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Post subject: Re: Jazzmaster VM - neck straight
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 1:59 am
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Il look a bad news..... :(

http://www.fretnotguitarrepair.com/repa ... oblems.php

Back Bowing / Not Enough Relief


Ideally, loosening the truss rod should allow the strings to pull it upward and create more relief in the neck. Unfortunately some necks can actually back bow, even with the truss rod completely loose and the instrument tuned to pitch.
In this situation a single action truss rod can offer no help.
Repair Technique
When the neck is only slightly back bowed or simply dead flat, using heavier gauge strings may create just enough tension to pull then neck straight or increase the relief.
When a neck remains in a back bowed state with no string tension (and the rod completely loose) I may choose to plane the neck.
As with other neck issues, this is a situation that must be evaluated.
I am more inclined to believe improvement is possible when the instrument is older and the neck has settled. The reason for this assumption is simple ...when dealing with a very new instrument who's neck is moving unpredictably, it remains likely that the neck could continue to do so, making a seemingly perfect repair only temporary. It's hard to pour over $300 into a repair only to find it will be required again in another year or two. At this point, when applicable, a replacement neck seems a wiser investment.


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Post subject: Re: Jazzmaster VM - neck straight
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 2:39 am
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Well, we don't yet know what the tech says, I'm really curious about the outcome...

Anyways, the purpose for my previous posts was to bring up the chance that the truss rod may still be preventing the neck from moving even when it's opened that 2 turns - that glue/finish residue can stick to the wood real hard.
So I'd take the nut off and make sure the rod is loose, then try the heavy strings trick again.

BTW, one option not yet mentioned is a partial fret job - the problem seems to be small enough, so one might be able to cure it by lowering (file/recrown/polish) the mid neck frets to get a bit of relief.


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Post subject: Re: Jazzmaster VM - neck straight
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 2:46 am
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jmattis wrote:

BTW, one option not yet mentioned is a partial fret job - the problem seems to be small enough, so one might be able to cure it by lowering (file/recrown/polish) the mid neck frets to get a bit of relief.



I don't like that. Wich relief owner will like ?

Option 2 ; sell the guitar and buy a better one like MIM or American made


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Post subject: Re: Jazzmaster VM - neck straight
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 3:34 am
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Occasional problem necks happen on MIMs and MIAs, too.
Stuck, broken, maxxed out truss rods, backbowed or propeller-warped necks don't belong to just economy priced guitars.

And would you like that relief-by-fret-job on an old Martin acoustic without a truss rod? :lol:


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Post subject: Re: Jazzmaster VM - neck straight
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 3:47 am
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Any guitar may have a issue. Squier are the bottom line, more chance (?) to have some issue IMO.

If you bought a guitar with some relief, the right one for you, you may never have problem with adjustment .

OP Squier may be wrong from the beginning.


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Post subject: Re: Jazzmaster VM - neck straight
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 7:37 am
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Actually, the Vintage Modified series instruments are considered to be among the high end Squiers, on par with Classic Vibes or Fender's Modern Player series, very close or similar to MIM's... Absolutely no 'bottom liners'.
And (based on web info only, since I've not met a VM with a disfuntional truss rod) they don't seem to have an unusually high count of truss rod problems.

I recall you defending a Toyota for being reliable and usable in spite of its low price class. The same 'workhorse for low cost' ideology fits the majority of Squiers. :wink:


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Post subject: Re: Jazzmaster VM - neck straight
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 8:06 am
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jmattis wrote:
Actually, the Vintage Modified series instruments are considered to be among the high end Squiers, on par with Classic Vibes or Fender's Modern Player series, very close or similar to MIM's... Absolutely no 'bottom liners'.
And (based on web info only, since I've not met a VM with a disfuntional truss rod) they don't seem to have an unusually high count of truss rod problems.

I recall you defending a Toyota for being reliable and usable in spite of its low price class. The same 'workhorse for low cost' ideology fits the majority of Squiers. :wink:


You could be right.


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Post subject: Re: Jazzmaster VM - neck straight
Posted: Thu Jul 18, 2019 12:22 pm
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hi all,

good to see your new comments, I learned a lot from this thread :)

Today I was at the repairing shop and unfortunately the situation does not look good. The technician confirmed that the truss rod is already loose and being a one way truss rod, no further improvement is possible. He basically suggested me to keep playing the guitar until it is not playable anymore, changing the truss rod would cost more than the guitar itself, because that would involve a re-fret.

The guitar still indeed playable without issue, so I am considering about selling it for a lower price and get a better one, of course stating the current state of the instrument.


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Post subject: Re: Jazzmaster VM - neck straight
Posted: Thu Jul 18, 2019 12:43 pm
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buscon wrote:
.... changing the truss rod would cost more than the guitar itself, because that would involve a re-fret.



IMO he is wrong, he is not a qualified guitar tech. No need to re-fret.
See a good guitar luthier to have a second opinion

Don't you see my video on previous page ? :(

I replace a truss rod with removing the fretboard on a Godin guitar. No need to refret.

Ok in any case it could cost you $100 to $200 guitar worth $400 new ?


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Post subject: Re: Jazzmaster VM - neck straight
Posted: Thu Jul 18, 2019 12:46 pm
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stratele52 wrote:
buscon wrote:
.... changing the truss rod would cost more than the guitar itself, because that would involve a re-fret.



IMO he is wrong, he is not a qualified guitar tech. No need to re-fret.
See a good guitar luthier to have a second opinion

Don't you see my video on previous page ? :(

I replace a truss rod with removing the fretboard on a Godin guitar. No need to refret.

Ok in any case it could cost you $100 to $200 guitar worth $400 new ?


ok, thanks for your answer.
I saw the video but I am a bit concerned about doing it myself, I am worried about ruining the guitar...

I can indeed ask another tech, as you seem to know what you are talking about.

I will post again as soon as I have news.


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Post subject: Re: Jazzmaster VM - neck straight
Posted: Thu Jul 18, 2019 12:54 pm
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The video; I dont say do by yourself, I say a good guitar tech can do it. You do not have the knowledge or the tools to do it.
I am going to nuance what I say. It is not excluded that the truss rod is stuck in the handle and it takes time because it may be necessary to remove the freight board so $$.


To read the comment of the tech, he says what everyone here knew from the beginning, the truss rod is loosely without providing a solution.
Competent techs are very rare


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Post subject: Re: Jazzmaster VM - neck straight
Posted: Thu Jul 18, 2019 12:58 pm
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stratele52 wrote:
The video; I dont say do by yourself, I say a good guitar tech can do it. You do not have the knowledge or the tools to do it.
I am going to nuance what I say. It is not excluded that the truss rod is stuck in the handle and it takes time because it may be necessary to remove the freight board so $$.


ok, now I understand, I can try to suggest that.

stratele52 wrote:
To read the comment of the tech, he says what everyone here knew from the beginning, the truss rod is loosely without providing a solution.
Competent techs are very rare


also very true. I can try with another guitar shop not far from me, it has good reviews (the other one did too though...).

Thanks for your help!


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Post subject: Re: Jazzmaster VM - neck straight
Posted: Fri Jul 19, 2019 12:25 am
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Wait a minute... The original truss rod is already loose, and you have no need to tighten it since the neck is already too straight for your taste & playing style.
How would a new truss rod help the "too straight neck" situation..?

And your tech most likely talks about a fret job needed to shape the neck - take the frets off, sand relief to the fretboard, refret. And replace the truss rod while at it.

Anyways. At this point, I'd (still) take the truss rod nut out completely, use a .013 set and see what a month or two does. If you keep this neck, that partial fret job (shaving a very small bit off the mid neck frets to get relief) might be a good idea. But if you think about selling, leave that be - someone else may find the neck just perfect.

And the usual reminder: a new (second hand) neck is usually a lot cheaper than what guitar techs charge for any major repair jobs. Squier necks 50-150, MIM's 100-200, MIJ's 200 and above.


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Post subject: Re: Jazzmaster VM - neck straight
Posted: Fri Jul 19, 2019 1:46 am
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I will put neck on a clamp to give more back bow.
I'll use a clamp on the neck as show .
you have nothing to lose by trying and it's safe if you follow my advice

You just have to reverse the installation as shown on both photos.
Warning; you must reverse because the photos show how to remove too much back bow, the opposite of what you have . I have experience with that.

I would force the handle slowly with pauses, I would go up to a 0.020 inch curvature in the 8th fret.
I would leave 24 hours under the vise/ clamp.
The standard negative bow ( concave fret board ) of a truss rod being close to 0.013 inches my favorite ( 0.010 to 0.015 ? )


Image[url=https://flic.kr/p/2gBXigk]Image[url=https://flic.kr/p/2gBXigk]


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Post subject: Re: Jazzmaster VM - neck straight
Posted: Fri Jul 19, 2019 1:57 am
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jmattis wrote:
Wait a minute... The original truss rod is already loose, and you have no need to tighten it since the neck is already too straight for your taste & playing style.
How would a new truss rod help the "too straight neck" situation..?

[\quote]

good point, I guess in that case a dual action truss rob would be needed, right?

jmattis wrote:
And your tech most likely talks about a fret job needed to shape the neck - take the frets off, sand relief to the fretboard, refret. And replace the truss rod while at it.

Anyways. At this point, I'd (still) take the truss rod nut out completely, use a .013 set and see what a month or two does. If you keep this neck, that partial fret job (shaving a very small bit off the mid neck frets to get relief) might be a good idea. But if you think about selling, leave that be - someone else may find the neck just perfect.

[\quote]

correct.


jmattis wrote:

And the usual reminder: a new (second hand) neck is usually a lot cheaper than what guitar techs charge for any major repair jobs. Squier necks 50-150, MIM's 100-200, MIJ's 200 and above.


I considered that too, but I am in Europe and parts are not so cheap.
One question about this: which Squier/Fender neck can I put on a Jazzmaster? would a Strato or Tele neck fit too?


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