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Post subject: Samson C02 mics for Acoustic Recording?
Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 2:39 pm
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So I found a ($83) deal on a pair of new Samson C02 small-diaphragm super-cardioid pattern mics that I plan on using for recording acoustic guitar. I'm sure they're kind of junk, but for this price I figured I'd risk it... it's hot AF here in AZ and my brain is too overheated to think about things too much. Anyone use these mics for this? Thoughts? Advice? Also thought with the super-cardioid pattern, that the pair might work acceptably for recording voice with guitar... my AT2035 is great for vocals, but it is so wide that if I'm playing acoustic guitar, I have to live with a single track for both because of the bleed! Anyway, just curious... and I can always return them if they don't work out!

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Post subject: Re: Samson C02 mics for Acoustic Recording?
Posted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 8:19 pm
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Hey there, Mark. I have two of those mikes as overheads as part of the 7 drum mike kit that I got for a song on a Black Friday sale. Dynomite deal. Pro mikes are no stranger to me, and I know that there are better ones (even in Samson's lineup); but, these shine for the price IMO. Besides, in my case, aside from response, prices often include the differences between mounting options, cases, metal or plastic microphone bodies. Nice that these are metal, and I think they look good.

I have mine locked into position for which they were bought, however, many have complimented these mikes for the usage you have presented. Especially for acoustic. Obviously, being suitable for percussion, cymbals and so on, they can handle dynamics nicely. There is plenty on YouTube about these. YMMV. Here's two related vids:

Martin and Samson C02


Vocal with Samson C02. This one's mixed. but there is likely better dry vocal recordings out there somewhere. As a vocal mike my opinion is it may or may not work for you, Mark. Knowing that everyone's voice and performance is different (my voice for example is alto and I would like to have been more tenor) while others' vocal chords may fit with the C02s better or worse than mine. Is one a screamer or more of a Leonard Cohen per se? Is the mike going to be EQ'd or given effects live to recording or in post? I guess you'll have to give it a personal test. Anyhow, here's the vocal (again what the video does may be better or short selling the actual needs).


Cheers!
FSB
Someday, I may try them on the acoustic too :wink:

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Post subject: Re: Samson C02 mics for Acoustic Recording?
Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 10:41 am
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Cool, FSB! Sounds really promising!

I had been using some knock-off SM57's, but with my Tascam DP-008EX, the channels had to be gained up pretty high for these and it introduced some hiss... I think it was more a problem with my Tascam than the cheep mics, but that's what I like recording with, so needed to change something. With my AT2035 etc. and lower channel gain, the Tascam works really well... so, as I said, I did some really quick searches and reviews and came up with these as a low cost and potentially good addition to my "studio.

I'll post something when I get them up and running!

Best! :)

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Post subject: Re: Samson C02 mics for Acoustic Recording?
Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 12:14 pm
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That's great, Mark. Didn't mean to lecture about doing a demo for one's own decision 'cause I know you knew that. :D
There's just so many variables that one size doesn't fit all. Room response and recording gear, amongst other things, play a part, and I'd like to have a buck for every time somebody poo poos some gear that may do the trick in another scenario.

Most brands that have a reputation also have variations in their lineup. albeit the crap shoot odds may be better. It's like great cheap wine and crappy expensive wine. Sure a Neumann is a given, but mike technology has been around a long time. You never know what deal can be found just around the corner.

I've have an SM-57 Beta in my arsenal and SM-57 is a good example to use in this conversation. Not expensive and still not bargain basement. Here's a mike that plays nicely with drums and other instruments. The new design is said to improve the vocal application when compared to the original SM-57. It's hard to deny the success of the original though, and many prefer the older over the new. This could also be because of the large investment, and the plethora of SM-57s out there. As a vocal mike some voices and setups work best or are preferred with an SM-58 and, as much as snowball SM-58 gets all the vocal accolades, SM-57 has it's followers mostly based on vocal range and style. When I was younger I had some ATs that did the job too.

So, thanks for doing the groundwork on demoing the Samsons with guitar and vocal, Mark. Looking forward to your experience whatever the case.

Keep on keeping on.

FSB

I remember when Sony came out with an ECM 50 lavalier to compete with much larger lavaliers. Not only was it smaller than the RCAs, EVs, and others of the time, but it sounded so good. The mike was then discovered to pick up acoustics and a grand piano much better than expected even though more expensive and capable options were at hand.

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Post subject: Re: Samson C02 mics for Acoustic Recording?
Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 12:49 pm
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Hope they work out for you, Mark.

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Post subject: Re: Samson C02 mics for Acoustic Recording?
Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 1:57 pm
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BMW-KTM wrote:
Hope they work out for you, Mark.


^ What he said ^

I like condenser mics for tracking acoustic instruments. Audio Technica AT2020s work well for me.

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Post subject: Re: Samson C02 mics for Acoustic Recording?
Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 5:55 pm
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Thanks guys! And FSB, didn't take it as a "lecture," took it more a encouraging! :)

My AT2035 is working flawlessly, but wanted a couple other mic's.

Regarding the dynamic options, I have a very nice Sennheiser e835 as well as my cheap Chinese SM57 clone and it's mostly my recorder, but I'm not entirely happy with having to gain up the channels so much with either. With my AT2035, this is a zero issue as is the recorder when taking a lineout from my Mustang III amp... so we'll see!

:)

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Post subject: Re: Samson C02 mics for Acoustic Recording?
Posted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 11:00 am
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So I've gotten the mic's and think they're great for the price I got them for! Here is a mixed vocal + acoustic recording. The Super-Cardioid pattern made is much easier to isolate the vocal from guitar tracks! So even though perhaps not the ideal vocal mic, it worked out well from first setup. Regarding the AT2035... hard to get the separation when you consider that the guitar sound hole is only around 45 degrees from my pie-hole!



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=awcQbwOtMvA

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Post subject: Re: Samson C02 mics for Acoustic Recording?
Posted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 12:44 pm
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Sounds like a winner to me, Mark. My bias aside, I think the Samsons do a fine job, and are more than worth the money. Blind test comparisons have proven that.

The guitar sounded open and clean, and, although tone is subjective with one's preference, the result is better than some others out there (albeit we know that better always exists for a price). Frequency range seems adequate with room for EQ adjustment at both ends should that be preferred. I thought your guitar mike held it's own as is though. I might roll just a tiny bit off the top for long term listening, but I didn't find it harsh or uncomfortable. The dynamics of your guitar and string definition came across well.

The vocal came through really fine IMHO. In fact, I found it to be excellent, and I know that some more popular mikes could take a back seat. No noticeable sibilance, well handled plosives as when you vocalized 'People' at 1:16, and no breath annoyance to attend to. Nice. You never sounded off mike, and both mikes were quiet, especially suppressing room noise.

Others may not be in agreement, and mikes tend to have a characteristic of their own usually for critical ears, and less so for the average Joe. I think the C02s are fairly neutral. I know they're built well and they look nice (not unlike a well known German make). Now I know they sound excellent too. Good find, and well done demo. The fact that you can isolate the mike pick up from each other is a bonus, and evident with a better all recording. I look forward to using my C02s someday when they're not on my kit.

Thanks, for your post and song, Mark. Enjoy those C02s. Glad they worked for you. :D
Best
FSB

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Post subject: Re: Samson C02 mics for Acoustic Recording?
Posted: Wed Jun 28, 2017 1:23 pm
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mh2000 wrote:
So I've gotten the mic's and think they're great for the price I got them for! Here is a mixed vocal + acoustic recording. The Super-Cardioid pattern made is much easier to isolate the vocal from guitar tracks! So even though perhaps not the ideal vocal mic, it worked out well from first setup. Regarding the AT2035... hard to get the separation when you consider that the guitar sound hole is only around 45 degrees from my pie-hole!



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=awcQbwOtMvA


Thanks for adding the linkage, Mark.
That does work.

Nice rendition, FSB.

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Post subject: Re: Samson C02 mics for Acoustic Recording?
Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2017 1:13 pm
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Fender Strat Brat wrote:
Sounds like a winner to me, Mark. My bias aside, I think the Samsons do a fine job, and are more than worth the money. Blind test comparisons have proven that.

The guitar sounded open and clean, and, although tone is subjective with one's preference, the result is better than some others out there (albeit we know that better always exists for a price). Frequency range seems adequate with room for EQ adjustment at both ends should that be preferred. I thought your guitar mike held it's own as is though. I might roll just a tiny bit off the top for long term listening, but I didn't find it harsh or uncomfortable. The dynamics of your guitar and string definition came across well.

The vocal came through really fine IMHO. In fact, I found it to be excellent, and I know that some more popular mikes could take a back seat. No noticeable sibilance, well handled plosives as when you vocalized 'People' at 1:16, and no breath annoyance to attend to. Nice. You never sounded off mike, and both mikes were quiet, especially suppressing room noise.

Others may not be in agreement, and mikes tend to have a characteristic of their own usually for critical ears, and less so for the average Joe. I think the C02s are fairly neutral. I know they're built well and they look nice (not unlike a well known German make). Now I know they sound excellent too. Good find, and well done demo. The fact that you can isolate the mike pick up from each other is a bonus, and evident with a better all recording. I look forward to using my C02s someday when they're not on my kit.

Thanks, for your post and song, Mark. Enjoy those C02s. Glad they worked for you. :D
Best
FSB


Thanks for the detailed comments and encouragement, FSB! I'll work on rolling off the guitar a bit.

Getting these mic's has already made me wish I had started off with them! I'm really new to this and we get to where we are however we get there... and really, I started off using dynamic mic's because my first recorder didn't have phantom power (a dirt cheap used Tascam DP-006 I stumbled into). But did a little more recording with these and really loving them! I'll keep using my AT2035 for separately recorded tracks, but for the separation while playing and doing vocals, more than makes up for the perhaps not *quite* as good sound... everything is a compromise, right?

In the above recording, I was perhaps a little close to the mic, but did use a simple pop filter, but no foam windscreen.

Best!

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Post subject: Re: Samson C02 mics for Acoustic Recording?
Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2017 3:03 pm
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mh2000 wrote:
Fender Strat Brat wrote:
Sounds like a winner to me, Mark. My bias aside, I think the Samsons do a fine job, and are more than worth the money. Blind test comparisons have proven that.

The guitar sounded open and clean, and, although tone is subjective with one's preference, the result is better than some others out there (albeit we know that better always exists for a price). Frequency range seems adequate with room for EQ adjustment at both ends should that be preferred. I thought your guitar mike held it's own as is though. I might roll just a tiny bit off the top for long term listening, but I didn't find it harsh or uncomfortable. The dynamics of your guitar and string definition came across well.

The vocal came through really fine IMHO. In fact, I found it to be excellent, and I know that some more popular mikes could take a back seat. No noticeable sibilance, well handled plosives as when you vocalized 'People' at 1:16, and no breath annoyance to attend to. Nice. You never sounded off mike, and both mikes were quiet, especially suppressing room noise.

Others may not be in agreement, and mikes tend to have a characteristic of their own usually for critical ears, and less so for the average Joe. I think the C02s are fairly neutral. I know they're built well and they look nice (not unlike a well known German make). Now I know they sound excellent too. Good find, and well done demo. The fact that you can isolate the mike pick up from each other is a bonus, and evident with a better all recording. I look forward to using my C02s someday when they're not on my kit.

Thanks, for your post and song, Mark. Enjoy those C02s. Glad they worked for you. :D
Best
FSB


Thanks for the detailed comments and encouragement, FSB! I'll work on rolling off the guitar a bit.

Getting these mic's has already made me wish I had started off with them! I'm really new to this and we get to where we are however we get there... and really, I started off using dynamic mic's because my first recorder didn't have phantom power (a dirt cheap used Tascam DP-006 I stumbled into). But did a little more recording with these and really loving them! I'll keep using my AT2035 for separately recorded tracks, but for the separation while playing and doing vocals, more than makes up for the perhaps not *quite* as good sound... everything is a compromise, right?

In the above recording, I was perhaps a little close to the mic, but did use a simple pop filter, but no foam windscreen.

Best!


Whatever you're doing keep doing it, Mark. It's working. :wink:
FSB

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