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Post subject: Re: 2013 Eric Clapton Signature Stratocaster EC Red LTD
Posted: Sun Sep 23, 2012 3:19 am
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TheSalmonMoose wrote:
Personally, I find it utterly staggering that anyone posting in a custom shop forum would attempt to contradict what the custom shop director says. :roll:

I think that anyone participating in these forums should be grateful that Mike actually takes the time to post answers to our sometimes quite futile queries.

Okay, rant over - on to a question: what pickups are in TBO?? :twisted:

You're opinion is noted, well taken and appreciated. However, you've just got to have been around here a few more years to appreciate the length and breadth of the knowledge base possessed by the participants who draw their information and experiences from a variety of sources. I won't quibble with you in the matter any further than to say that, IMHO, the position I took in my last reply is not without merit.

We're well off the topic of this thread and, to reply to your question regarding the TBO, for which there exisits two very extensive, hot and heavy threads on the Mayer projects in archives [in which you'll actually find Mike taken to task by a multitude of contributors-needlessly-as a matter of fact] if you care to look further, the pickup question stands center stage. To the best of my memory they are reproductions of the pickups wound for the original guitar. TBO is an exact replica in all respects. Give the threads a read. :idea: You've got well over a year's worth of discussion ahead of you. :wink:

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Post subject: Re: 2013 Eric Clapton Signature Stratocaster EC Red LTD
Posted: Sun Sep 23, 2012 3:45 am
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Hi Doc,

I should justify my position - I am a long time lurker and avid consumer of the information of these forums, just not a very prolific poster. Consequently, I am certainly aware and respectful of the extensive knowledge posters such as Alain, Bill, Arjay and yourself possess. My point was directed more towards some of the posters who seem to challenge ME in an almost belief disconfirmation paradigm type of way. So my tongue in cheek TBO pickup question was a satirical swipe at the shitstorm that ensued when that topic was debated.

Anyway, you're quite right let's get back on topic. Chromeface, I have always enjoyed your Clapton threads, particularly the excellent images. Who's gonna get a ticket for Crossroads festival 2013 in NYC?


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Post subject: Re: 2013 Eric Clapton Signature Stratocaster EC Red LTD
Posted: Sun Sep 23, 2012 5:19 am
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Your kind words are greatly appreciated. Much to my dismay, I left NYC for good in June and am unlikely to return there just for the event unless I can persuade my wife to visit our grandchildren in New Jersey at that time. Besides, there's another activity on my calendar which I have to consider with respect to date conflicts and my wife is forever harping on Paris in the Spring, and I know that Alain and I would finally enjoy a sit down together on that accord. :wink:
The attendant question to that Crossroads event returns us once again to the matter of this thread which is whether or not we are going to see Eric sporting a new red guitar on that stage :?: :?: Having an '89 Pewter, I wasn't much tempted for the grigiosilverstone, but this red, I just might go for IF........ :wink:

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Post subject: Re: 2013 Eric Clapton Signature Stratocaster EC Red LTD
Posted: Sun Sep 23, 2012 7:15 am
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"I just might go for IF........ :wink: "
Please, carry on...

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Post subject: Re: 2013 Eric Clapton Signature Stratocaster EC Red LTD
Posted: Sun Sep 23, 2012 7:34 am
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ZZDoc wrote:
It appears that the Vintage Reissue guitars are no longer available.


The '57 and '62 Strats were discontinued. The '52 Tele is still in production.

The series has been updated with new models, only basses still remain unchanged since its introduction in 1982.


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Post subject: Re: 2013 Eric Clapton Signature Stratocaster EC Red LTD
Posted: Sun Sep 23, 2012 12:41 pm
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ZZDoc wrote:
chromeface wrote:
Interesting, I never saw Jeff using the N3s! :o

Would be impossible to know unless you were nose to nose with the pickup covers. Of greater interest to me was the tech's suposition that Fender would love to get their hands on those Suhr pickups so they could replicate them but that the guitars are never out of Jeff's hands long enough to get 'em back to the company. Who knows if he'd even permit it. He might even have an agreement with Suhr prohibiting such a happening. In this businesss ya never know. :wink:


The pickups are Fenders. John built them (with Abby) while he working for us. I have a set as well. Same exactly pickups. Todd is building some now. No black helicopters here. No Bigfoot.

ME


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Post subject: Re: 2013 Eric Clapton Signature Stratocaster EC Red LTD
Posted: Sun Sep 23, 2012 12:49 pm
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Mike Eldred - Fender wrote:
ZZDoc wrote:
chromeface wrote:
Interesting, I never saw Jeff using the N3s! :o

Would be impossible to know unless you were nose to nose with the pickup covers. Of greater interest to me was the tech's suposition that Fender would love to get their hands on those Suhr pickups so they could replicate them but that the guitars are never out of Jeff's hands long enough to get 'em back to the company. Who knows if he'd even permit it. He might even have an agreement with Suhr prohibiting such a happening. In this businesss ya never know. :wink:


The pickups are Fenders. John built them (with Abby) while he working for us. I have a set as well. Same exactly pickups. Todd is building some now. No black helicopters here. No Bigfoot.

ME


True, no black helicopters or big feet. More like the Iran/Contra fiasco. :wink: You've thus seconded my point exactly about mis-information by affirming that they are, indeed, Fender pickups.

Now why wouldn't a tech who's been with Beck for 12 years, and Beck for that matter, have known that so as to avoid giving the writer, the reader, and ultimately anyone the reader comes to pass this information on to, [myself and Chromeface for exmple]the false impression that Beck had something Fender would have loved to have gotten their hands on when, in fact, a Fender employee built them, and that there were not only TWO sets in existence, when, in reality, there are THREE and more on the way :? Perhaps that's something you ought to write a letter to the editor of Vintage Guitar about and set things right factually for the thousands of readers of that magazine. :idea:
Moving on from here we are obliged to ask ourselves how much of the remainder of that very informative article is now suspect with regard to its accuracy. :?

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Post subject: Re: 2013 Eric Clapton Signature Stratocaster EC Red LTD
Posted: Sun Sep 23, 2012 6:54 pm
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@ZZDoc

I'm very curious about EC and JB's guitars sporting older necks; to be more specific, Eric's "Cream Reunion/Back Home" Strat and Jeff's actual white axe.

The "Cream Reunion/Back Home" guitar uses a 1998 neck while Jeff's current stage axe a 1993.

Everyone believed that the so-called "White House" neck was made from a single piece of highly figured flamed maple and - ironically - the 1993 JB neck has been altered to accommodate the contoured heel from the white body.

True or false?


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Post subject: Re: 2013 Eric Clapton Signature Stratocaster EC Red LTD
Posted: Sun Sep 23, 2012 7:55 pm
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chromeface wrote:
@ZZDoc

I'm very curious about EC and JB's guitars sporting older necks; to be more specific, Eric's "Cream Reunion/Back Home" Strat and Jeff's actual white axe.

The "Cream Reunion/Back Home" guitar uses a 1998 neck while Jeff's current stage axe a 1993.

Everyone believed that the so-called "White House" neck was made from a single piece of highly figured flamed maple and - ironically - the 1993 JB neck has been altered to accommodate the contoured heel from the white body.

True or false?

If, by the Cream Reunion, you are referring to the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame Induction Ceremony, the guitar used there, according to Christies, was the Blackie prototype which we have discussed/described many times. It has neck date of 2/23/88. I have some memory of reading [perhaps in a Mike Steven's narrative on another website]that, in the course its development, it was first fitted with a 21 fret neck and then had it swapped out for a 22 fret neck.

If you are referring to the Reunion Concerts at the RAH and MSG, I have no reference at hand to quote from 'authoritatively', and I put that word into quotes because, as a consequence of our back and forth in this thread, I find that I am now obliged take everything I read on any and all matters regarding artists, their gear and their activities, with a grain of salt. To quote ME...I will now look on these as a 'snapshot' of the real thing.

All I know presently of the Beck guitar is derived from that Vintage Guitar article and, at this point, it serves no purpose to speculate further. We might Google search further and see what turns up but again, take it what we learn at face value only and not for absolute fact.

http://www.ainian.com/PRIOR.PDF

www.licklibrary.com/forum2/Thread.aspx? ... adID=27186

Note the discussion on the pickups...particulary naming "Jim" Suhr. To the best of my knowledge and belief he is not dead. :shock:

Phil Taylor's excellent treatment of the history of Gilmour's Black Strat serves only to demonstrate how difficult is must be to document, with historical accuracy, the service life of such an instrument. He does well offering photos, and purchase receipts but I doubt that any artist, from the outset, begins to keep a diary of the day to day events in the life their performance gear. It was likely beyond any stretch of Eric's imagination when he purchased that clutch of Strats at ShoBud in Nashville some 40+ years ago that that mongrel 'partsocaster' of his would eventually bring in excess of $1million, buyer's premium included. :shock:

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Last edited by ZZDoc on Sun Sep 23, 2012 8:59 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Post subject: Re: 2013 Eric Clapton Signature Stratocaster EC Red LTD
Posted: Sun Sep 23, 2012 8:56 pm
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I'm referring to the 2005 reunion concerts.

I was told by LeftyElliot that the blackie I'm talking about was fitted with an old neck dating from 1998.

The guitar in question was crafted by Larry Brooks and was first seen during the Crossroads benefit bash at MSG in 1998/1999. She's got a lot of modifications over the years: the LSes were exchanged for a set of VNs in March 2000 before reverting back to the previous configuration in early 2005 (Tsunami Aid concert) and a return to the current config during the Back Home sessions a couple of months later.


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Post subject: Re: 2013 Eric Clapton Signature Stratocaster EC Red LTD
Posted: Sun Sep 23, 2012 9:11 pm
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chromeface wrote:
I'm referring to the 2005 reunion concerts.

I was told by LeftyElliot that the blackie I'm talking about was fitted with an old neck dating from 1998.

The guitar in question was crafted by Larry Brooks and was first seen during the Crossroads benefit bash at MSG in 1998/1999. She's got a lot of modifications over the years: the LSes were exchanged for a set of VNs in March 2000 before reverting back to the previous configuration in early 2005 (Tsunami Aid concert) and a return to the current config during the Back Home sessions a couple of months later.


Ah yes...the Larry Brooks guitar. Summing up from Christies: They called that the "Apollo Guitar" because Larry Brooks and John Page came to rehearsals for the Apollo Theatre's 50th Anniversay Concert where EC gave them some specs changes for the guitar. There's a general reference to "changes in the neck and some finishing' but nothing specific in the discussions w/EC and LD other than 'don't put my signature on the headstock" and LD is 'guesstimating' that this is the time that request went in.

Have a look at the second link I've added tp my previous post. A proported one on one by the OP and Jeff Beck in 2010. I'd be interested in ME's take on this. I know of Lefty's interest in EC and his pursuit of LH signature guitar but from now on, for me, I'll be looking for source references with respect to these kinds of info: names, places, dates. :wink:

I'm done for the day. It's 12:21 am here, 9:21 pm on the West Coast. Don't know if ME is following this at his time of the evening. Will carry on after a snooze. Perhaps a few others will have picked up on this by then. :wink:

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Post subject: Re: 2013 Eric Clapton Signature Stratocaster EC Red LTD
Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2012 1:22 am
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ZZDoc wrote:
They called that the "Apollo Guitar" because Larry Brooks and John Page came to rehearsals for the Apollo Theatre's 50th Anniversary Concert where EC gave them some specs changes for the guitar. There's a general reference to "changes in the neck and some finishing' but nothing specific in the discussions w/EC and LD other than 'don't put my signature on the headstock" and LD is 'guesstimating' that this is the time that request went in.


Image

Image

Image

The huge baseball bat neck Jeff had put on his main stage guitar came from a 1993 model finished in Midnight Purple I guess...

Methinks the Midnight Purple JB with the humbucking Lace Sensor in the bridge position was undoubtedly the same guitar El Becko used at the Apollo Theatre bash from that year....


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Post subject: Re: 2013 Eric Clapton Signature Stratocaster EC Red LTD
Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2012 4:32 am
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What we lack here are accuate timelines. Eric is pictured in the catalog on stage, at that event, playing what is described in the caption as 'a different black strat.' One can only speculate from this that the Apollo guitar had not yet been built but there's nothing the remarks to suggest that they had not brought a guitar with them for his inspection/approval and the catalog indicates that the guitar's period of service as 'one of his main stage guitar' begins in 1998. I am also surmising from a comparison of the catalog photo and yours that yours is a rehearsal photo in that the catalog photo shows Diana Ross, BB and Eric more formally dressed and decribes them as 'on stage' as previously stated.
LD observes that when they were using black strats he had several 'on the go' for a performance, and 'they would all be used,consequently, 'it would not be easy to say which guitar was used for which particular thing'.

I've unfortunately trashed my copy of the Guitar Player issue whose cover depicts JB with that guitar. I've actually had an example of that guitar in my hands more years ago than I care to remember and recall my amazement at the size of that neck. Disbelief was more like it.

Equally fated was the cover issue featuring BG and the guitar he is holding which contained a brief description of the coming about of same. However, and I have written so herein, in the past, there was a BG Signature guitar which preceded that one and had a short run. It was depicted in the the Fender catalogs. It had a finish exactly like the ash FSR Strats Fender is showing currently, a tortoise shell scratch plate. It was SSS with pole pieces, and described as having a 12db midboost. I remember searching high and low for one but never saw it on a wall. I've always speculated that Fender ultimately brought that idea forward and created the Powerhouse Strat. Of course, he's gone at least two guitar styles beyond that since with the polka dot, and the blond guitar his playing the body of which I believe is something which was built for him some 15 years back and has been brought into service again. I have very personal knowledge, from incontrovertible sources, of other gear being built for him and by whom, but I have not seen, in print, anything referencing same therefore I am content to leave it as just that until we are gifted of same. :wink:

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Post subject: Re: 2013 Eric Clapton Signature Stratocaster EC Red LTD
Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2012 5:38 am
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In the following video steve prior explains that Jeff hated the "rather large C-shape neck" on the early signature strats, and that he had them all changed by J.W Black. which would mean the jb strats from the 90's were wrong instead of the other way around.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W4EBBPOr2no
This one is from the same series of videos where steve prior explains that jeff has been playing the prototype pickups instead of the hot noiseless sets, I was shamefully the first to point that out on these forums which I really regret because it has caused some much pointless discussion.

In the following russian masterclass (somewhere at the end) jeff personally confirms that the neck on the guitar he's playing is from his old guitar.

http://onmusicstage.com/video/757/

Hopefully the neck profile topic is put to rest now.

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Post subject: Re: 2013 Eric Clapton Signature Stratocaster EC Red LTD
Posted: Mon Sep 24, 2012 6:00 am
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Thanks for the input here. I have no doubt that Mike understands that bits and pieces of information are gleaned from a variety of sources to form a patchwork quilt which the fan base assembles into a whole, to their purpose. It becomes 'mildly disconcerting' to say the least, when Mike retorts sharply and essentially asks 'who do you believe?' when we take for granted that the individuals who are providing the information are credible. Two different guitar techs, working for Beck, had glaring errors in their commentaries...Prior going so far as to declaring that he believed "Jim" Suhr was dead, whilst the other had no information whatsoever on the history of the Suhr pickups. :shock:

Of course, in the day to day affairs of the world, these are merely trivialities. I wouldn't be surprised if Mike sees some of this as the proverbial fly buzzing around one's face at a picnic table disturbing what was hoped to be a pleasant meal. However, we are here for a purpose and we like our facts to be accurate. If I had practiced my art in such a fashion, my patients and their attorneys would have had a field day with me. :wink:

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