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Post subject: Re: New Bluetooth Amps!
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 2:54 am
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Location: On the loo, regretting that gas station burrito.
I'd like an amp with microwave technology, so that way we could heat up gas station burritos and enjoy them on stage during a show. :P The drummer might not like it, because they're positioned downwind. :P

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Post subject: Re: New Bluetooth Amps!
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 4:28 am
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Sorry but a lot of you sound like guitar snobs!
What's wrong with technology that excites new players? These amps won't be aimed at purist gig players but noobies playing in their bedrooms or noodling.

Pity the line 6 range is so glitchy. I love just sitting in my chair and playing some of my favourite music and trying to emulate the players when I'm not practicing properly.


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Post subject: Re: New Bluetooth Amps!
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 5:07 am
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Location: On the loo, regretting that gas station burrito.
I was being goofy, but I don't have any issues with new tech for gear, as long as it works and I don't have to spend a lot of time programming stuff. Simply because I'm too lazy, and it has a tendency to aggravate me, when I'd rather just plug in with maybe a stomp box or two and turn a couple of knobs. I'm not too hung up on the whole tube thing, either. I've used plenty of solid state amps, but then again I'm a bassist, so that's more prevalent with me.

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Post subject: Re: New Bluetooth Amps!
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 6:54 am
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pacemaker1000 wrote:
Sorry but a lot of you sound like guitar snobs!


So stipulated.

I am......and damned proud of it!

:mrgreen:

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: New Bluetooth Amps!
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 8:23 am
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pacemaker1000 wrote:
Sorry but a lot of you sound like guitar snobs!
I take that as high praise. Thank you.

pacemaker1000 wrote:
What's wrong with technology that excites new players? These amps won't be aimed at purist gig players but noobies playing in their bedrooms or noodling.
So in other words, it's a toy. Just as long as we're clear about that. To be perfectly honest, that has been my exact impression each time I have played with one of them. They are toys. Not serious gear.

I'm afraid that's why you've come up against the attitudes you have encountered. Many of us here on this forum take our musicianship very seriously. Toy gear will be identified as such. It's a fact of life here.

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Post subject: Re: New Bluetooth Amps!
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 8:48 am
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BMW-KTM wrote:
pacemaker1000 wrote:
Sorry but a lot of you sound like guitar snobs!
I take that as high praise. Thank you.

pacemaker1000 wrote:
What's wrong with technology that excites new players? These amps won't be aimed at purist gig players but noobies playing in their bedrooms or noodling.
So in other words, it's a toy. Just as long as we're clear about that. To be perfectly honest, that has been my exact impression each time I have played with one of them. They are toys. Not serious gear.

I'm afraid that's why you've come up against the attitudes you have encountered. Many of us here on this forum take our musicianship very seriously. Toy gear will be identified as such. It's a fact of life here.


So the Fender Mustang range of amps are a joke to you?
Because thats what I anticipate the new bluetooth range will replace. Fender combo amp with easier tablet friendly editing instead of having a PC to hand everytime.


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Post subject: Re: New Bluetooth Amps!
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 9:42 am
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I used to work for an AM/FM/TV station that was behind the city's main arena. We had audio and video cabling underneath the road from the station control rooms to the arena, so all we needed was a trusted open mike left at center ice hanging from the score clock, or the accepted access as one of the perks. Pretty nice for an 18 year old. :D
FSB

Recording was not an option. The sound was more for content and hockey pucks than anything else. :wink:

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Post subject: Re: New Bluetooth Amps!
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 9:43 am
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pacemaker1000 wrote:
So the Fender Mustang range of amps are a joke to you?


When someone of the stature of a Stevie Ray Vaughan, a Joe Bonamassa, or an Eric Clapton plays one on stage, I *may* reconsider my position.

Until then, such contrivances will remain a joke......a toy......a whimsical novelty.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: New Bluetooth Amps!
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 11:04 am
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I'm going to wave the white flag here and claim neutrality in this camp.

I'll be hypocritical and say that I remember the $14.00 plastic FM microphone complete with an oversize windsock that was flogged on infomercials. I only wish that I had jumped in on the shareholding so I too could have found more time kicking back in luxury.

As far as Clapton, Hendrix, or any other celebrity using something like Bluetooth, body packs are common and setup for PAs and whatnot often come with wireless tablets and phones these days. Not exactly the same, but similar idea. The key here is that the wireless is for the most part not part of the live performance. Some items such as microphones and, again, body packs are live at times.

As far as home use, anything legal that gives enjoyment and more practice is a good thing IMHO. I, personally, would prefer to look at something that will do me for some time whether that be solid state or tube. I don't eat one flavour of ice cream and I have missed out on technology altogether by waiting for something better to come along. The opposite is true with failures in the latest greatest too. I was involved with Sansui, Polydor, and early surround sound with TV/Radio. No toys here - just high end professional equipment. Care to see my Quadrophonic collection? :lol:
I have a pro analog mixer, but I am steering towards digital for the flexibility of maintaining various presets for my drums. Strat, and keyboard, amongst other things. This is an exception as at late as yesterday I cleaned an old but seldom used 3 head tape deck that was given to me. I too like things that work and can be repaired (sort of like new wine and mature wine). It sits next to my CD audio recorder beside my R2R beside my PC beside my iPhone.

I'm lucky enough to be a few blocks from a major music store that rents so the heavy tube amp is as close as that, not far from my more manageable Mustang IV at the end of a flight of stairs. It's a similar situation with dogs. I've had my own, but for several reasons I can now, for a variety of reasons, use someone else's for enjoyment, and return it at the end of the day. Is it the same as having your own? No. But, it fills the need.

The adjacent music store has toy drums, and cheap guitars, and inexpensive keyboards right beside the Cadillacs and Rolls Royces of the music world.

Toys are not for me and my choice is selective dependant on budget and need. So, having said all this, I say, Pacemaker 1000, if the Bluetooth amp doesn't work for me and it works for you. Go for it. You have my blessing. Enjoy your choice whatever it may be.

Rock on!

FSB

Nice gear is simply that. Nice gear. :wink: YMMV

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Post subject: Re: New Bluetooth Amps!
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 11:33 am
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A dear friend once owned a Mustang amp.
It was a 1x12 model and I think it was called a 3 or III.
He let me play with it for a while.
We found it was an excellent practice amplifier for home use but not suitable for playing live.
Not suitable because the presets had to be scrolled through one at a time and in one direction only.
He later learned he had the option of purchasing an optional floor controller that would make accessing patches noticeably easier.
The controller cost as much as the amp, totally and completely negating the economy of the rig.
That made it a joke, yes.
It was several years ago and he kept that amp for about 4 or 5 months and sold it because it was essentially useless to him.
Perhaps that has changed by now.
Perhaps Fender have made the amp more usable in a real world setting.
If so I may reconsider my position.
If not, it remains a toy.
I completely understand that if a person has never actually played out (gigged) they may have a different view but to a musician who plays in front of people, it's not viable.
That makes it a toy.

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Last edited by BMW-KTM on Tue Jan 10, 2017 11:38 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: New Bluetooth Amps!
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 11:34 am
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It seems the majority of those commenting here fail to grasp what Bluetooth is used for in this application (music-streaming aside).

The main functionality provided is the ability to change setting without physically touching the knobs. That's it. The knobs are still there and you're welcome to use them.

If you never establish a Bluetooth connection, the amp does not magically transform into a useless turnip. It is still an amp.

So what's the controversy? My car has GPS, but that doesn't mean I can't use a map instead.

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Post subject: Re: New Bluetooth Amps!
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 11:44 am
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For me, the controversy centres around the fact one needs a foot-switchable controller.
Using a phone or tablet is not viable.
There would never be any need for a floor controller to utilize BlueTooth.
Another set of batteries to change.
A wireless connection to fail and require re-establishing.
In the middle of a performance?
It wouldn't be any more feasible than taking your hands away from playing to touch your device.
It's just plain dumb.

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Post subject: Re: New Bluetooth Amps!
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 12:34 pm
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We have been down this road many times, have we not?
And not just here.
Virtually any guitar related discussion forum will have these kinds of disagreements.
I suspect what it comes down to is gigging musicians and casual home noodlers disagreeing about what makes a good product.
"Good", when it comes to gear, is a word that has different meanings to different people.
To many people it means low cost with lots of features.
To others, myself included, it means zero compromises with regard to tone, quality and reliability over countless years of use and sometimes abuse.
I fully understand the casual home noodler who wishes to experiment with tones might find these less expensive products attractive.
What is less clear to me is how said noodlers cannot seem to come to understand that gigging musicians require better and more reliable gear, which usually means fewer modern high tech gizmos in favour of more reliability and simpler function.
Gear that is actually useful on stage.

Fender, by nature of being an iconic company, needs to satisfy the needs of both groups.
The gigging players because they put the Fender name out in front of people and there is no better advertising than that.
The noodlers because, let's face it, there are more of them to sell gear to and, after all, Fender is in business to make money.

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Post subject: Re: New Bluetooth Amps!
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 12:36 pm
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BMW-KTM wrote:
A dear friend once owned a Mustang amp.
It was a 1x12 model and I think it was called a 3 or III.
He let me play with it for a while.
We found it was an excellent practice amplifier for home use but not suitable for playing live.
Not suitable because the presets had to be scrolled through one at a time and in one direction only.
He later learned he had the option of purchasing an optional floor controller that would make accessing patches noticeably easier.
The controller cost as much as the amp, totally and completely negating the economy of the rig.
That made it a joke, yes.
It was several years ago and he kept that amp for about 4 or 5 months and sold it because it was essentially useless to him.
Perhaps that has changed by now.
Perhaps Fender have made the amp more usable in a real world setting.
If so I may reconsider my position.
If not, it remains a toy.
I completely understand that if a person has never actually played out (gigged) they may have a different view but to a musician who plays in front of people, it's not viable.
That makes it a toy.
Sorry to read that you were so misinformed!

It is unfortunate, as you missed the best aspects of the Fender Mustang III 1x12 (if that was the model you played). You didn't mention anything about a fizz issue, so it may have indeed been a Mustang v.2.

Both the Data Wheel on the amp, and the 2 Button Footswitch (included with the Mustang III) allow easy selection of the Presets in both directions: Up or Down! The optional 4 Button Footswitch accessory adds far greater dexterity, and may be used with the 2 button footswitch for a 6 button configuration! The Mustang III costs about $250. The 4 Button Footswitch about $50. There is also the optional EXP-1 Expression and Volume Pedal (about an $80 Accessory) that adds additional capabilities for each of the Mustang's 100 Presets!

The Fender Fuse and 3rd Party REMUDA Android software each provide far greater ease of use to edit and configure the Mustang, as well as editing the signal chain, and more, that cannot be done directly on the Mustang Amps. The REMUDA App also brings a Song and Setlist mode to the Mustangs, that allows a group of your predesignated Presets to be automatically assigned to the footswith buttons as you select a new song in your Setlist!

The Mustangs III/IV/V are fantastic amps and remain as functional today, as the day they were introduced. They may not contain FRFR speakers, and lack on-board wireless controls, nonetheless, as Guitar Amps they can sound fantastic once their Advanced Amp settings are dialed in for any of their Presets! And, they also sound really good when used as Powered Cabs for more modern guitar amp modeling and MFX units!

Overall, the Mustangs have proven to be an incredibly vesatile and durable Amp line for Fender, and just as with Fender's decades old other lines of amps, the Mustang's continue to deliver proven performance and reliability just as they have from the day they were introduced. Obviously, the Mustangs are not for everyone, and your experience demonstrates that there is a lot to miss unless you learn the gear.

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Post subject: Re: New Bluetooth Amps!
Posted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 12:49 pm
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I understand the part about missing a lot until you learn the gear.
I bought the original Line-6 AX2-212 with the floor controller in 1998.
It was still learning things about that amp even after 5 years and more.
It's greatest strength was an ability to get reasonable facsimiles of hundreds of guitar tones.
I eventually sold it because while it was fairly good at many tones it was excellent at none.

At some point I will take another look at the Mustangs to see if things have changed.
It's been a long time since they completely lost my interest due to a lack of viability.
It's possible I may revisit my position on their usefulness.
That said, I may not change my position on their quality and reliability.

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