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Post subject: Re: urban legend?
Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 3:13 pm
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sikoniko wrote:
bluesky636 wrote:
If you read it on the Internet, it must be true. :lol:


So, while your response was less-than helpful, I am greatful for those that did chime in.

Thank you, :D
Dan


Wow. Grow a sense of humor. :roll:

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Post subject: Re: urban legend?
Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 5:09 pm
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Quote:
OK, so to the point. I've been reading about Fender Custom Shop, and there seems to be this belief that the guitars that are being made today are sub-par in comparison to the models that were produced in the '90s.


One way to judge how much better people think the 90s guitars are is by what they're willing to pay for them. In general, I haven't noticed "Page" era guitars getting big premiums. On the other hand "Cunetto's" do get a premium. As I recall, the price difference between a Cunetto and standard Custom shop guitar was something like 20% back in the day. Cunetto's are now worth a lot more then their 90s price but the standard 90s custom shop guitars don't do nearly as well.


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Post subject: Re: urban legend?
Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 10:27 pm
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johnjaypl wrote:
Quote:
OK, so to the point. I've been reading about Fender Custom Shop, and there seems to be this belief that the guitars that are being made today are sub-par in comparison to the models that were produced in the '90s.


One way to judge how much better people think the 90s guitars are is by what they're willing to pay for them. In general, I haven't noticed "Page" era guitars getting big premiums. On the other hand "Cunetto's" do get a premium. As I recall, the price difference between a Cunetto and standard Custom shop guitar was something like 20% back in the day. Cunetto's are now worth a lot more then their 90s price but the standard 90s custom shop guitars don't do nearly as well.


Vince didn't make the guitars, he relic'd parts, built by Fender and ultiimately returned to and assembled in the custom Shop. The whole Cunetto thing is a myth in its own right. You're right though, their price is reflective of an opinion, not a measure of quality.

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Post subject: Re: urban legend?
Posted: Tue Jun 28, 2011 6:18 am
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JamesVRoy wrote:
johnjaypl wrote:
Quote:
OK, so to the point. I've been reading about Fender Custom Shop, and there seems to be this belief that the guitars that are being made today are sub-par in comparison to the models that were produced in the '90s.


One way to judge how much better people think the 90s guitars are is by what they're willing to pay for them. In general, I haven't noticed "Page" era guitars getting big premiums. On the other hand "Cunetto's" do get a premium. As I recall, the price difference between a Cunetto and standard Custom shop guitar was something like 20% back in the day. Cunetto's are now worth a lot more then their 90s price but the standard 90s custom shop guitars don't do nearly as well.


Vince didn't make the guitars, he relic'd parts, built by Fender and ultiimately returned to and assembled in the custom Shop. The whole Cunetto thing is a myth in its own right. You're right though, their price is reflective of an opinion, not a measure of quality.



As I understand it, he also sprayed finish on the necks and bodies. Cunnetto's finish was thiner than the very thick finish that the Custom shop was using at the time. This might be part of the the reason these guitars have more appeal.

Of course, how much money people are willing to pay for a class of guitars at any moment in time doesn't really tell the whole story of how good those guitars are or what they're value will be at some other time.


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Post subject: Re: urban legend?
Posted: Tue Jun 28, 2011 2:36 pm
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Finish was done by the Fender Custom Shop.
Vince was only involved in the relicing.

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Post subject: Re: urban legend?
Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 5:43 am
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alainlafrance wrote:
Finish was done by the Fender Custom Shop.
Vince was only involved in the relicing.


According to Vince, Fender wasn't set up to do a thin nitro finish at the time so his shop sprayed the finish. Here's an interview with him:

http://www.vinettoguitars.com/index_fil ... 202004.pdf


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Post subject: Re: urban legend?
Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 6:15 am
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I was watching some of the eddie vegas videos this week and he made some comments that addressed my question...

He was demoing some of his relics and was talking how the custom shop is taking more attention to detail then ever before. He used an example of how the tone and volume knobs are 'more' correct than in the past. That the '50's knobs are different than the '60's knobs and I guess in the past they used the same knobs for both models.

Another thing he noted is how the custom shop is giving exposed wood a worn look; whereas, in the past they would not be. I can definately notice that change in guitars I own. I have a '57 NAMM that the exposed wood looks fairly fresh, while my 2010 roadshow guitar has exposed wood that looks more worn and natural.

seems to be a great time to be buying custom shop guitars! I'm glad that we have debunked the 'urban legend'!


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Post subject: Re: urban legend?
Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 6:37 am
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This is/was a Cunetto era Relic Telecaster my friend sold about 10 years ago
http://www.pbase.com/jroy/nocaster

I had it for awhile and had to fix the pickup where it was cutting out, because of the switch if I remember correctly. It sounded phenomenal but I hated the way it played, basically the neck and thickness. The finish to me looked ok, not as thin as has been decribed and as a relic not all too convincing in my estimation. This I believe was typical of the time and in fairness was an early one with a COA dated 96. This is not necessarily reflective on Vince or his process and in response to Sikoniko's post above about more correct parts he worked with the parts that were given to him. All in all, using this one by itself as an example I'm more biased towards later and contemporary relics, but then I have a real '54 so can be a hard marker.
However, the Custonm Shop is and has been so much more than "relics." The quality was there then and its there now. YMMV

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Post subject: Re: urban legend?
Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 2:58 am
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Just to put in a couple of things...

1) An eBay auction is not likely to be the most objective place for a review. The seller's task is to sell their guitar, by any means necessary, and in doing so they can claim that the guitar is somehow better because it's from a certain era.

2) Why buy a guitar relating to a review? One man's poop is another man's pot-pourri. When buying a guitar I will always play it first and then form my own opinion. Everyone should. If you can't or don't want to, fair enough... but I find nothing more satisfying than going to a shop and trying out a few guitars, picking out the best and taking it home with me.

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Post subject: Re: urban legend?
Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2011 8:01 am
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I bought Custom Shop guitars in all era's. I had 3 Relics which were finished and reliced by Cunetto. I never understood the hype, they were since guitars but for sure not special. Actually, the 60's Strat finished in Oly White had an orange peel paint job like a bad refin.
Then I ordered a Masterbuilt in '97, built by John English. Never bonded with it. I ordered 3 Strats starting in 2004, last in 2008. All built by C. Fleming. They are the best so far I got from the Custom Shop. These are the ones, which are still with me. I don't think the guitar built in the 90's are better.


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Post subject: Re: urban legend?
Posted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 9:40 pm
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i have seen cimarron red in tom wheelers strat book and it looks nothing close to whats on your 2nd picture...its probably the same red but your picture colors are way off...


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Post subject: Re: urban legend?
Posted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 1:26 am
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bluesky636 wrote:
If you read it on the Internet, it must be true. :lol:


Where did you hear this?


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Post subject: Re: urban legend?
Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 11:23 am
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trustee wrote:
i have seen cimarron red in tom wheelers strat book and it looks nothing close to whats on your 2nd picture...its probably the same red but your picture colors are way off...


My picture is just as way off as the actual Bill Carson's Strat colour I do own :roll:
http://www.guitarmotel.com/fender/43-stratocaster/196-fender-bill-carson-stratocaster

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Post subject: Re: urban legend?
Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2011 12:49 am
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Alain

@trustee makes a valid point.

http://www.guitarmotel.com/fender/43-st ... ratocaster

If I look at these 5 pictures, the colors are quite different.

1.)
Image
Image
Image

2.)
Image
Image
Image

It would be good to calibrate your camera.

http://www.rags-int-inc.com/PhotoTechSt ... libration/

Cheers

David

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Post subject: Re: urban legend?
Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2011 7:36 am
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Amerigo wrote:
Alain

@trustee makes a valid point.

http://www.guitarmotel.com/fender/43-st ... ratocaster

If I look at these 5 pictures, the colors are quite different.

1.)
Image
Image
Image

2.)
Image
Image
Image

It would be good to calibrate your camera.

http://www.rags-int-inc.com/PhotoTechSt ... libration/

Cheers

David


Thanks for the suggestion.

Photos have been taken from various angles vis a vis of the spots and from the grey background, hence some slight variations in light but not in colours.
Photos are taken in RAW then eventually processed through Photoshop.

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