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Post subject: Shrill bridge pickup??
Posted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 7:31 am
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Hey gang....

I have CS '69s in my Kickassocaster and have liked them very much. However, Ive got a problem I hope people can advise me on.

The bridge pickup is painfully shrill sounding. It's always been a bit shrill and I've not used it much, historically. However, it may have gotten worse recently. The tone is so course and shrill that its almost painful to listen to. The highs and high-mids are off the charts.

I've adjusted the pickup up and down, lowered the high-E side, raised the low-E side, and reversed it. It makes almost no difference. I've tried to clean the contact points in the 5-way switch and jack. Nothing materially improves the tone.

Any ideas?

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BigJay's Custom '69 Kickassocaster
'90 Les Paul Standard "Vintage"
'00 MIJ '62 Tele RI
'76 Fender BandMaster Reverb
'71 Acoustic Control 2x12 w/Celestion V30s
'71 Martin D18
Mesa Mark IV
'65 Deluxe Reverb RI


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Post subject: Re: Shrill bridge pickup??
Posted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 8:37 am
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You might try wiring the bridge pickup to your lower tone control. A base plate affixed to the bottom of the bridge pickup's bobbin might help as well. Or alternatively, you might try both of these remedies simultaneously.

HTH

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: Shrill bridge pickup??
Posted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 9:05 am
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Retroverbial wrote:
You might try wiring the bridge pickup to your lower tone control. A base plate affixed to the bottom of the bridge pickup's bobbin might help as well. Or alternatively, you might try both of these remedies simultaneously.

HTH

Arjay


Thanks, again, Arjay.

Question....Im not familiar with what you call a "bass plate". Can you describe such a thing?

Thank you.

_________________
BigJay's Custom '69 Kickassocaster
'90 Les Paul Standard "Vintage"
'00 MIJ '62 Tele RI
'76 Fender BandMaster Reverb
'71 Acoustic Control 2x12 w/Celestion V30s
'71 Martin D18
Mesa Mark IV
'65 Deluxe Reverb RI


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Profile
Post subject: Re: Shrill bridge pickup??
Posted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 9:31 am
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Location: Mars, the angry red planet.
BigJay wrote:
Hey gang....

I have CS '69s in my Kickassocaster and have liked them very much. However, Ive got a problem I hope people can advise me on.

The bridge pickup is painfully shrill sounding. It's always been a bit shrill and I've not used it much, historically. However, it may have gotten worse recently. The tone is so course and shrill that its almost painful to listen to. The highs and high-mids are off the charts.

I've adjusted the pickup up and down, lowered the high-E side, raised the low-E side, and reversed it. It makes almost no difference. I've tried to clean the contact points in the 5-way switch and jack. Nothing materially improves the tone.

Any ideas?


Sidestepping the whole "try resetting your amp" perspective, I don't know whether you have a tone pot hooked up to this bridge pickup or not but based on your complaints, it really wouldn't help because if there are that many offensive highs, the tone pot would have to be dialed way down thus in effect, muting the overall frequency response of the pickup which obviously, serves no constructive purpose. And contrary to popular belief, putting a base plate on the pickup will not dramatically change any of its offensive attributes (if at all) either. All it does is to alter the magnetic field of a pickup to where the pickup's mids and lows are ever so slightly enhanced. I'm also being lead to believe that the pickup may be having a thermal breakdown and so, it will only get tinnier (and probably weaker) over time. In the final analysis and again, based on your complaints, this pickup was, is and shall continue to be useless to you. Logic dictates you should replace it.

As always, the above is merely IMO where YMMV.

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Post subject: Re: Shrill bridge pickup??
Posted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 9:50 am
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Martian wrote:
BigJay wrote:
Hey gang....

I have CS '69s in my Kickassocaster and have liked them very much. However, Ive got a problem I hope people can advise me on.

The bridge pickup is painfully shrill sounding. It's always been a bit shrill and I've not used it much, historically. However, it may have gotten worse recently. The tone is so course and shrill that its almost painful to listen to. The highs and high-mids are off the charts.

I've adjusted the pickup up and down, lowered the high-E side, raised the low-E side, and reversed it. It makes almost no difference. I've tried to clean the contact points in the 5-way switch and jack. Nothing materially improves the tone.

Any ideas?


Sidestepping the whole "try resetting your amp" perspective, I don't know whether you have a tone pot hooked up to this bridge pickup or not but based on your complaints, it really wouldn't help because if there are that many offensive highs, the tone pot would have to be dialed way down thus in effect, muting the overall frequency response of the pickup which obviously, serves no constructive purpose. And contrary to popular belief, putting a base plate on the pickup will not dramatically change any of its offensive attributes (if at all) either. All it does is to alter the magnetic field of a pickup to where the pickup's mids and lows are ever so slightly enhanced. I'm also being lead to believe that the pickup may be having a thermal breakdown and so, it will only get tinnier (and probably weaker) over time. In the final analysis and again, based on your complaints, this pickup was, is and shall continue to be useless to you. Logic dictates you should replace it.

As always, the above is merely IMO where YMMV.


Hello Martian!! Very good to see you again. Its been a while.....

The pickup has never been associated with a tone-pot.

On the "resetting your amp thing", I appreciate your avoidance as it cannot be the answer. FWIW, though, the pickup sounds OK, meaning not painful, if I dial the treble to 4 and the bass up to 7+. Mid-adjustments really dont matter.

I've suspected some type of failure, but am not electro-mechanically sophisticated to know.

Would you be so kind as to explain a "thermal breakdown" of a pickup, please? Exactly, what does that describe?

Thank you very much.

_________________
BigJay's Custom '69 Kickassocaster
'90 Les Paul Standard "Vintage"
'00 MIJ '62 Tele RI
'76 Fender BandMaster Reverb
'71 Acoustic Control 2x12 w/Celestion V30s
'71 Martin D18
Mesa Mark IV
'65 Deluxe Reverb RI


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Profile
Post subject: Re: Shrill bridge pickup??
Posted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 10:19 am
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Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2007 7:33 am
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Location: Mars, the angry red planet.
BigJay wrote:
Martian wrote:
BigJay wrote:
Hey gang....

I have CS '69s in my Kickassocaster and have liked them very much. However, Ive got a problem I hope people can advise me on.

The bridge pickup is painfully shrill sounding. It's always been a bit shrill and I've not used it much, historically. However, it may have gotten worse recently. The tone is so course and shrill that its almost painful to listen to. The highs and high-mids are off the charts.

I've adjusted the pickup up and down, lowered the high-E side, raised the low-E side, and reversed it. It makes almost no difference. I've tried to clean the contact points in the 5-way switch and jack. Nothing materially improves the tone.

Any ideas?


Sidestepping the whole "try resetting your amp" perspective, I don't know whether you have a tone pot hooked up to this bridge pickup or not but based on your complaints, it really wouldn't help because if there are that many offensive highs, the tone pot would have to be dialed way down thus in effect, muting the overall frequency response of the pickup which obviously, serves no constructive purpose. And contrary to popular belief, putting a base plate on the pickup will not dramatically change any of its offensive attributes (if at all) either. All it does is to alter the magnetic field of a pickup to where the pickup's mids and lows are ever so slightly enhanced. I'm also being lead to believe that the pickup may be having a thermal breakdown and so, it will only get tinnier (and probably weaker) over time. In the final analysis and again, based on your complaints, this pickup was, is and shall continue to be useless to you. Logic dictates you should replace it.

As always, the above is merely IMO where YMMV.


Hello Martian!! Very good to see you again. Its been a while.....

The pickup has never been associated with a tone-pot.

On the "resetting your amp thing", I appreciate your avoidance as it cannot be the answer. FWIW, though, the pickup sounds OK, meaning not painful, if I dial the treble to 4 and the bass up to 7+. Mid-adjustments really dont matter.

I've suspected some type of failure, but am not electro-mechanically sophisticated to know.

Would you be so kind as to explain a "thermal breakdown" of a pickup, please? Exactly, what does that describe?

Thank you very much.


Jay,

I wasn't sure if it was you, glad to see you're still out and about! :D :D :D

Thermal breakdown is where the insulation of the coil winding is compromised, thereby causing the now bare wire in places of the coil to short. Also associated with thermal breakdown is where the winding of the coil itself may still be intact (insulation wise) but is beginning to loosen up. In this particular situation, the chief culprit in either case is usually pressure from a magnet coming loose in the flat work where the magnet grinds against and/or stretches segments of the coil winding. If I'm correct in your pickup's diagnosis, it shall progressively worsen to the point where the pickup will eventually be reduced to non-musical squeal and whistle.

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Post subject: Re: Shrill bridge pickup??
Posted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 12:02 pm
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Thank you very much. Interesting stuff.

Couldnt I re-insulate the coil somehow?

Also, is there any consistency to the degradation? Does it typically progress consistently over time? Or does it ladder-step worse?

Thanks again.

_________________
BigJay's Custom '69 Kickassocaster
'90 Les Paul Standard "Vintage"
'00 MIJ '62 Tele RI
'76 Fender BandMaster Reverb
'71 Acoustic Control 2x12 w/Celestion V30s
'71 Martin D18
Mesa Mark IV
'65 Deluxe Reverb RI


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Profile
Post subject: Re: Shrill bridge pickup??
Posted: Sat Aug 25, 2012 1:22 pm
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Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2007 7:33 am
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Location: Mars, the angry red planet.
BigJay wrote:
Thank you very much. Interesting stuff.

Couldnt I re-insulate the coil somehow?

Also, is there any consistency to the degradation? Does it typically progress consistently over time? Or does it ladder-step worse?

Thanks again.


You're quite welcome.

If the coil merely is loose, repotting is the answer. If the insulation is stripped off the coil, no. Remember, the thickness of coil wire is akin to that of a human hair. The entire coil would have to be unwound and then sprayed with whatever insulation which is/was on it to the identical specs. The coil would then have to be rewound. Even having accomplished all this, due to the coil being disturbed from its original state, it will never sound the same. Naturally, you'd be better off starting over with a complete rewind with new, identical wire with identical insulation which nowadays, price wise, encroaches on simply replacing the pickup altogether. Keep in mind though, if you weren't happy with the pickup from "Day 1", you won't be happy with it once restored.

Further degradation of the bare coil comes by way of oxidization and/or the continued friction from the magnet(s). Consequently, it will intensify and eventually, a segment of the coil will outright break.

You're welcome again.

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