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Posted: Sat Mar 07, 2009 4:44 pm
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Snowy72 wrote:
Image Nuff said. :lol:



Nice one Snowy.. :lol: :lol: :lol: another winner.

Hey Snowy, check out that 'What was it like for you ' thread.
I've stuck in some David John and the Mood.. 8)

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Last edited by Rhumba on Sat Mar 07, 2009 4:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Posted: Sat Mar 07, 2009 4:47 pm
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Rhumba wrote:
Snowy72 wrote:
Image Nuff said. :lol:



Nice one Snowy.. :lol: :lol: :lol: another winner.

Cheers Rhumba, you know what to do mate :wink: :lol:


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Posted: Sat Mar 07, 2009 4:51 pm
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Snowy, Look above again. My last post.

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Posted: Sat Mar 07, 2009 5:14 pm
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Gotcha Rhumba, missed it first time round. Off to have a butchers now, cheers.


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Posted: Sat Mar 07, 2009 8:42 pm
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Having no ties to Britain other than a century-removed English ancestry, I like the idea.

I also notice that most of the posts by people against royalty are Americans who've never lived under it.

Opposite could be said of me, of course.


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Posted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 1:50 am
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Dear oh dear: hate to waste energy on this thread, but a bee is buzzing in my bonnet and must be let out, I'm afraid.

Niki, with the deepest friendly respect, this really is twaddle:

nikininja wrote:
...We dont have the right to free speech in the UK (its never been made law)...


Without in any way wanting to curtail your freedom of speech, it might be wise to think twice before writing that sort of thing in a place where people may not know any better and might take it at face value.

As briefly as possible, we in fact have plenty of freedom of speech rights and legislation in the UK (which may have something to do with why we also have the most vociforous and least restrained of any press in the world).

Beginning with the much misquoted Magna Carta in 1215, and more importantly the 1689 Bill of Rights (a significant source for America's own Bill of Rights a century later).

Unlike in America, the British constitution is an agglomeration of acts of Parliament, case law and court judgements, as well as international law to which we are signatories. So a major part of our modern human rights and freedom of speech derives from the 1948 Universal Declaration of Human Rights, as well as the European Convention on Human Rights, which are in turn modified by our own most recent 1998 Human Rights Act.

Niki, if you care to disagree - you have an enshrined right to do so. And you'll find plenty of law to protect you.

Now. I'm going back to discussing guitars on this guitar website... :D

Cheers - C


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Posted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 6:55 pm
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I detest the Royal Family.
Racist, past it, anti-Catholic (only Protestants can take the throne despite the high percentage of Catholics in the four nations of the UK), and have a mind set still in the middle ages and do nothing because of their blood line. Just a high profile benefits bunch.
Don't want to offend any fellow Brits who feel otherwise though. To each there own.
They are an ugly lot though......
CC


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Posted: Sun Mar 08, 2009 7:20 pm
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The BBC news, the family of Dr david Kelly and many others would disagree also.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-488667/Why-I-know-weapons-expert-Dr-David-Kelly-murdered-MP-spent-year-investigating-death.html

Whilst freedom of speech may be part of the magnacarta such laws have been ammended to the point of irrelevance. Yes i do admit my mistake in saying its not law in the uk.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freedom_of_speech_by_country#United_Kingdom

Theres plenty of chance to test the waters of your freedom on a daily basis. Ask Abu Hamza.

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Posted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 5:49 am
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nikininja wrote:
Theres plenty of chance to test the waters of your freedom on a daily basis. Ask Abu Hamza.


Excuse me??!!

You're basing an argument about freedom of speech on Abu Hamza??

For those who don't know, Abu Hamza is a fanatical Muslim hate preacher who has operated in London for many years, delivering endless sermons on the theme of "death to America", the destruction of Israel, holocaust denial, hatred of Jews, homosexuals, women in bikinis etc etc. All of which is vile but none of which is illegal in the UK under our freedom of speech laws. In Germany, for example, holocaust denial is a crime.

Hamza was finally jailed in 2004 and in 2006 found guilty on 11 counts, including six charges of soliciting murder; three charges related to "stirring up racial hatred"; one charge of owning recordings related to "stirring up racial hatred"; and one charge of possessing the "terrorist encyclopaedia". Also, bizarrely, two public nudity offences. He us currently serving a seven year jail sentence.

On the subject of freedom of speech, at that trial the judge said: "You are entitled to your views and in this country you are entitled to express them, but only up to the point where you incite murder or use language calculated to incite racial hatred. That is what you did."

Juicy details here:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4690224.stm

On which point, our laws are a deal more liberal than those of many of our friends and neighbors. The criticism America, Germany, France and others have of us is that we've allowed this truly obnoxious human to speak his grotesque mind for far too long under our in fact very permissive free speech laws.

Abu Hamza is wanted in America on terrorism charges. Again, our exhaustively scrupulous laws have meant that it has taken the US five years to finally win extradition here - however, as we are signatories of the European Convention on Human Rights it is likely that the case will now go to the European Court on Human Rights (Europe's supreme court) before he can finally be put on a plane out of here:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7521108.stm

Niki, when he eventually goes on trial in America you will perhaps be posting here on how the US is now abusing Hamza's freedom of speech?

Wouldn't it be a good idea to use this Forum for discussing guitars instead...?

Cheers - C


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Post subject: Re: The Royal Family
Posted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 6:24 am
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Ceri wrote:
Gosh! And I've taken such care to be scrupulously polite about your heads of state, despite all the tempting opportunities they provide to the contrary...!!

I wasn't taking any shots by starting this thread. It was simply legitimate curiousity. I apologize if you saw it any other way or was disrepectful.

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Post subject: Re: The Royal Family
Posted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 6:58 am
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01GT eibach wrote:
Ceri wrote:
Gosh! And I've taken such care to be scrupulously polite about your heads of state, despite all the tempting opportunities they provide to the contrary...!!

I wasn't taking any shots by starting this thread. It was simply legitimate curiousity. I apologize if you saw it any other way or was disrepectful.


Hi 01GT eibach: on political threads on this site (particularly during the long lead up to your recent Presidential election) I've seen all kinds of opinions hotly contested. The one thing that seems to unite all Americans here is that they get very touchy about outsiders commenting on their politics.

I recall Paulie from Ireland making a very straightforward point over your previous President's foreign policy, for example. He was shouted down from all sides and sent away with a flea in his ear.

Probably all of us know less about the politics of other countries than we would like to think. A good idea then to exercise too much care and respect on these matters rather than too little.

Or just discuss guitars on a guitar website: then the only nationalisms aroused will be on the exhausting subject of MIMs v MIAs!

Cheers - C


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Posted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 7:14 am
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Ceri i wasnt advocating his actions and in no way condone any of his sick hatred. Quite frankly i'm surprised that you would insinuate that i in some way feel sympathy for old hookhand. Why hasn't Nick Griffin of the BNP been sent off to guantanamo bay or some other detention facility for exactly the same reason? Its a simple fact that his freedom of speech was impeached as was David Kelly's, the BBC's on their reporting of his death and the whole Hutton enquiry. No where on this planet does the complete freedom to speak whatever you want, exist. Look at the last clarkson debacle where he insulted our chief loon. Apologize now and we'll all act like you didnt say it, then it will all go away. Or lose your career. Thats hardly freedom just more cowering by the BBC for fear of further punishment. He didnt even make the statement in the UK.

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Posted: Mon Mar 09, 2009 7:40 am
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nikininja wrote:
Ceri i wasnt advocating his actions and in no way condone any of his sick hatred. Quite frankly i'm surprised that you would insinuate that i in some way feel sympathy for old hookhand.


Hi Niki: I wasn't in the slightest supposing that you sympathise in any way with Abu Hamza. I believe I know you better than that!

However, you were suggesting that his freedom of speech has been curtailed in some way, either by a lack of law or by too much.

In fact, neither is the case. Hamza, like Nick Griffin (for those who don't know, the leader of a neo-nazi party), has been tollerated endlessly whilst spouting the most obnoxious drivel and would have been allowed to go on doing so. Much to the annoyance of many other countries, such as the US, who would have wished our laws a tad less tollerant.

Hamza has been imprisoned for inciting murder - which if you've ever heard his speeches is an understatement. (He is widely believed to have assisted the 7/7 bombers, but that has not been proved and not why he's in prison.) Under our laws you are allowed to believe and say any grotesque nonsense you want: you are not allowed to actively encourage violence against others. That's what he's been convicted of; not merely speaking his mind.

If any Americans have lasted this far through this arcane conversation you must be holding your heads in confusion. Take heed: Hamza's extradition case is creeping towards its conclusion. The Abu Hamza roadshow will be coming to the US soon! You're going to be hearing a whole lot more of this unpleasant character - get ready!

Cheers - C


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Posted: Tue Mar 10, 2009 8:58 pm
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Gettin a bit heavy lads....... lets get back to the guitars.

I'm a part American Scotsman in N. Ireland. I don't come here for politics dudes.

I do agree however that Americans are quick to tell everyone to keep their noses out of their affairs, so as a half-American, half- Brit..... LIKEWISE!!!

Guitar time guys.

........ In the words of Mr Rose ''I don't need no Civil War''.
CC


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Posted: Wed Mar 11, 2009 5:49 am
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Celtic Cyclonus wrote:
Guitar time guys.

........ In the words of Mr Rose ''I don't need no Civil War''.
CC


Hi Celtic Cyclonus: I do hope the last few posts have been in a spirit of friendly conversation: I have nothing but the warmest feelings towards The Ninja.

However: on politics v guitars, I totally agree with you! Much the best idea.

Movin' on...

Cheers - C


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