This would of all been sorted out a lot quicker if the goverment had taken the money it gave to corrupt bankers and divided it equally among the tax paying public, after all its their money being used. Instant boost to public spending and hey presto no more deppression, thats what this is. Not a reccession. They wouldnt do that though, it would close the gap between rich and poor too quickly and by too much.
As a taxpayer will you get a dividend when these banks show a profit next year? After all every taxpayer in the usa and uk is a part share holder of every bank thats been bailled out by their respective goverments. Were far too apathetic in the uk to do anything about it. If you americans demonstrated about it though we'd soon follow suit.

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Also you no when the U.S. took interest over AIG there assets were larger then the 80+ Billion bail out so it was securded loan for participation bills plus they were charged like 8 or 9 points and short term interest rates. And the insurance side of AIG was still very profitable, it had not lost any moneys. If you recall right before AIG the goverment let Lehman Brothers go down. Much of the other banks they are taking over now have not got the assets they are bankrupt. Just like GM does not have the assets to cover there curent debt . Its like loaning money to someone who has nothing and will never make enough to pay you back.

Doing the Clinton administration some said this was going to happen but the plan was big money would be lent out to anyone the loans would be sold prifit made and walk. Anything the admistration does takes 3 to six years before the true long term result are feft. That bill passed in 99 and the loans became available to everyone for everything, rate droped all kinds of companies jumped in. Housing prices sky rocketed because of the low rates people thought they could spend more. then in 2002 you started see more and more of these interest only lones, adj. arms, streamline K's
People got away from the fixed morgateges. But the time frame for the fall was dead on.

I sold most of my stocks other the energy before the fall and bought garanteed anuities moved the Wifes 403B into gar. funds. I can't imagine people did not see this coming!

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The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.

Thomas Jefferson

Isn't this getting a little out of hand?

The thread started out with an enlightening story

Jay i cant help but think its wrong for the goverment to help banks out. Perhaps a bit of aid and let the worst offenders go under. After all banks are privately run organizations. If the goverment was so good with finance the whole mess would never have occured.
Still one thing in the current situation is becoming more apparent everyday. The main cause of this which is the rich/poor divide is becoming bigger. The only way to cure this situation without causing a catastrophic rise in inflation would be with a controlled collapse or as hitler did in 33 declare a year of jubilee. Reset everything to zero and start again. Its a pipedream though, it may be the only solution but it wont happen. Those in charge would lose too much of what they control.

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Jay my biggest fear has nothing to do with whats right or wrong, whos making dough and who's not. My biggest fear is that from my perspective atleast theres nothing being done to prevent this happening again.

The whole of the banking system needs restructuring.

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Bigjay there is an interesting article in Newsweek called "The Capitalist Manifesto: Greed Is Good"

A Small quote;

A few years from now, strange as it may sound, we might all find that we are hungry for more capitalism, not less. An economic crisis slows growth, and when countries need growth, they turn to markets. After the Mexican and East Asian currency crises—which were far more painful in those countries than the current downturn has been in America—we saw the pace of market-oriented reform speed up. If, in the years ahead, the American consumer remains reluctant to spend, if federal and state governments groan under their debt loads, if government-owned companies remain expensive burdens, then private-sector activity will become the only path to create jobs. The simple truth is that with all its flaws, capitalism remains the most productive economic engine we have yet invented. Like Churchill's line about democracy, it is the worst of all economic systems, except for the others. Its chief vindication today has come halfway across the world, in countries like China and India, which have been able to grow and pull hundreds of millions of people out of poverty by supporting markets and free trade. Last month India held elections during the worst of this crisis. Its powerful left-wing parties campaigned against liberalization and got their worst drubbing at the polls in 40 years.
Capitalism means growth, but also instability. The system is dynamic and inherently prone to crashes that cause great damage along the way. For about 90 years, we have been trying to regulate the system to stabilize it while still preserving its energy. We are at the start of another set of these efforts. In undertaking them, it is important to keep in mind what exactly went wrong. What we are experiencing is not a crisis of capitalism. It is a crisis of finance, of democracy, of globalization and ultimately of ethics.

Capitalism messed up," the British tycoon Martin Sorrell wrote recently, "or, to be more precise, capitalists did." Actually, that's not true. Finance screwed up, or to be more precise, financiers did. In June 2007, when the financial crisis began, Coca-Cola, PepsiCo, IBM, Nike, Wal-Mart and Microsoft were all running their companies with strong balance sheets and sensible business models. Major American corporations were highly profitable, and they were spending prudently, holding on to cash to build a cushion for a downturn. For that reason, many of them have been able to weather the storm remarkably well. Finance and anything finance-related—like real estate—is another story.

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The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.

Thomas Jefferson

Uhh no!!!! More power to the Goverment



The Obama administration wants to overhaul the U.S. financial rule book by giving the Federal Reserve increased powers but, bowing to critics in Congress, is backing away from proposals to consolidate various regulatory agencies.

The administration's overhaul plan would make the Fed a systemic risk regulator to oversee large institutions whose failure could threaten the stability of the entire system.

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The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.

Thomas Jefferson

"Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain..."

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"...The final truth is, there is no truth..." - (from "Nice n' Neat" by the Boomtown Rats)