Gotta tell ya, I'm a little flabbergasted. I've been a Fender Fan Boy for many years, but they're starting to smell really really corporate, and '09 is not turning out to be one of their better years:

First, as the recession hits bottom, they crank the prices up. That's just boneheaded.

Then they're named in a class action law suit for price-fixing along with NAMM and GC:
http://www.mi-pro.co.uk/news/30540/Laws ... and-Fender

Now they're fined by the EPA(!):
http://yosemite.epa.gov/opa/admpress.ns ... enDocument

Man, I miss Bill Schultz.

Fender was always a company that I could be proud of (well, post CBS anyway). Now..... ?

Come on guys, straighten-up and fly right. You use to be about the musician, not the greed.

And you are...?

------------------------

On the lawsuit:

"Although listed as a defendant in the action, Fender is not otherwise mentioned in the 20-page document."

I don't see how you can even accuse GC and NAMM of price fixing. They don't hold a monopoly on distribution. Buy your strings somewhere else.

Looks to me that Fender's implication was a "just in case" measure (you have to sue everybody in sight, because if it turns out someone else is repsonsible and you've failed to name them, it's virtually impossible to bring litigation against them).

I'm also really tired of getting business lectures form people with worldviews so small they think "working for profit" is the same thing as "greed."

I'll give you the EPA fine. That is troubling.

But hey, feel free to add any criticism of the company actually grounded in fact.

Hazardous waste violations seems to cost a lot of money. When I was in the Navy there was a big hoopla about hazardous waste and flamable materials, I guess it's that way in private business too. They violated a law and payed a fine, no big deal to me.

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Few men have virtue to withstand the highest bidder. George Washington
No picture = No equipment
Fender CD-60
Squier Deluxe Stratocaster
Squier VM Tele Thinline

Agreed. Seems to be the new "socialist" attitude lately.

I think Fender's put out some awesome stuff this year though.

Me too!!

the link posted is much more about Guitar Center then Fender, fender is only listed as a defendant. It's really all about GC and their screwy business practices, not to mention the monopoly/stranglehold they've got on the guitar industry right now.

Fender is, and always will be, awesome. (even when CBS owned them.)

That's why I can get a MIA strat for $1000. but a MIA Gibson is around $5000-$6000.

Fender's not price gouging, a Strat doesn't cost a whole lot more then it did 50 years ago. So I'd say they still care about the musicians.

Basically it's Guitar Center that's insane and really hurting the industry. Selling damaged/shop worn guitars as new. Salesmen that are clueless. Shipping out returned guitars as new through the mail order side, and on,...and on,...

Fender= YAAY!!
Guitar Center= Boooooooooooo!

[quote="SlapChop"]And you are...?

A fairly loyal Fender customer who has spent in excess of $40,000 in the last 4 1/2 years on Fender gear. I figure that entitles me to an opinion.

And you are...?

Anyway,
I hear you on the "greed" part, and, as a small business owner, quite understand your position. Indeed, I agree with most of it. My complaint is, admittedly, more an emotional reaction than a well reasoned analytical position. That being said, Fender has at times marketed or presented itself as the "working man's" guitar company. If that is actually the case and not just a slick marketing ploy, then one has to wonder (or at least be curious about) the timing of the price increase and their complicity in the lawsuit.

As regards the lawsuit, I confess I have little sympathy for the claimant.
For arguments sake, lets say that there was a "conspiracy" to fix prices at an inflated level. I rather doubt anyone held a gun to this guy's head and forced him to buy the guitar. If the price was artificially inflated to the point that it was too expensive, then he simply should not have purchased the guitar. I agree too that at some point, people need to stop playing the victim and accept responsibility for their own actions.

What troubles me is that Fender, a company and product line near and dear to my heart, would even be in a position to be named in such a suit. Perhaps that is naive. I do not work in the legal industry and prefer to live life as simply and honestly as possible.

As regards the EPA business, I have no enlightening insight. I only expect better from a company I have supported for many years with my hard earned cash.

At any rate. I appreciate the soapbox and apologize if my initial post rubbed anyone the wrong way. That certainly wasn't my intention. I'm sure that 99.9% of the all the people involved with Fender are the nicest, most honest and sincere people you could meet. The ones I have met personally certainly are. I just want the "corporate Fender" (whatever that might be) to remember that when you are king-of-the-hill, everyone can see you.

if anything, Fender's just trying to make a profit. these are hard financial times we're going through, and it's not Fender's fault.

the prices will go back down, just give it some time. Fender's a great company.

the EPA thing is wierd though...

_________________
"I don't care how good you are, how fast you are. You ain't good enough no lessin' you got the soul." -Hubert Sumlin

Why do you think Fender manufactures in Mexico and China? I didn't see the EPA in either of those countries when I visited them.

Not really. If you knew what was required in a production paint facility you would be amazed. All it takes is one guy getting lazy and skipping over something the day before a EPA/Clean Air Board inspector shows up and you will easily get cited for a list of infractions like this. Everything, and I mean e-v-e-r-y-t-h-i-n-g, is regulated and controlled and must be logged and tracked accordingly.

The part of the article that interested me was the FTC dropping their investigation effectively allowing the MAP to continue in the US. As a consumer I get frustrated because this does allow the manufacturer to (somewhat) control the sale price of their product at the retail level. This in turn leads to sales quotas and minimum orders to maintain manufacturing forecasts. I would be interested in hearing from Big Jay and his take on it since I consider him our resident economist....

As someone that actually worked in retail for some time I can tell you that MAP pricing is a double edged sword. MAP prices help the smaller business without the buying power of a mega company somewhat level the playing field but at the same time can be misleading to the consumer. Many people do not realize that the price they see on a product online or in a mega-chain store ad is not what they would actually be able to purchase that product at. I know of several large companies that sell online and offer a discount or price reduction at checkout when you buy from them as a way around the MAP agreement they have with a manufacturer. They just can't advertise that lower price.
In my experience MAP is one of the best things that happend for small business. We were getting beat to death about prices. Accused of ripping people off and making ungodly profits when that was not the case. We don't get the same cost as those large companies but we still need to turn a profit to keep the lights on. That's not easy to do when you have to try and price match those other guys and your margins are in the basement.

Right. But isn't that exactly the problem if the lawsuit is valid: If a big box store like GC is setting the MAP and getting their inventory at less cost than a mom and pop store, it seem like the mom and pops are competing against an unfair margin. They're essentially having to price match at a price which affords them little if any profit. GC has a vested interest in demanding a MAP which allows them and only them to make money, thereby driving competition out of business. Maybe I'm missing something????

If you wanna talk about price gouging look at a little company that begins with G.

Case Closed.