It is currently Tue Mar 17, 2020 2:46 am

All times are UTC - 7 hours



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 5 posts ] 
Author Message
Post subject: Preamp/power amp vs head/combo amp (long)
Posted: Tue Dec 09, 2008 9:25 am
Offline
Aspiring Musician
Aspiring Musician

Joined: Thu Nov 20, 2008 9:21 am
Posts: 527
Hi guys,

Lets Here your opinions

History:

When I bought my amp, it was early to mid 90's. At the time there were many preamps to choose from. I really thought that the preamp/power amp/cab combo was the way to go. You could mate any preamp to any poweramp which I felt gave the best of tonal possibilities and flexibility. I bought two preamps at different times, the ADA MP-2, which I think has great tones and seems unsurpassed even today in the world of all analog tube preamps, and the Digitech 2101, which also seemed to have everything. I choose the mesa 50/50 for my power amp, and a marshall AV 1960 4x12 cab. As you may be able to tell, I prefer all tube preamp and power amp designs. I prefer my ADA to the Digitech for high gain pure tone, but the 2101 may have better clean and has all the effects.

When I tried some tube heads and combo amps, I felt that most of them were one to two trick ponies. At the time the Marshall JCM 900, the mesa trem-o-verb, were a couple that I remember trying. The marshall I was disappointed in, since some of my favorite tones came from people using Marshall, but I did not find those tones in the store. It did not have the gain at low volume. It seemed to be more geared toward live settings and high volumes only, and would not make a great practice amp at low volume. The mesa was very cool, but I felt it would still be a downgrade considering the versitility and tones of my setup.

The only benefit to heads and combos, that I found was ease of use, and I was comfortable using my preamps, so that was not an issue for me.

So fast forward to today, the retro amp craze killed ADA, RIP, and now many companys have scaled down or quit making tube preamps all together. I have seen some new amps that look very promising, and have heard that new marshall heads have more gain and better clean tones, and mesa does not make the trem-o-verb any more, which was a dual rectifier. The new version is scaled down and is a single rectifier. My brother bought a mesa F50 combo a few years ago, and I do not find that it sounds better than my setup. It's more of a two trick pony.

My feeling is that if I ever do get tired of the tones of my preamps, though I have had them for 14 (Digitech) and 12 years (ADA) and can still find new good tones, I can just buy a new preamp. While I am happy with my amps, I am starting to wonder if I am missing something.

So with all that, what is your opinion? Why is the preamp/ power amp route almost non-existent? I know its still out there, but seems more rare today. Why have musicians/amp manufactures gone away from this. Would I find superior tone looking at new amps and comparing to my setup? Or will my system still hold its own. At the time, the salesperson, said that my amp was the way to go over a head or combo and I agreed based on my experience, is this still true?

Based on my experience my system is still superior or equal to others out there, but my experience is limited.

_________________
Guitars:
1. mid 70's Ventura MIJ Gibson l6-s clone (Pre-lawsuit) in Black with Rosewood FB and EMG 81 BR/ 85 Neck
2. ESP KH2 Neck Thru
3. 2008 Am Std Strat in 3 tone sunburst


Top
Profile
Fender Play Winter Sale 2020
Post subject:
Posted: Tue Dec 09, 2008 10:45 am
Offline
Rock Icon
Rock Icon
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 30, 2008 10:47 am
Posts: 15336
Location: In a galaxy far far away
I think its all down to trend and ease. What gigging guitarist playing the local ,toilet circuits wants to be lugging a rack around? Who needs the variety of sounds that rack gear provides. Im not trying to slight rack gear in the slightest, If i'd bought a mp2 or the more maligned mp1 i'd not part with em for anything. Its the best highgain sound on the planet.
Great, yes. practical, not to everyone.

_________________
No no and no


Top
Profile
Post subject:
Posted: Tue Dec 09, 2008 11:51 am
Offline
Aspiring Musician
Aspiring Musician

Joined: Thu Nov 20, 2008 9:21 am
Posts: 527
Thanks Nikinija

I think the Mp-2 is more maligned than the MP-1. I think it was the best preamp made at its time and to this day. Where else can you find 10 completely distinct tube voices in one amp...litterally like a 10 channel amp. The mp-1 has two tube and one solid state clean. I think the bad reviews from these were from people that only tried the presets instead of approaching it like an amp and tweaking their own sound out of it. All the presets are over processed sounding. I know better than to judge these preamps by their presets, they never sound good to me. But I found that the mp-2 had all the tone of the mp-1 and much more. Including even more gain. Its too bad, as I am sure ADA would have made some even greater preamps. There is a youtube video out there where a guy a/b's his triple rectifiers preamp with his ada mp-2. They sound so close, only a true tone snob would here the difference. To me, the ada was better than the triple pre, it had that extra something that is the ADA lead tone....probably some diode clipping with the tubes, but just a tad of that ADA sound. The ADA in that video seems to lack nothing and add a little something, but that is my opinion, and i am biased

You're right, I will never get rid of my ADA. I hope it does not ever completely die. i also hope to add an MP-1. There is a website, adadepot, where the ADA's have quite a following. The mp-1 has a lot of modifications available these days. I never thought they needed much modification. On ebay, you will see that ADA's equipment has been pulling more $$$ lately. They were dirt cheap there a few years ago.

_________________
Guitars:
1. mid 70's Ventura MIJ Gibson l6-s clone (Pre-lawsuit) in Black with Rosewood FB and EMG 81 BR/ 85 Neck
2. ESP KH2 Neck Thru
3. 2008 Am Std Strat in 3 tone sunburst


Top
Profile
Post subject:
Posted: Tue Dec 09, 2008 1:16 pm
Offline
Rock Icon
Rock Icon
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 30, 2008 10:47 am
Posts: 15336
Location: In a galaxy far far away
its hard to find any high gain pre-amp that doesnt have some kind of diode clipping going on alongside the tubes.
Of course in the 80's/90's what everybody forgot about racks was the power amp. You cant just have a good preamp and a radioshack poweramp. Thats why you use the mesa eh?

_________________
No no and no


Top
Profile
Post subject:
Posted: Tue Dec 09, 2008 1:49 pm
Offline
Aspiring Musician
Aspiring Musician

Joined: Thu Nov 20, 2008 9:21 am
Posts: 527
Yea, the mesa is the heart and sould of my rig. A lot of tone starts in the preamp section though, but it does not begin and end there. Its starts in the fingers and ends through the speaker, and everything along the way has an effect on the tone. Before using the mesa, I used a ADA microtube 200, that used preamp tubes in the gain structure to get a warmer sound. When I upgraded to the mesa, my sound was similar, but much larger, warmer and more natural sounding. The high end seemed rolled off, which to me was less harsh sounding. The other thing was at half the power rating of the ADA, the mesa seems twice as loud. With that though, I have not heard anything make an ADA pre sound bad, or heard an amp that an ada pre did not make sound better.

I was glad to hear you say that the high gain sound of ADA is the best on the planet, because I have not found anything better either. Sometimes when playing I think that maybe it could be better, but I have not heard it yet, and ADA has been out of business for over 10 years now. Is there a amp that gets as much high gain while keeping focus on the individual notes better? I have tried Soldano, mesa, marshall, Digitech, rocktron ect. None have made me want to get rid of the ada, though I did like some of them very much. My buddy bought an mp-2 after hearing mine. He was using the Soldano prior. I think its called the SP77 pre???

_________________
Guitars:
1. mid 70's Ventura MIJ Gibson l6-s clone (Pre-lawsuit) in Black with Rosewood FB and EMG 81 BR/ 85 Neck
2. ESP KH2 Neck Thru
3. 2008 Am Std Strat in 3 tone sunburst


Top
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 5 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 7 hours

Fender Play Winter Sale 2020

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: stratmangler and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: