. Completely agree with you.

Yes Genius it is "just wood" and it will just grow back, but it may take a while. If it can no longer be found in Madagascar it (or a suitable replacement) will be found elsewhere. I don't give a hoot in hell where it comes from.

I still hold that with all the real problems facing the US, this kind of "enviro-nazi" crap is small beans and shouldn't be a priority.

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"Life is like eating jalapenos. What you do today may burn your arse tomorrow"

At least we can agree that there are more serious problems that should be dealt with.

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"Life is like eating jalapenos. What you do today may burn your arse tomorrow"

More immediate, sure.
I can understand your point of view that some trees in a small island half-way around the globe may seem unimportant compared to a road needing repair on the way to work.
Yet, we still live in a global interconnected world, which is a tad bit larger than the US. And leadership comes with some responsabilities.
Who cares about some endangered species? After all, a panda fur might look cool by the fire place, wouldn't it? And there are still some in zoos. And if they disappear, so what? We still have some nice digital pictures of them.

Species have gone extinct for thousands of years and will continue to do so. I know I'm a heartless b--tard, but I don't really care about the cute fuzzies (regardless of what type of animal they are). So that emotional argument has no effect on me. I'm also not giving up my gas burning V8 until there is no other option. Oh God I eat red meat too!

If the tree protectors in Madagascar don't want folks cutting down their trees and selling the wood, then they need to handle it on their end not the FBI. I'm sure that there is some fairly large equipment in use, lopping down these 150 year old trees and hauling them out of the jungles. It can't be too hard to find the evil doers.

Eventually the sun will go nova, the earth is going to fry, and everything on it will be gone regardless of what we do or don't do.

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"Life is like eating jalapenos. What you do today may burn your arse tomorrow"

Ok, so there's no need to argue, there's no debate here.
Looking after #1 is the only priority.

Btw, not only the thief is punished, so is the buyer of stolen goods.

That's it! He can be taught! As unpopular as it is these days yes, I look out for me and mine first, formost, and always. If little island half way around the world has tree pirates taking there stuff it is not my problem. It's theirs so let them handle it.

BTW the buyer of stolen goods is only punished if he/she knows that the goods are stolen.

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"Life is like eating jalapenos. What you do today may burn your arse tomorrow"

For the time being, importing that wood in the US is illegal, no matter what happens in Madagascar.
And it's for Gibson to prove they had no idea what they were purchasing.

I cant believe anyone is stupid enough to believe "tree pirates" dont exist, because we create a market for them.

If anyones a pirate, we are.
How many would prefer brazilian rosewood to indian and why?

BTW Madagascar is the 4th largest island in the world. I'd really prefer that xenophobic and ignorant statements such as "some little island" weren't brandished with such glee. I find them quite offensive. It portrays people making that statement as being a bit thick, which I know their not.

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No no and no

Guys,
I will weigh in on this debate...I grew up in the mountains of NY (Adirondacks) I have seen the trees overharvested in a few areas which have had serious impacts on the ecosystem there. If Gibson is guilty of said charges and I hope and pray that they are not, not because I am a Gibby guy...(I am not.. ) but because I respect the Gibson brand of guitars and more important the idea of how this could effect our beloved Fenders...why some may ask, restriction of all wood period. Talk about price increases. We all need to conserve and really understand that a good harvesting/conservation plan is what will enable us to have our beloved guitars. I won't throw stones at folks when it comes to the environment because in many ways folks never really had to worry about it. Education is the best way. Just my opinion
ABS

Well, Fender doesn't use a lot of exotic woods and that's another proof that as desirable they may be, they're not indispensible to make a great product.

And I totally agree with you, Rbornestrat, education is always the best way; just that it takes time and sometimes it might be too late to repair the damage. And I guess this applies to everything, not just woods and guitars.

And off topic, the UK Guitarist mag, in it's 25th anniversary issue for December had a nice little comparison of prices, 1984-2009 (the 1984 prices being worked out using the UK Relative Prices Index 1984-2009).

They compared a Squier Stratocaster Popular to a Squier Stratocaster Standard, a Mesa Boogie Mark II to a Mark V, a Marshall JCM800 to a VM2466, a Les Paul Standard to a Les Paul Standard 2008, a Boss DD-2 to a DD-7, a pint of beer and a gallon of petrol. Where did the prices go up (and as they say "who's ripping us off")? Well, the answer is quite straight - the pint of beer, the gallon of gas and the Les Paul.