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Post subject: Where's the Beef?
Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 3:22 pm
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The one serious beef I have with the guitar maker's industry over-all is that even when you spend some good money on a nice one, you need to have it checked over by an experienced luthier (guitar repair expert) to have it set-up properly and look for any other possible problems that might need adjustment &/or fixing. I remember when you not only got a HSC with the guitar, but it played the way it should right off the rack. What the heck, I didn't even get any "case candy" with the Fender Koa Strat I bought recently BRAND NEW! True, I didn't pay full list price, but who is fool enough to toss money away these days with all the 'standard 40% discount' places?

However, when I got my new Koa home, I noticed that there was a crack across the nut end of the neck just over the truss rod hole, the nut itself set way too high and (of course) the action was terrible. I took it to a 40+ year super-experienced luthier who had dropped ALL of his "Authorized Dealer" certificates (due to rarely ever getting paid) and has one of finest guitar repair-shop reputations around. He not only fixed the fretboard separation from the neck and sealed the crack in the finish, but he trimmed down the nut as well. Then he saw that the string trees were out-of line and re-set both of them after which he adjusted the slightly warped neck and added all 3 missing tremolo strings to bring it back to the original design of 5 that Leo intended. Of course, a string change and intonation was included for the grand total of $172.75 ! BUT, it was well worth it since it NOW plays like butter.... although I've never tried to tune up & play a stick.... LOL

My PRS, Parker, Ric and Michael Kelly have played beautifully from day 1. Matter of fact, the HSS Strat I got a few years ago plays fine. I guess the Koa was the odd 'lemon' eh?

Final note:
When I called the shop where I bought the Koa, I was told it was in perfect condition when I bought it (REALLY?) and I should've simply brought it back because it was "Under Warranty" and it would have been "fixed" for FREE ..... Yeah..... but to MY satisfaction??? Without going through a giant hassle and ALL of the problems addressed??? I seriously doubt it. Experience, competence and reputation mean far more to me than any (not that difficult to get) "Authorized" sign, especially when it's well-know that such 'certification' isn't exactly a bar exam or admission to MENSA. Far too many Dealers actually farm-out adjustments, set-ups and repairs. Even if a Dealer sports a sign in their shop that says 'Authorized', it's no guarantee that the person who actually works on your axe (or amp) is experienced &/or properly qualified to do so.


Last edited by Guitarman1117 on Fri Mar 06, 2009 3:47 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 3:41 pm
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I had to do it!

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Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 3:46 pm
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You are right! I insist that a guitar I am buying get a full and complete setup by a well know tech, in these parts ,at no cost, before any money passes hands! It's a shame but that's the way you have to do it these days!


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Posted: Fri Mar 06, 2009 3:47 pm
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cvilleira wrote:
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I had to do it!


And you still didn't get the Beef!! :lol:


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Posted: Sat Mar 07, 2009 1:13 pm
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hahaha! I agree with you :)

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Posted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 1:52 pm
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I recall not too long ago my local shop offered a free setup within the 1st year (you had to buy strings). The last time I bought a guitar (2 since October) they told me they don't do it anymore. I bought a cheap guitar to figure out how to do it myself instead!

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Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 10:14 am
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Location: So far out there, it's unbelievable!
I bought my son an Epi SG (his hearts desire) for Christmas and was told they don't do setups on "less expensive" guitars. OK, I agree it wasn't a Gibby SG but it was still $700!! Luckily, it came setup well enough from the factory to not be a problem.

Years ago, I bought a Yamaki 12 string from a Mom & Pop music store. The guy went to the warehouse and TUNED MANY 12 STRINGS before he selected one for me. He said, "I think you'll find this guitar to be quite sweet". It has been an absolutely beautiful playing and sounding guitar (for about $300).

I find it difficult to just write this off as, "a sign of the times", but I guess that's about it.

Gridlok :(


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Post subject: Re: Where's the Beef?
Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 11:52 am
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This is just my opinion as always, but personally I think people have unrealistic expectations in regards to this issue. Most guitars today including Fender and Gibson are mass produced...they are cranked out on an assembly line, given a very basic setup and then stuff in a warehouse. After that they are shipped and/or reshipped to the stores where they will hopefully find a good home. During that storing and shipping process they get knocked around, exposed to extreme temperatures, get knocked around some more and in many cases are still going thru the drying process...it's no wonder the setups often suck when they hit the show room floor. More over, most of your big music stores such as Guitar Center and Sam Ash are -volume- dealers...they ship them in and sell 'em. That's how it works. For better or worse and right or wrong, most music stores don't do much to an instrument (if anything at all) before it hits the sales floor. Now a days it's about volume and discount pricing. Let's face it here...if you owned that music store, are you really going to pay a good, qualified tech up to $40 an hour or more to setup -every- guitar that hits that sales floor especially when the bulk of those instruments are only in the $400-$800 range? That's just poor business sense.

Now beyond that, the OP said here that he paid $172 for that setup and that "it was well worth it" but the question in my mind is would you pay that extra amount for the guitar if it had of been setup properly in the first place? Let's be honest here...with all the snarking that's been going on around here over Fender's recent price increase, let's say that guitar was $500. Would most people really pay close to $700 for the same guitar just for the setup? Think about it...let's say that we had two guitars that were otherwise identical sitting on the shelf....same color, same neck, same pickups, etc.. One of them was $500 and the other was $672 and the -only- difference was the setup...a lot of, if not most folks would go for the cheaper instrument.

This is one of the reason's I do my own setups. Not only do I get my guitar set the way -I- like it, I also know what to look for when I'm shopping for a new instrument (and whether or not I can fix it). This is also why, with only 1 exception, I've never bought a guitar without playing it first. The OP didn't notice the "action was terrible" until after he got it home? I can tell you -in the store- usually within 30 seconds if there's a problem with the action!!! The nut was cracked, neck was warped and the fretboard was separated and again this wasn't noticed until after the instrument was brought home? I'm sorry but these aren't things you can really blame the store or the manufacturer for...if a person didn't notice these things before they bought the guitar, that person only has him/her self to blame. If said person had of seen this -before- they payed for the guitar, then they would have a right to complain and insist these issues were dealt with of but to gripe about it after you bought it? I'm sorry...did the sales guy have a gun to your head as -he- pulled your Visa or Mastercard out of your wallet? Dude...no one forced you to buy that guitar in that condition!

Setups are easy enough for most people to fix if they take a little time and learn how to do it right. Even the issues mentioned here aren't -that- hard to repair. Still, if a person buys a guitar that doesn't play right to them or is so excited that they don't notice something is cracked, damaged or broken...you can NOT blame the store for that. To me this is very much like the old woman who spilled hot coffee in her lap and then sued McDonalds over her own stupidity. If you're not going to inspect, let alone play the damn thing before you buy it, then suck it up and take responsibility for your own actions (or in this case lack of action). If you bought it from a store like that, you don't have anyone to blame but yourself.

Again just my opinion,
Jim


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Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 12:20 pm
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If they don't do a free setup, I just don't buy it! Simple! Now I don't expect them to set up a $200 guitar! Like you said they would have to hire a full time tech just for "stop dreaming" strats or teles. That makes no sense. But a quality guitar....... :!:


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Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 8:55 pm
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The problem with expecting guitars to be set up perfectly out of the box is that a set up that I like isn't necessarily one you like. I don't like my action too low--some people like it barely off the fingerboard.

We all have different size & shape hands, arms, bodies, etc.

We all have different expectations and preferences--so how can there be a universal set up?

I think stores should be willing to set a guitar up to your preferences when you buy it from them--a few still do.

As for your other beefs--those do suck.

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Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:06 pm
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Back in '92 when I bought my Strat, the shop included a set up. They asked me what string gauge I wanted to play and if I preferred a high or low action. If I couldn't decide then and there what I wanted, they said I could take it home and bring it back a few weeks later to be set up at no cost to myself. As it was my first electric I thought this was a great service.

When I bought my Tele earlier this year I was basically handed the guitar in the gig bag and sent on my way. I rang them a while back to enquire about a set up and was told it would cost $80 plus strings and take about 3 weeks. It was then I decided to do it myself but I guess it's just another example of businesses trying to increase fairly thin profit margins by any means.

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Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:13 pm
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All the good shops will offer a free setup with purchase of a good guitar like fhop said. Though I suggest People learn to do it themself.

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Post subject:
Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 9:46 pm
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A great resource for learning to do your own set ups is Dan Erlewine's Guitar Player Repair Guide.

http://www.danerlewine.com/guitar_repair_books.html

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