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Post subject: EMG Gilmour Active Pickups w/ Roland Mex Strat
Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 9:55 am
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Hi all,

This may be a very specific inquiry and I don't know that anyone has run into this particular issue, but I though I would run it by my friends on the forum here.

My friend and coworker, who is one of our audio designers (I work for a video game development studio) has a Mexican Stratocaster. He picked up the Rolad Mex for work purposes - it includes the Roland Midi pickup and has an extra input for pluggin right into the computer for ease of digital recording. Here are the wiring specs:
http://www.fender.com/support/diagrams/pdf_temp1/stratocaster/0134660C/SD0134660CPg2.pdf

He has purchased the EMG DG20 David Gilmour Active Pickup Set. I am looking into installing these pickups for him. I have not started yet, but just opening up the EMG set, which arrived yesterday, I realize that all of the wiring on these EMG pickups is set up to "plug" into the circuits. basically, little to know soldering required. Now, this would be easy on a Strat that is wired normally, but this Roldand Midi seems to be adding some confusion for me. I am actually thinking that it is not possible to use this EMG pickup set with the Roland Midi...

Have any of you run into this particular situation or do you know if it is even possible to run the two together?

Here is the link to the EMG pickup set:
http://www.emginc.com/products/category/11
And it's instructions:
http://www.emginc.com/content/wiringdiagrams/EMG-DG20.pdf

Any input would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!

~Jim

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Post subject:
Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 12:17 pm
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1. This is a question to also ask support@emgpickups.com.
2. Seeing as this is confusing you, it may be best if you take it to a qualified technician.
3. Just look at the wiring diagrams side by side, and follow all the lead, ground, and other wiring and see what you come up with.
4.???
5. Profit


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Post subject:
Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 12:35 pm
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Mr Walley wrote:
1. This is a question to also ask support@emgpickups.com.
2. Seeing as this is confusing you, it may be best if you take it to a qualified technician.
3. Just look at the wiring diagrams side by side, and follow all the lead, ground, and other wiring and see what you come up with.
4.???
5. Profit


Profit indeed. Lol! I appreciate the feedback. I might just go ahead and forward this on to the EMG Support center. Thanks!

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2007 Fender Deluxe Ash Stratocaster Cherry Burst
2009 Fender Telecaster Surf Green
2006 Fender Hot Rod Blues Jr.


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Post subject:
Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 2:28 pm
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Jim,
After looking at the schematics I'm totally baffled. However I'm no wiring/tech/circuit guru. Hopefully forum member and pickup master Martian may be able to help. I'm always amazed by his knowledge of these types of difficult wiring solutions. Maybe he will see this topic and add his advice. If he doesn't you may have to post a topic asking for his help, although I think he will come across this eventually.

Russ

P.S. Love the Fender Headstock artwork! :D


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Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 3:27 pm
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DeadAhead wrote:
Jim,
After looking at the schematics I'm totally baffled. However I'm no wiring/tech/circuit guru. Hopefully forum member and pickup master Martian may be able to help. I'm always amazed by his knowledge of these types of difficult wiring solutions. Maybe he will see this topic and add his advice. If he doesn't you may have to post a topic asking for his help, although I think he will come across this eventually.

Russ

P.S. Love the Fender Headstock artwork! :D


Much thanks!

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::Jim::
www.jimstigall.com
~~~
2004 Fender Squire Strat Aged White
2007 Fender Deluxe Ash Stratocaster Cherry Burst
2009 Fender Telecaster Surf Green
2006 Fender Hot Rod Blues Jr.


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Posted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 4:34 pm
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DeadAhead wrote:
Jim,
After looking at the schematics I'm totally baffled. However I'm no wiring/tech/circuit guru. Hopefully forum member and pickup master Martian may be able to help. I'm always amazed by his knowledge of these types of difficult wiring solutions. Maybe he will see this topic and add his advice. If he doesn't you may have to post a topic asking for his help, although I think he will come across this eventually.

Russ

P.S. Love the Fender Headstock artwork! :D


Aww, shucks, you make me blush! :oops: :oops: :oops:

Jim,

Can ALL the EMG/Fender/Roland stuff live and work happily together? Yes, BUT... Here are my thoughts as they come to mind:

Essentially, with the Roland pickup, you have two circuits: The regular Fender pickups, etc. and obviously, the Roland pickup, etc.

With a Roland system, the regular Strat pickup circuit has a master volume and tone and of course, the 5 way selector switch and standard jack. That lower tone pot on your guitar is dedicated to the Roland. Further, it is a 50K pot and not a standard Fender 250K guitar pot. It MUST be retained if you intend on keeping the Roland circuit.

EMGs run on a 25K pot system so right off the bat, the top two Fender pots along with the Fender pickups, etc. have to go, along with the standard jack.

EMG does have separate SPC and EXG components but when they combine them from the factory, they ship what you have in hand, already mated and mounted. Separating them is left to someone who really knows their stuff backwards and forwards. More on this later.

With what you have in hand, you will either have to drill at least one more hole in your pickguard to accommodate that aforementioned Roland dedicated pot OR modify the EMG circuit to where either the SPC or the EXG are removed. OR, you can remove both and use a master tone for the EMGs. OR, you can buy either the SPC and/or the EXG as a separate entity. On top of all this, you have to fit a 9V battery somewhere in that well populated control cavity too. Do NOT take this lightly as there isn't a lot of room in there, even less so if you try to mount a fourth pot per the above.

Obviously, just the EMG circuit could be wired up as is, sacrificing the Roland circuit.

All the EMG clip on stuff is to have the new owner avoid soldering as much as possible as EMG components (and Roland components for that matter) cannot take any sustained heat due to their small size. Rest assured, whatever options you choose, additional wiring is involved and I URGENTLY recommend that this work be done by a REAL, no BS pro. Needless to say, it isn't going to be cheap.

I'm sure you have questions so, fire away!

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Post subject:
Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 7:22 am
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Martian all jokes aside have you ever tried making your own pups. Food for thought bro.


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Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 8:27 am
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straycat113 wrote:
Martian all jokes aside have you ever tried making your own pups. Food for thought bro.


I have made some for myself and a handful of others over the years but in terms of, the "big picture", I figure there's no point in trying to, "reinvent the wheel". The reason I say this is because there are many outstanding pickup manufacturers out there where pretty much any and every output and tonality combo is covered. For example, it's easier to buy or trade for a used Duncan SSL-1 pickup if I have a requirement for a generic but accurate 50s Strat sounding pickup. Either transaction would only take a few minutes and I don't have to have all sorts of time and money tied up in my objective to accomplish the same end. Oftentimes too, if something less generic and more focused is required, a tweak of the guitar's circuit or merely the amp, achieves the same thing. Or again, trade or buy used as the odds are overwhelming, it is out there. For example, if I want a beefier 50s Strat sounding pickup, a Fender Fat 50s will obviously do quite nicely. Same thing in a humbucker? A DiMarzio Virtual Vintage Area 58 fits the bill.

Pickup making is not as mystical as everyone imagines. This is true as new, decent pickup makers pop up constantly. I also feel that the days of any newer pickup manufacturer becoming a giant in the industry is long gone as name recognition and the current giants' advertising and endorsement muscle is everything (and based on what I've said above too). Besides, for new competitors to survive nowadays, they eventually have to pimp off their designs to overseas labor and in time, they join the ranks of all the other non-descript imports. IMO, such a venture by and large has an ignited 'bottle rocket' existence.

I prefer coming up with solutions such as the OP's here where seemingly impossible combinations work and work well. Blowing my own horn: Years ago, an owner of one of the stores I was affiliated with used to have a saying to customers who wandered in from other facilities after being told that their job couldn't be done was that all I wanted to know is when they wanted it completed by. (How's that for a run-on sentence?) And if there was something that was literally impossible due to the laws of physics, I'd still come up with an equally desirable solution.

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Post subject:
Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 4:52 pm
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Martian,

Much, much thanks for your response and input! I have heard that you are the tech guru on the forum. I actually forwarded my initial inquiry to the EMG service department and got a response today. Here is what EMG said:

Hi Jim;



I’m sorry, but this mod is not possible. From a physical standpoint, you’d have to eliminate the tone pot and midi volume to accommodate the SPC/EXG accessory board. The volume would not work for the active pups, and conversely, the DG20 volume pot is only 25K. This would affect the taper on the midi pup.



Sorry about that.



Best Regards,



R.Hunt



Technical Support



EMG Pickups

www.emgpickups.com



So, after your response and this email I believe we will be foregoing this particular mod. My friend already mentioned purchasing a new MIM Strat for the EMG upgrade.

Thanks again to everyone for the help!

~J

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::Jim::
www.jimstigall.com
~~~
2004 Fender Squire Strat Aged White
2007 Fender Deluxe Ash Stratocaster Cherry Burst
2009 Fender Telecaster Surf Green
2006 Fender Hot Rod Blues Jr.


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Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 5:04 pm
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Stigall wrote:
Martian,

Much, much thanks for your response and input! I have heard that you are the tech guru on the forum. I actually forwarded my initial inquiry to the EMG service department and got a response today...So, after your response and this email I believe we will be foregoing this particular mod. My friend already mentioned purchasing a new MIM Strat for the EMG upgrade.

Thanks again to everyone for the help!

~J


You're quite welcome and than you for your kind words.

He essentially said the same thing I did with the only difference being, I know from past experiences it can be done. However, the cost would indeed be steep. Notwitstanding, for all intents and purposes, I think you guys did make the correct decision. If you have any problems or concerns with mounting the EMG setup in the new Strat, just yell!

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Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 5:10 pm
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Martian wrote:
Stigall wrote:
Martian,

Much, much thanks for your response and input! I have heard that you are the tech guru on the forum. I actually forwarded my initial inquiry to the EMG service department and got a response today...So, after your response and this email I believe we will be foregoing this particular mod. My friend already mentioned purchasing a new MIM Strat for the EMG upgrade.

Thanks again to everyone for the help!

~J


You're quite welcome and than you for your kind words.

He essentially said the same thing I did with the only difference being, I know from past experiences it can be done. However, the cost would indeed be steep. Notwitstanding, for all intents and purposes, I think you guys did make the correct decision. If you have any problems or concerns with mounting the EMG setup in the new Strat, just yell!


Excellent! I personally, over the last few months, have been getting more and more into working on guitars. I completely hot-rodded (well, still a few things to do) my Squier and have worked on several friends guitars to this point. I'm sure I'll have some more questions for you down the road, knowing that you're open to them. Thanks again!

~Jim

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::Jim::
www.jimstigall.com
~~~
2004 Fender Squire Strat Aged White
2007 Fender Deluxe Ash Stratocaster Cherry Burst
2009 Fender Telecaster Surf Green
2006 Fender Hot Rod Blues Jr.


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Post subject:
Posted: Thu Jul 23, 2009 6:08 pm
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Stigall wrote:
Martian wrote:
Stigall wrote:
Martian,

Much, much thanks for your response and input! I have heard that you are the tech guru on the forum. I actually forwarded my initial inquiry to the EMG service department and got a response today...So, after your response and this email I believe we will be foregoing this particular mod. My friend already mentioned purchasing a new MIM Strat for the EMG upgrade.

Thanks again to everyone for the help!

~J


You're quite welcome and thank you for your kind words.

He essentially said the same thing I did with the only difference being, I know from past experiences it can be done. However, the cost would indeed be steep. Notwitstanding, for all intents and purposes, I think you guys did make the correct decision. If you have any problems or concerns with mounting the EMG setup in the new Strat, just yell!


Excellent! I personally, over the last few months, have been getting more and more into working on guitars. I completely hot-rodded (well, still a few things to do) my Squier and have worked on several friends guitars to this point. I'm sure I'll have some more questions for you down the road, knowing that you're open to them. Thanks again!

~Jim


Anytime!

Just do yourself a favor if you haven't already - learn how to solder correctly. The majority of people who upon first entering into guitar work, have a very high destruction rate when it comes to the electronics. Grab some scrap components and practice on them.

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Post subject:
Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2009 11:07 am
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Martian wrote:

Anytime!

Just do yourself a favor if you haven't already - learn how to solder correctly. The majority of people who upon first entering into guitar work, have a very high destruction rate when it comes to the electronics. Grab some scrap components and practice on them.


Great advise! I actually learned to solder from my father, whos father showed him the proper way. My grandfather was an engineer during WWII and after the war was endlessly working on radio exquipment. He was a master. Now, I have not quite mastered my soldering technique, but I do alright. :)

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::Jim::
www.jimstigall.com
~~~
2004 Fender Squire Strat Aged White
2007 Fender Deluxe Ash Stratocaster Cherry Burst
2009 Fender Telecaster Surf Green
2006 Fender Hot Rod Blues Jr.


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Posted: Mon Jul 27, 2009 11:30 am
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Stigall wrote:
Martian wrote:

Anytime!

Just do yourself a favor if you haven't already - learn how to solder correctly. The majority of people who upon first entering into guitar work, have a very high destruction rate when it comes to the electronics. Grab some scrap components and practice on them.


Great advise! I actually learned to solder from my father, whos father showed him the proper way. My grandfather was an engineer during WWII and after the war was endlessly working on radio exquipment. He was a master. Now, I have not quite mastered my soldering technique, but I do alright. :)


Outstanding!!!

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