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Post subject: Wiring Help Request - Fender Mid boost with the S-1 Switch
Posted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 10:52 am
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Hello!

I'm building a custom Strat and would like to install the fender mid-boost kit and the s-1 swtiching system together.

Can anyone confirm whether this is possible?

The only compatibility issue ican see is the Volume pot for the mid-boost is a 50k and the S-1 switch is a 250k. How will this effect the sound?

Thanks in advance

Andy


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Posted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 1:01 pm
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Do you mean 500K?

From a sound perspective, it means that the 500K pot will resists slightly more at full volume than the 250K pot. That's approximately like turning your volume back on a 250K pot to ~9.5 when the the 500K pot is on 10.

Keep in mind as you roll the volume back, the high frequencies are the first sounds to get cut out (that's why 500K pots sound brighter than 250K pots). You can allieviate this by installing a Treble Bleed cap between the input and output lug.


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Posted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 3:12 pm
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Hello!

Thanks for your reply pcheng,

The volume pot supplied with the fender mid boost is a 50k (definitely not a 500k).

So maybe a 250k S-1 switch would sound ok though the mid boost might be a bit brighter when fully cranked?

Andy


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Post subject: Re: Wiring Help Request - Fender Mid boost with the S-1 Swit
Posted: Tue Dec 01, 2009 5:34 pm
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Andybighair wrote:
Hello!

I'm building a custom Strat and would like to install the fender mid-boost kit and the s-1 swtiching system together.

Can anyone confirm whether this is possible?

The only compatibility issue ican see is the Volume pot for the mid-boost is a 50k and the S-1 switch is a 250k. How will this effect the sound?

Thanks in advance

Andy


They are compatible. However (and I won't be getting into all sorts of theory, etc. here), the midboost is a pre-amp. It is low impedance and by design, never fully turned off once installed in the system, even with the gain pot dialed down to '0'. What all this means is that the 50K pot must be used as the volume pot or you'll get all sorts of non-musical howling with the 250K.

Good luck!

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Post subject: Re: Wiring Help Request - Fender Mid boost with the S-1 Swit
Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 1:23 am
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Martian wrote:
They are compatible. However (and I won't be getting into all sorts of theory, etc. here), the midboost is a pre-amp. It is low impedance and by design, never fully turned off once installed in the system, even with the gain pot dialed down to '0'. What all this means is that the 50K pot must be used as the volume pot or you'll get all sorts of non-musical howling with the 250K.

Good luck!


Thanks for your reply Martian!

Non-musical howling is something i'd like to avoid if possible!

I'm thinking then that it might be best to use the 50k pot as the master volume (as recommended) and have the S-1 switch as the Mid boost control (which is a 250k pot) I'm using the Clapton Strat and Deluxe Ash wiring diagrams as a guide.

Really would like to have both S-1 switch and mid boost working together. I'm going to be using a set of Fender Hot Nosieless pups and if all goes well, I think I might be on to a winning combination. Plenty of sound variety here! I'm kinda thinking a Clapton/Beck Hybrid Deluxe!

Hoping to have the Strat finished in time for Christmas and i'll post the spec if anyone is interested.

Any thoughts on the above are greatly welcomed

Thanks again

Andy


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Post subject: Re: Wiring Help Request - Fender Mid boost with the S-1 Swit
Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 5:48 am
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Andybighair wrote:

Thanks for your reply Martian!

Non-musical howling is something i'd like to avoid if possible!

I'm thinking then that it might be best to use the 50k pot as the master volume (as recommended) and have the S-1 switch as the Mid boost control (which is a 250k pot) I'm using the Clapton Strat and Deluxe Ash wiring diagrams as a guide.

Really would like to have both S-1 switch and mid boost working together. I'm going to be using a set of Fender Hot Nosieless pups and if all goes well, I think I might be on to a winning combination. Plenty of sound variety here! I'm kinda thinking a Clapton/Beck Hybrid Deluxe!

Hoping to have the Strat finished in time for Christmas and i'll post the spec if anyone is interested.

Any thoughts on the above are greatly welcomed

Thanks again

Andy


You're quite welcome!

Your plan sounds quite feasible and should work out really well. Bear in mind that your Hot Noiseless have ceramic magnets so too much gain will give you a really "razorish" tone; unless of course, that's your aim.

I, for one, would like to know your impressions of your results.

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Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 5:51 am
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Here are two things that you may consider....

1) Swap out the 250K carbon trace in the S-1 switch w/ the 50K carbon trace. That way you get a 50K S-1 switch.

http://www.projectguitar.com/tut/pots.htm: This link shows the best pic of the internal of a potentiometer I could find. The round disk w/ the lugs is what determines the resistence value of the pot. It should be the same (but I'm not certain). It would defintely be easier to replace this disk, then to add resistors to get a 250K pot to 50K.

2) While you're in the S-1 soldering.... replace the tiny iC 503Z cap with a better cap. The 503K is a REALLY cheap cap. It's basically a 0.05uf cap w/ a designed tolerance of +80% / -20%. This cap can be anywhere between 0.09uf to 0.04uf at any given time. I put a 0.033uf Mallory 150 cap (just because that's what I had at the time) in mine and it sounded much better.

Sounds like an interesting project.


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Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 7:12 am
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Andybighair
I modified a Fender MIM Power House with a set of SCNs and a S1 switching arrangement and wired it into the existing mid boost circut. I left the orginal mid boost volumn and tone pots in the circuit. It worked out well with a nice rage of tones available. Good luck with your build.

Jim Mez


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Post subject: Re: Wiring Help Request - Fender Mid boost with the S-1 Swit
Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 1:08 pm
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Martian wrote:
You're quite welcome!

Your plan sounds quite feasible and should work out really well. Bear in mind that your Hot Noiseless have ceramic magnets so too much gain will give you a really "razorish" tone; unless of course, that's your aim.

I, for one, would like to know your impressions of your results.

Hello Martian!

Your quote above hits home on a point i've contemplating for sometime now. How will the hot noiseless work with the mid boost? I totally agree, there is a chance that the mid boost cranked up will probably make the pups will become fairly harsh but I hope this will be cured to some degree with a dab of the TBX (I even considered using the S-1 Switch as an additional tone pot to get round the compatability issue, but 4 knobs on a strat.....um).

I'm a huge Jeff Beck fan and I've wanted a set FHN's for a while now. Sounds a bit cheesy but my gut says "Build it and it will Rock!" Even if the pups don't work out they will be re-homed in a more traditional rig.

Sometimes you just have have to try these things out!

Thanks again

Andy


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Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 1:21 pm
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pcheng wrote:
Here are two things that you may consider....

1) Swap out the 250K carbon trace in the S-1 switch w/ the 50K carbon trace. That way you get a 50K S-1 switch.

http://www.projectguitar.com/tut/pots.htm: This link shows the best pic of the internal of a potentiometer I could find. The round disk w/ the lugs is what determines the resistence value of the pot. It should be the same (but I'm not certain). It would defintely be easier to replace this disk, then to add resistors to get a 250K pot to 50K.

Hello pcheng!

Wow! I'm definatly going to try and carry out the above. That is an excellent solution to the issue at hand! The link you posted was very usefull.

As far as the Specials Caps goes I was planning on slapping a .022mf mylar film cap as its all i have at the moment (I was given the S-1 Switch, unused but without the Specials cap). What are your thoughs regarding this?

Thanks again for the Pot Swap tips

Andy


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Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 1:26 pm
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Jim Mez wrote:
Andybighair
I modified a Fender MIM Power House with a set of SCNs and a S1 switching arrangement and wired it into the existing mid boost circut. I left the orginal mid boost volumn and tone pots in the circuit. It worked out well with a nice rage of tones available. Good luck with your build.

Jim Mez
Hello Jim Mez!

Thanks for your reply! Your MIM Power House is the first case of the S-1 Switch with the Mid Boost i've come across and I'm really very glad it works! I was starting to think there was a reason nobody had done it!

Thanks again

Andy


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Post subject: Re: Wiring Help Request - Fender Mid boost with the S-1 Swit
Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 5:11 pm
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Andybighair wrote:
Hello Martian!

Your quote above hits home on a point i've contemplating for sometime now. How will the hot noiseless work with the mid boost? I totally agree, there is a chance that the mid boost cranked up will probably make the pups will become fairly harsh but I hope this will be cured to some degree with a dab of the TBX (I even considered using the S-1 Switch as an additional tone pot to get round the compatability issue, but 4 knobs on a strat.....um).

I'm a huge Jeff Beck fan and I've wanted a set FHN's for a while now. Sounds a bit cheesy but my gut says "Build it and it will Rock!" Even if the pups don't work out they will be re-homed in a more traditional rig.

Sometimes you just have have to try these things out!

Thanks again

Andy


They can get brittle, what with the ceramic magnets and all. Don't count on the TBX for a whole lot though as all it does is force more high frequencies through. Of itself, it has nothing to do with, nor is it a part of the preamp. Rather, it's, "just along for the ride".

Nah, four knobs on a Strat ain't a Strat!

I'll be the first one to tell you, if it wasn't for all my 'experiments' over the last four decades, I probably wouldn't know half of what I know now. You have the spirit and the right attitude, carry on!

Of course, you're quite welcome!

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Post subject:
Posted: Wed Dec 02, 2009 5:30 pm
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Andybighair wrote:

As far as the Specials Caps goes I was planning on slapping a .022mf mylar film cap as its all i have at the moment (I was given the S-1 Switch, unused but without the Specials cap). What are your thoughs regarding this?

Thanks again for the Pot Swap tips

Andy


When I was re-wiring my S-1, I figured that the S-1 cap get's wired in Series when the cap is engaged (since the other tone cap is wired to the pot ground, I figured that the cap must be series).

If that's the case, then how much a 0.022uf cap has an affect on the tone depends on the other tone cap.

You can check the overall capacitance (parallel/series) on this web site:

http://www.electronics2000.co.uk/calc/series-parallel-capacitor-calculator.php


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Posted: Tue Dec 22, 2009 11:31 am
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i was wandering. Are the pots on here high friction or low and why does it matter?


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Post subject:
Posted: Fri Jan 01, 2010 3:14 pm
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Happy New Year!

Well! Everything is done and thanks to the sound advice from members who have posted on this topic the electrics were a total success! I had no problems swapping the carbon trace on the S-1 switch (thanks again pcheng!) and once everything was soldered in (though the S-1 switch seemed to repel solder) it worked first time!

But all is not well...

The Fender Hot Noiseless pups sound awfull.....really, they sound terrible. Martians post regarding the potential razorish, brittle tone is spot on (Shame, as my gut instinct is usualy freakishly reliable. Must have been something I ate).

To anyone thinking of using FHN pups with the Fender Midboost kit...Don't do it....if your still tempted, check with your Dietitian or Nutritionist before any you spend any money! (IMO)

So...

I intend to swap the FHN pups with a set of Lace Hot Golds.

I've got a set of Lace Sensors (Blue, Silver and Red) with a wilkinson midboost and they sound great! I've also had a go on the Clapton and Buddy Guy strats and the Lace pups work very nicely with the Midboost....... unlike the FHN pups which sound awfull (it was so bad its worth mentioning twice!)

I would welcome anyones views on the use of Hot Golds in this set up (though I'm pretty sure that they will sound better than the FHNs...god they were bad).

Thanks again

Andy

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