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Posted: Sat Mar 14, 2009 10:46 pm
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pohatu771 wrote:
I've actually suggested on several occasions on Gibson- and Epiphone-oriented forums that Gibson should move some (or all) Epiphone production to Mexico.

Also, just so anyone is aware, the Gibson Song Maker acoustic series is made in Canada.

Thats because Gibson bought Garrison Guitars and Garrison is now building some guitars with the Gibson name in there factory in Canada.

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Post subject: Re: Should Fender have stayed only "MIA" like Gibs
Posted: Sat Mar 14, 2009 11:42 pm
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01GT eibach wrote:
1) To the best of my knowledge, all Gibsons are MIA with Gibson's lesser (and cheaper) non-MIA products being sold under a different non-Gibson brand (primarily Epi).
2) Contrary to this approach, Fender does sell Fender-branded products that are made from many non-MIA locations. For example, you can get a "Fender Stratocaster" that is made in the USA, Mexico, Japan, Korea, etc...

My question to you:
Do you like Fender's strategy? Or would you have preferred that non-MIA Fender products be sold under a non-Fender line (and maybe not Squier, either) more similar to how Gibson brands their lesser lines?

bro , 01 , fender design unique sound the closer to am tolerances blah , blah , but subtle differences enhance unique where ever those fenders are fendered , so , play on bro .

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Posted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 12:06 am
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no...


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Posted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 12:21 am
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Okay, I started this with just a question, but now here is my opinion...

I agree that it is a GREAT thing that Fender provides non-MIA Fender-branded product. It all comes down to the fact that any time your see the "Fender" logo, you are guaranteed a high-quality product. Fender as a company should be commended for instilling such a perception of quality into their consumer base. Regardless of origin, all Fender products feel right, play well, and live up to the name on the headstock from a quality standpoint. For Gibson, I think they are similarly making the right decision by not putting their name on Epi Les Pauls, as they seem (IMHO) to be quite a noticable step down from Gibson LPs (the non-Studios). To the contrary for Fender, we argue "ad infinitum" if MIM Strats are as good/ better than MIAs. The fact that this discussion is so rampant is very revealing.

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Posted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 5:40 am
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If Fender just stayed MIA, their prices would be even more expensive than they are now, because they would be similar to Gibson prices...

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Posted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 8:43 am
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My first Fender was a MIM Strat, had that not been possible I probably wouldn't be playing Fender guitars today. I got the MIM for an excellent price, and I was proud it carried the Fender logo, and was a quality guitar. I have now stepped up to a CS Strat, a Deluxe MIA Tele and a CIJ Tele. I would never have got any of them to start off with, so having the MIM option has paid off for the Fender Corporation.


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Posted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 5:30 pm
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tommygunn wrote:
No!!!!! The point is you can have a real fender (name brand is what is counting) for a fraction of the price.Plus fender has earned it's name for the working mans guitar, that rockstars use (this is a good thing).


+1, the reason it says Fender is because it is built to Fender's standards.

Oh, and Tommygunn, just saw the link. Being a snowboarder, I know who those guys are, and... haha, wow.

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Posted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 6:29 pm
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I think fenders current production ethos of building guitars for people from all sorts of income levels is perfectly in line with Leo's goal of building a guitar the regular joe could fix. I would argue that fenders mexico plant in no way denegrates the fender name but enhances it. Quality giggable guitars for nearly everyone.

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Posted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 7:03 pm
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01GT eibach wrote:
Okay, I started this with just a question, but now here is my opinion...
For Gibson, I think they are similarly making the right decision by not putting their name on Epi Les Pauls, as they seem (IMHO) to be quite a noticable step down from Gibson LPs (the non-Studios). To the contrary for Fender, we argue "ad infinitum" if MIM Strats are as good/ better than MIAs. The fact that this discussion is so rampant is very revealing.

Now I dont agree with that statement there is nothing Quote [The fact that this discussion is so rampant is very revealing} End] Go onto the Epiphone forum and they have the same between Gibson and Epiphone as Fender MIA and MIM. And I have both Gibson and High end Epi's in the house and I dont see a noticable step down with the LP's but I do with the Hollow ES's of cource the Epi's Are Custom and Custom Plus LP's. Epiphone is a seperate company owned by the same group that owns Gibson thats why they don't put Gibson name on there guitars just like Fender don't put there name on Charvel or Hamer, Jackson, Gretch. Do you think Fender don;t put there name on them because there cheap and lower quality?
Gibson, Epiphone, Kramer, Garrison, Steinberger Slingerland, Tobias Valley Arts, and there other they are all owned by the same private holding that owns Gibson

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Posted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 7:54 pm
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mac67 wrote:
tommygunn wrote:
No!!!!! The point is you can have a real fender (name brand is what is counting) for a fraction of the price.Plus fender has earned it's name for the working mans guitar, that rockstars use (this is a good thing).


+1, the reason it says Fender is because it is built to Fender's standards.

Oh, and Tommygunn, just saw the link. Being a snowboarder, I know who those guys are, and... haha, wow.


Really funny, right?

Theres one where Shaun I being interviewed and he said all the Ladys where gitting him food and drinks ...

the interviewer says "Drinks? Your only 19!"

His responce was classic..."I'm talkin' mountian dews baby!"

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Post subject: Re: Should Fender have stayed only "MIA" like Gibs
Posted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 7:39 am
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There ARE many sides to this issue. Two white on black Stratocasters with maple necks, side by side, look the same to the unsophisticated.

That can be a bummer when there's a $3K price spread between them. :?

Doc

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Posted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 7:45 am
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Very true zzdoc, I've honestly picked up MIM's and thought they where american, not seeing they didn't have through body, or the MIA's logo

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Posted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 7:47 am
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Nope, epi standard gold top clone. they were in the 600$cdn range around Christmas/new years
Now the gold top is 850$cdn and the epi les Paul custom or black beauty is 950$cdn
Checked the local shop and a couple of major chains here price is up in all of them

mclmk8d wrote:
Unless your buying an Epi Slash LP, none of the LPs cost $1000; maybe the local shop is ripping people off. Epi LP standards are $500-650.

peterp wrote:
and almost 1000$ for a epi les paul.

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Posted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 10:04 am
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In this opinion, both Fender and Gibson seem pretty firm in reality for what they are doing, for sound reasons.

Taylor and Martin do Mexico production, don't they?


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Posted: Mon Mar 16, 2009 1:16 pm
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tommygunn wrote:
Very true zzdoc, I've honestly picked up MIM's and thought they where american, not seeing they didn't have through body, or the MIA's logo


I, personally, would prefer anything not MIA to carry a logo differentiating them in the fashion of PRS. The guitars build in Korea, a very finely turned out product, are designated SE and have a different look. (for all I know it means South East)

Fender likely should have had all of it's non-MIA product as Squier by Fender. It would give one something to aspire to.

I had the same argument with Mercede-Benz when they marketed their 'el cheepo dinky Benz' behind the same three pointed star sported by vehicles costing 2-3x the price that I busted my proverbial buns to get to the station in life to afford.

I no longer seek to own their automobiles.

Doc :wink:

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