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Post subject: Are any of you guys drummers also?
Posted: Tue May 08, 2018 6:54 am
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Aspiring Musician
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For a while now I have thought about starting to play drums also. Are any of you guys drummers in addition to guitarists? The vast pile of drum kit pieces is confusing. What does one really need for a basic beginning kit?

What should I avoid in equipment etc.

thanks
OL

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Post subject: Re: Are any of you guys drummers also?
Posted: Tue May 08, 2018 12:11 pm
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Well, I had a guitar first, became a military drummer which evolved into rock and jazz, and I still have my 60s kit, although that has changed over the years. I know others here are also drummers. Today my guitars get more love, but the drums are a great workout and handy when needed.

With drum kits you can go big or small from the beginning. The following is MHO and based on my experience only. YMMV.

1) First know that there is a fine line difference between a percussionist and a beat the skins drummer.

Are you going just for looks, nuances and sound, or both with or without compromise? For recording, live performance, small rooms or . . ?

2) If you intend on building a big kit over time, look to major brands, and check the history of the finishes because there is no assurance yours will be available down the road (as I found out with my custom set with a finish that was popular for years at the time).

3) A good basic set includes a kick/bass (22” for rock or in my case a 20” for convenience and recording), one tom tom (larger than smaller preferred - 12”” is good - mine are 12” and 14”), one 16” floor tom (add an 18” or more only you are planning to have that . . . don’t put it off because you might miss out. One is common. and even the best drummers can handle that)(I’m now using a new 16” LP Brazilian Raw Street Can rather than a kit’s floor tom). One snare (with the kit or the best you can afford now or later because it is the key to your mojo)(My kit is 60s Premier but my snare is a 60s Rogers for example).

4) I like to keep my cymbal sizes 2” to 4” between the crash and ride when they are equal builds. In other words, I like the resonance to flow if that makes any sense. The same would hold true for a mismatching of type or make of cymbals. A difference for effect (such as a splash) speaks for itself. You can go with what the kit provides at first and upgrade later.

Cymbal packages are often a helpful way to go. A good choice with exceptions is to stick with major brands like Zildjian, SABIAN, Paiste, and Meinl. It is important to know that there are entry level (usually thinner) versions in each manufacturer’s lines and counterfeit ones. It gets complicated, but in yesteryear cymbals like my heavy Avedis Zildjians with a darker sound were the rage, and many today choose the brighter sound from somewhere between light and heavy. My ultra thin Paiste high-hats (my Zildjians were stolen) bent from use as a comparison. However, it’s your sound that counts. Bottom line . . . you usually get what you pay for here. Good used ones are available, but check the pricing. Also, consider that a base set of expensive cymbals may have you wishing your next one wasn’t coming in at a high price tag. :wink:
14” - 16” high-hat cymbals are common, 1 crash cymbal 16” - 18”, 1 ride 18” - 20” or any similar combo more or less will be a good start. My crash/ride is 18” and my ride is 24”. That wasn’t my original setup, so another in between size cymbal is in the works. One cymbal will do, two are common, three is all one needs to get a variety, more are cool and funky. Cool funky splash and Chinese cymbals, etc, are possible later.

5) Pedals - with the kit to start and better as you progress need be. Same with hardware.

6) Don’t get caught up with the blah blah about construction and materials. If it’s solid and sounds good it usually is. Metal. Acrylic, Wood have all been successfully used. Stick with brands with a reputation and you should be good to go. Check on drummer forums and YouTube for more.

Don’t forget the cowbell and the metronome! :lol:

FSB

Frank Zappa, Dave Grohl, Chris Cornell and Jack Endino of Soundgarden, Don Henley, Prince, Phil Collins, Jack Hanna (Nitty Gritty Dirt Band), Steve Lukather (Toto), Santana, and the list goes on of guitarist/drummers. :wink:

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Post subject: Re: Are any of you guys drummers also?
Posted: Tue May 08, 2018 5:43 pm
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Roadie
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I tried to be a drummer in the first place, but my I.Q. was too high.














:twisted: :lol: :mrgreen: kidding


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Post subject: Re: Are any of you guys drummers also?
Posted: Tue May 08, 2018 9:02 pm
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Sérgio wrote:
I tried to be a drummer in the first place, but my I.Q. was too high.















:twisted: :lol: :mrgreen: kidding

Your IQ was too high? That’s what you get for standing on a stool. :lol:
Just kidding :P
Funny you brought that up though, Sérgio. I ran into this earlier today. But, out of respect for my fellow Lizards I decided not to post it. Now I’m forced to release it:

https://consequenceofsound.net/2015/10/ ... body-else/

Now ya know. Hahaha.

Dang! I’m half drummer and half geetarist. That makes me only half as brilliant or is that twice as smart? :roll:
Really just kiddin’.
Ka-Ching!
ROTFL :lol:

FSB

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Post subject: Re: Are any of you guys drummers also?
Posted: Wed May 09, 2018 4:54 am
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Decent intelligence is a prerequisite to having good meter.
So, there goes your theory up in smoke.

:wink:

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Post subject: Re: Are any of you guys drummers also?
Posted: Wed May 09, 2018 6:51 am
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I was a drummer first, for over 20 years, my first band experiences were all as a drummer. At some point I picked up a bass from a friend who needed to sell some gear to raise funds.

I sold my last drum set in 1990, just before I got married, I had promised my bride that I would do all I could to settle my debts before we walked the aisle. I had a Simmons kit that I loved but owed a bunch of $$ on so I sold it. Over the last 28 years of marriage I remind her with a smile that I could have saved alot of $$ over time by keeping the drums and not getting married.... :lol:

The one lasting legacy to my time as a drummer is that I think it made it far easier for me to work with a drummer once I started seriously playing bass.


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Post subject: Re: Are any of you guys drummers also?
Posted: Wed May 09, 2018 6:55 am
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Don’t Sheldon up, guys, I was kidding...

Btw what’s the origin of the lizard thing we see often here?


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Post subject: Re: Are any of you guys drummers also?
Posted: Wed May 09, 2018 8:36 am
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BMW-KTM wrote:
Decent intelligence is a prerequisite to having good meter.
So, there goes your theory up in smoke.

:wink:

Actually, Matt . . . It’s not my theory at all. This all comes from respected experts at Oxford and Harvard. :P It’s as much of a surprise to me as it is to you.

Besides, you know that saying “they march to the beat of a different drummer”? I once led the Calgary Stampede Parade with 16 Naval drummers in front of a bagpipe band that was out of step with us, and that is a challenge in itself. Fortunately, we had 80 musicians assembled from across Canada to back us up. The beat was synchronized. 8)
Drummers invented languages that could be used across distances. Leo Fender did not play the guitar. He did play sax and a piano which is technically a percussion instrument. He pioneered the design and production of the electric guitar. Hmmm. Pretty smart guy.

Drums were a catalyst in the invention of the electric guitar. It was. to some degree, because of them (not in spite of them) that guitar amplification was created. Guitarists have always tried to be louder; hence Spinal Tap’s 11 on the volume knob and my 150 Watts amp next to my traps. :lol:
Are there crap drummers out there? Absolutely. How about crap guitarists? Yep! I’m not great at either, contrary to my fans who might disagree. Here’s the difference. There are drummers who can’t keep a tempo. There are guitarists that fall into the same category. A drummer that keeps a beat is a pleasure, but a guitarist who does the same without musicality is torture. :shock: No contest.

When you get right down to it, percussion has been around a lot longer than string instruments, and there were intelligent men and women back then. Who knows? Maybe a curious drummer invented the first string instrument. Maybe it was a snare. :lol: Kinda looks like a banjo. :lol: I know it wasn’t the other way around. :wink:
Kaboom! :lol:
FSB

Are you sure you wanna take up the drums OL? You’ll be in for a lot of this hurt and razzin’ even though multiple drum notation is harder to follow than a chord or tab book. That's why I went back to the guitar. I ain’t no Neil Peart. But, if I were . . . Whoo Boy! Ha ha!

Peace brothers.
It’s all in fun and all good.
FSB

Thanks, for chimin’ in, Chris.

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Post subject: Re: Are any of you guys drummers also?
Posted: Wed May 09, 2018 9:00 am
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Sérgio wrote:
Don’t Sheldon up, guys, I was kidding...

Btw what’s the origin of the lizard thing we see often here?

Hey, Serg’. Lizard can be a good reference or a nasty one. Often it comes down to one who is about to seduce another on a parking lot or in a bar for reasons that include cash or to be included with the wealthy. But, many other meanings aren’t always so risqué, and it looks to be the gathering of a group with common interests.

Here is one example that likely applies here in the Forum where the term has been around for some time:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lounge_lizard

Hard to say when the term first came about in the Forum, maybe another can verify it; but, Beaubs, a friend of ours here in the Forum, looks to have kick started the term here with the Topic:

https://forums.fender.com/viewtopic.php ... ds#p575041

FSB

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Post subject: Re: Are any of you guys drummers also?
Posted: Wed May 09, 2018 9:03 am
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Thank you!!


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Post subject: Re: Are any of you guys drummers also?
Posted: Wed May 09, 2018 9:28 am
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Sérgio wrote:
Thank you!!
You’re welcome. :D

Have a great day!
FSB

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Post subject: Re: Are any of you guys drummers also?
Posted: Wed May 09, 2018 11:49 am
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God help us, me playing drums would be like nothing any one would ever want to suffer through. I thank the lord for my band mates that have play drums with me. If not for them,,,... - I digress.. do carry on..


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Post subject: Re: Are any of you guys drummers also?
Posted: Wed May 09, 2018 12:04 pm
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Fender Strat Brat wrote:
Funny you brought that up though, Sérgio. I ran into this earlier today. But, out of respect for my fellow Lizards I decided not to post it. Now I’m forced to release it:

https://consequenceofsound.net/2015/10/ ... body-else/

Now ya know. Hahaha.

FSB

Thanks Sérgio. Look what you made FSB do. And I was just starting to feel good about myself. :lol:

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Post subject: Re: Are any of you guys drummers also?
Posted: Wed May 09, 2018 12:04 pm
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BTW - great info, FSB!

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Post subject: Re: Are any of you guys drummers also?
Posted: Wed May 09, 2018 12:47 pm
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Fender Strat Brat wrote:
Well, I had a guitar first, became a military drummer which evolved into rock and jazz, and I still have my 60s kit, although that has changed over the years. I know others here are also drummers. Today my guitars get more love, but the drums are a great workout and handy when needed.

With drum kits you can go big or small from the beginning. The following is MHO and based on my experience only. YMMV.

1) First know that there is a fine line difference between a percussionist and a beat the skins drummer.

Are you going just for looks, nuances and sound, or both with or without compromise? For recording, live performance, small rooms or . . ?

2) If you intend on building a big kit over time, look to major brands, and check the history of the finishes because there is no assurance yours will be available down the road (as I found out with my custom set with a finish that was popular for years at the time).

3) A good basic set includes a kick/bass (22” for rock or in my case a 20” for convenience and recording), one tom tom (larger than smaller preferred - 12”” is good - mine are 12” and 14”), one 16” floor tom (add an 18” or more only you are planning to have that . . . don’t put it off because you might miss out. One is common. and even the best drummers can handle that)(I’m now using a new 16” LP Brazilian Raw Street Can rather than a kit’s floor tom). One snare (with the kit or the best you can afford now or later because it is the key to your mojo)(My kit is 60s Premier but my snare is a 60s Rogers for example).

4) I like to keep my cymbal sizes 2” to 4” between the crash and ride when they are equal builds. In other words, I like the resonance to flow if that makes any sense. The same would hold true for a mismatching of type or make of cymbals. A difference for effect (such as a splash) speaks for itself. You can go with what the kit provides at first and upgrade later.

Cymbal packages are often a helpful way to go. A good choice with exceptions is to stick with major brands like Zildjian, SABIAN, Paiste, and Meinl. It is important to know that there are entry level (usually thinner) versions in each manufacturer’s lines and counterfeit ones. It gets complicated, but in yesteryear cymbals like my heavy Avedis Zildjians with a darker sound were the rage, and many today choose the brighter sound from somewhere between light and heavy. My ultra thin Paiste high-hats (my Zildjians were stolen) bent from use as a comparison. However, it’s your sound that counts. Bottom line . . . you usually get what you pay for here. Good used ones are available, but check the pricing. Also, consider that a base set of expensive cymbals may have you wishing your next one wasn’t coming in at a high price tag. :wink:
14” - 16” high-hat cymbals are common, 1 crash cymbal 16” - 18”, 1 ride 18” - 20” or any similar combo more or less will be a good start. My crash/ride is 18” and my ride is 24”. That wasn’t my original setup, so another in between size cymbal is in the works. One cymbal will do, two are common, three is all one needs to get a variety, more are cool and funky. Cool funky splash and Chinese cymbals, etc, are possible later.

5) Pedals - with the kit to start and better as you progress need be. Same with hardware.

6) Don’t get caught up with the blah blah about construction and materials. If it’s solid and sounds good it usually is. Metal. Acrylic, Wood have all been successfully used. Stick with brands with a reputation and you should be good to go. Check on drummer forums and YouTube for more.

Don’t forget the cowbell and the metronome! :lol:

FSB


FSB,

Thanks for the information.

I really want to start out fairly simple. I live in a small home and do not have a lot of extra room. Probably just play for my own pleasure and eventually add some drum to some melodies and songs of my own I am working on.

Mostly for my own pleasure and try and develop a better sense of timing and rhythm. Have been looking at a few sets on Guitar Center website. Ludwig is a name I know has been around a long time (GC does not sell that brand) and Pearl. GC sells complete sets but I don't have any idea what to buy. Again, I will not be on stage just at home but I don't want to be crap equipment or crap sound, but don't need to break the bank either. $600 -$1000 what could I get for that?

Thanks for your serious information.
OL

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