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Post subject: New Member need help with possible amazing find
Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 7:34 pm
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I am new to the forums and I will apologize in advance for not searching through the forums to look for answers because I a rather excited. I am trying to find out how to get a Fender authenticated.

I love fenders and I recently got what I believed to be a MIJ Mutt Strat on a trade valued at around $150. I really liked the way the neck felt and it is a cool green. I have four strats so I was looking at a trade deal with a guy for a parker and the tone knobs werent working well so I told him i would look at fixing them. Well when I took the pickguard off the first thing I noticed was the wiring looked very old style wise. So i decided to pull the neck off and look and in pencil in two different locations was 5-57. Upon looking around on the old web I read that this was the production date. So I began looking at pictures of the 57 strat necks and it looks the same as the one i have.
Clearly now I am wigging out a little because of what I "might" have hanging on my wall in my music room. I would like to see how I can go about authenticating it. I am not sure of the body of the guitar because it doesn't have any writing on it. The neck plate has 57145 but I dont know what is original to this guitar at all.
Is there a way to send the guitar in for authentication? I am a US Army Soldier stationed in Hawaii so there isnt anyone on this island I am aware of.
Thank you in advance for any help you can offer. I have been trying to figure out how to hang pictures on here but I cant figure it out.


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Post subject: Re: New Member need help with possible amazing find
Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 9:39 pm
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The Fender-Japan company was first created by Fender in 1982 to compete with the likes of Fernandez and Tokai and their like by making use of a deal they negotiated with FujiGen.

That means there are no MIJ or CIJ Fender guitars prior to 1982.

That should pretty much answer the entire paragraph right there.

You can relax now and breathe.

LOL

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Post subject: Re: New Member need help with possible amazing find
Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 10:08 pm
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What BMW said, it's not a 1957MIJ....the oldest is 82.

The neck plate serial# 57145 would be late 60/61more likely.
But their are lots of fakes out their.
Theirs certainly a quality guitar shop in HI. that could help you out or you could post some pictures here.
Specific questions get answered pretty quickly, quality pictures nearly answer themselves.
To post pics:
You have to post the pictures 1st to a web based server, ie. (postimage.org or photobucket.com)
then copy and paste here within a topic reply message using the IMG command


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Post subject: Re: New Member need help with possible amazing find
Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 10:26 pm
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I appreciate the responses. To be clear there is no MIJ stamp anywhere, I just assumed it was MIJ because the trem is TOKAI parts. I never thought the neck was original to the body. The pictures are the neck and the wiring on the pick guard.
There are plenty of fakes on the island, this was never passed off as ever being anything special. The guy I got it from bought it a few years back from a guy that collected antiques for next to nothing.
If there are other images I could add to help please let me know.

Thanks again

Image

Image
[img][IMG]http://i1248.photobucket.com/albums/hh494/slighltydamaged/IMG_2411_zpsuiffytiw.jpg[/img][/img]
[img][IMG]http://i1248.photobucket.com/albums/hh494/slighltydamaged/IMG_2410_zps5epk6pwp.jpg[/img][/img]


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Post subject: Re: New Member need help with possible amazing find
Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 10:43 pm
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Location: Coastal Bend, Tx.
Pics of all these areas would be great.
back of head stock
entire neck fretboard area from nut to 21/22 fret
entire neck back
guitar body front/back with pickguard/trem cover in place
pickups N/M/B same pic w/ bridge
neck plate (serial #)
pick guard off complete view of pickup cavities "routed area"
"" "" "" back of pickups
butt end of neck
neck join pocket of body

The 1st pic of the pots, cap and 5 way switch:
both tone pots are CTS from 43rd week of 1982
tone cap is not a Fender original type cap
volume pot cant be id'd, I would assume 1982 or later
5 way switch is probably 80's as well
wire is correct type(cloth pullback wax coated), depending on pickups

The 2nd pic of the front headstock and nut:
Looks correct via the tree placement and type for post 1956
Decal looks correct for up to early 60's
Nut appears to be bone


Last edited by sfceric64 on Fri May 27, 2016 11:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: New Member need help with possible amazing find
Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 10:58 pm
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The US-made CTS pots date to the 43rd week of 1982.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: New Member need help with possible amazing find
Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 11:00 pm
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I think that's everything

Image
[img][IMG]http://i1248.photobucket.com/albums/hh494/slighltydamaged/IMG_2413_zpsocgoy0wq.jpg[/img][/img]
[img][IMG]http://i1248.photobucket.com/albums/hh494/slighltydamaged/IMG_2414_zpsihsctan0.jpg[/img][/img]
[img][IMG]http://i1248.photobucket.com/albums/hh494/slighltydamaged/IMG_2415_zps7daxdqe3.jpg[/img][/img]
[img][IMG]http://i1248.photobucket.com/albums/hh494/slighltydamaged/IMG_2416_zpsnraymrzh.jpg[/img][/img]


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Post subject: Re: New Member need help with possible amazing find
Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 11:05 pm
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It's a great colour.
Almost looks like Teal Green Metallic ... but not quite.
Still ... nice colour.
I think you have a very nice early MIJ there.
For $150 you got a steal of a deal.

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Post subject: Re: New Member need help with possible amazing find
Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 11:09 pm
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BMW-KTM wrote:
Almost looks like Teal Green Metallic ... but not quite.


I'm thinking aged Ice Blue Metallic (severely yellowed lacquer top coat).

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: New Member need help with possible amazing find
Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 11:17 pm
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I love the color! It is a minty green and has a touch of sparkle to it that pictures don't do justice.

It is why I jumped on the deal. Plays great and the neck feels like a thin V.

I appreciate the comments


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Post subject: Re: New Member need help with possible amazing find
Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 11:36 pm
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I was even gonna call it a Sherwood green metallic.
The cavity routes are rounded, indicating a pre-cbs date.
I couldn't pull up the rest of the images from your bucket page.
The body looks to be bass wood.
The pickups are re-issue grey backs.
I wouldn't call it a MIJ, w/o the period correct markings(they are meticulous builders) especially in the early years.
The tuners are re-issue.
You still got a great deal for $150.


Last edited by sfceric64 on Sat May 28, 2016 12:00 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: New Member need help with possible amazing find
Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 11:44 pm
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Post subject: Re: New Member need help with possible amazing find
Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 11:47 pm
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Post subject: Re: New Member need help with possible amazing find
Posted: Sat May 28, 2016 1:25 am
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BMW-KTM wrote:
I think you have a very nice early MIJ there.
For $150 you got a steal of a deal.
I agree with that.

On the color: could also be Ocean Turquoise Metallic (which is named Ocean Tortoise Metallic on some Fender Japan color charts...), or Sage Green. Both with suspicion; the aging and the computer screen etc.


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Post subject: Re: New Member need help with possible amazing find
Posted: Sat May 28, 2016 2:12 am
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At first glance I thought Sherwood Green. Whether it is Sherwood Green or not I think he body color is a refinish. There does not appear to be much fading in the areas protected by the pickguard so that is probably the color it was intended to be by whoever refinished it.

The pencil marks are S-57 not 5-57. This has some hallmarks of a Vintage Series Fender Japan 1957 Stratocaster reissue based on the 1957 Stratocaster made during the first few years of Fender Japan production. Or it could be someone wants it to appear as such. That is what S-57 means and it is not a date. Usually you see it stamped after about 1984 instead of marked with pencil. The other Strat in the Fender Japan Vintage Series at this time was marked S-62 based on the 62 Stratocaster. The actual model numbers were ST-57 and ST-62 respectively.

Early Fender Japan Vintage reissues used the serialized neckplates which is why there is no serial decal on this one. Your serial neckplate serial should in all probability begin with "JV" followed by the 57145 numerical characters.

When I looked up your serial in my guides I could not find it except as a USA Fender made in 1961. But when I put "JV" in front of it I found a match for a Fender Made in Japan between 1984 and 1987. That works better.

There are a couple of other things that puzzle me here. One is that I can not see screw holes for the rear tremolo cover and there should be six factory screw holes. I blew up your rear photo and can not see any screw holes for the missing tremolo cover, however the photos go grainy pretty quickly and could be there and I am just missing them.

For another thing Sherwood Green was used by Fender from 1960 to 1965 and probably would not have been used by Fender Japan on a ST-57 but would more likely be seen on a ST-62, but in fact it wasn't. The colors on the ST-57 were Tobacco Sunburst, Black, Vintage White and Fiesta Red. The ST-62 colors were 3 Color Sunburst, Black, Olympic White and Candy Apple Red. No greens or blues on either model. I'm guessing it is a refinish.

I am not sure exactly what you have. But I am suspecting a refinish, non-original neckplate and the obvious tone capacitor swap at least. It also probably should not have a Tokai bridge but a generic non-branded one. Tokai and Fujigen were pretty serious competitors. The serial given would be fairly late in the 1984-1987 time frame because I've seen serials like JV00140 on one of these ST-57's with the serialized neckplate. Fender Japan serials are a mess to try to figure out but yours does not fit the stock Fender Japan format for this model. The pickup routing on the body does look correct for a ST-57 model. If it plays, stays in tune and sounds good then you got a good buy on a player class instrument. I like the color.


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