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Post subject: Re: Is there a time when the CS guitars wood "breaks" ?
Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 3:23 am
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They will of been - so just imagine how good they will sound with a bit of play time!

Mayer said so the of his original BLK1 - when he got that in 04 too that over time it really started to come alive for him as it was played in.

Is quite an interesting thing really. These instruments are after all organic.

I still maintain to this day my non custom shop blk1 is one of the most resonant guitars i have ever played or owned, be it Fender or Gibson custom Shop, PRSs, Collings - and some vintage instruments i could never afford!
The thing is just alive as soon as you touch it. Stunning - and very lucky considering i got it significantly cheaper than some MBs ive played that didnt do it for me in the same way!


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Post subject: Re: Is there a time when the CS guitars wood "breaks" ?
Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 6:18 am
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Quote:
Magnets do indeed decay (hop over to the Les Paul Forums and listen to them wax lyrically about the magic of PAF's!)


AlNiCo magnet don't decay in normal situation. This is a myth, before AlNiCo this was a different situation. But AlNiCo magnet are pretty stable.
Here is a pretty good explanation about AlNiCo (permanent magnet) pickups in guitars. I'm not a big fan of his pickups, but Bill Lawrence knows his scientific stuff.

From Bill Lawrence webpage:

Quote:
Ceramics vs Alnico


When I read that ceramic magnets sound harsh and alnico magnets sound sweet, I ask myself, " Who the hell preaches such nonsense?" There are harsh-sounding pickups with alnico magnets and sweet-sounding pickups with ceramic magnets and vice-versa! A magnet by itself has no sound, and as a part of a pickup, the magnet is simply the source to provide the magnetic field for the strings. The important factor is the design of a magnetic circuit which establishes what magnet to use.

Though ceramic magnets cost less than alnico magnets of equal size, a well-designed magnetic circuit using ceramic magnets costs much more than the six Alnico 5 magnets of a traditional single coil pickup!

Aging

Before the introduction of alnico magnets in 1935, permanent magnets were not quite that permanent. During a certain time, they lost a good amount of magnetism till they finally reached a stable condition. The process to accelerate this decay was called in the industry, "magnetic aging." In modern science, it is called "stabilizing." Since the ‘50's, we use Alnico 5 magnets which lose, under normal conditions, less then half a percent per 100 years.

How do we achieve normal conditions?

Alnico magnets are shipped by the manufacturer in a non-magnetized condition and will not be magnetized until a pickup is completed.

How to maintain normal conditions?

After magnetization, avoid any close contact with other pickups or magnets facing either north to north or south to south with their magnetic poles. Don't ever throw pickups random in a drawer; you may either use a keeper on each side of the magnetic poles or carefully place them with the north facing the south pole of the other magnet. ( For tele players, remember that the iron backplate of a traditional tele pickup functions as a keeper which increases the stability of the magnets.)

Once pickups are in a guitar, there is very little to worry about. That your pickups lose some of their magnetism when you lean your guitar against an amp is nothing but a fairy tale. Or, that pickups lose some of their magnetism when you drop them on a concrete floor is just another fairy tale -- alnicos and ferrites will break before they have any measurable losses. Magnets are sensitive to heat, but so is your guitar. However, heat can be a severe problem when an Alnico 5 magnet is exposed to temperatures above 1000 F, approaching its Curie temperature of 1634 F. At these temperatures, Alnico 5 undergoes structural changes and cannot be re-magnetized. Why do I mention this? Because it happens quite often, when someone doesn't like the unbalance in output of a pickup with staggered magnets and goes to a bench grinder or a belt sander to grind a magnet down. You take a chance that a magnet gets too hot and becomes damaged.


Copyright © 1996-2010 Bill Lawrence


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Post subject: Re: Is there a time when the CS guitars wood "breaks" ?
Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 6:39 am
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That's a good read and clears some things up.


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Post subject: Re: Is there a time when the CS guitars wood "breaks" ?
Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 6:40 am
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ME, correct me if I'm wrong but that's also your point of view.

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Post subject: Re: Is there a time when the CS guitars wood "breaks" ?
Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:10 am
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Alain,
I work in the semiconductor industry and we make equipment that deposits metal in atomic layer thicknesses, we use permanent magnets made of AlNiCo. Believe me, we have no issue with AlNiCo magnets losing magnetic power.


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Post subject: Re: Is there a time when the CS guitars wood "breaks" ?
Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:11 am
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56Strat wrote:
Alain,
I work in the semiconductor industry and we make equipment that deposits metal in atomic layer thicknesses, we use permanent magnets made of AlNiCo. Believe me, we have no issue with AlNiCo magnets losing magnetic power.

I fully agree with you :wink:

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Post subject: Re: Is there a time when the CS guitars wood "breaks" ?
Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:32 am
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So the loss over time of a pickup resistance is not due to magnet weakening but rather the decay of the wiring?


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Post subject: Re: Is there a time when the CS guitars wood "breaks" ?
Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 8:07 am
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Dipple wrote:
I once read a tone report over on My Les Paul where they "opened up" the tone on a number of guitars by running them on a machine that artificially vibrated the guitars to simulate years of natural playing.

Results varied - on some instruments there was no change (dead wood!) on others though there was a marked improvement. And this was an independant test and not just someone promoting their own product!

Sadly though i cant find the report - and it was a good one. I'll have a look though Alain.

There is also a service provided for hollowbodies.....http://tonerite.com/guitar/vmchk

Could we soon be seeing aged/vibrated models!

Its the same with a speaker cone in a new amp - some nice big open chords to break it all in.


Yamaha does this with some of their high-end electrics ($10k+) - they get vibrated to simulate many years of playing. I've heard it does indeed make a difference, though I'd imagine the sort of materials used on a $10k guitar probably don't hurt, either.


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Post subject: Re: Is there a time when the CS guitars wood "breaks" ?
Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 8:50 am
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Choice of wood has to help the % of guitar resonating/sounding better.

I've been told that FCS and other manufacturer's take choice woods for their builds, then wood quality tiers down to lesser expensive CS's, then to American buids, then to MIM, etc- they segregate the wood. My tech taught me for right or wrong to look at back of headstock at woodgrain (excluding QS necks) and the tighter and the straighter the wood grain (like you would see on QS neck) runs from back of headstock through neck the better chance that guitar will resonate/sound better - be a "winner". Steer

That being said, if you find a American or MIM with tight grain, good chance guitar after a pro set-up will stand tall to a CS guitar minus CS logo, warranty, etc.

P.S. Probably why I have more guitars then I need, would find a "winner", have to buy :)


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Post subject: Re: Is there a time when the CS guitars wood "breaks" ?
Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 9:56 am
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Could it be the player getting use to the guitar and learning how to get the sound from that particular instrument.


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Post subject: Re: Is there a time when the CS guitars wood "breaks" ?
Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 10:20 am
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tbazzone wrote:
Could it be the player getting use to the guitar and learning how to get the sound from that particular instrument.


I' ve several guitars and use them regularly.
I do play the same way but each reacts differently. Some open up very quickly, some with much more time.
For some I'm still waiting...

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Post subject: Re: Is there a time when the CS guitars wood "breaks" ?
Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 11:38 am
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I have noticed with my Clapton strat the more I play it the better it sounds.


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Post subject: Re: Is there a time when the CS guitars wood "breaks" ?
Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 12:30 pm
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[quote="56Strat"
Maybe it's the amp after the tubes getting warmer. But I notice this with my Martin Authentic with the Adirondack top. That top needs some playing time to warm up, just like tubes.[/quote]
I practice unplugged.
And when I plug the guitar, the tube amp has been warming for almost an hour.

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Post subject: Re: Is there a time when the CS guitars wood "breaks" ?
Posted: Fri Apr 01, 2011 8:32 am
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My 2008 Rory Gallagher Strat was kind of a dog when I first got it... Wouldn't stay in tune... Didn't feel right, not resonant...

I stayed with it and over the past 3 years as it has been setup w/ TLC and the wood has had a chance to expand and contract as the seasons have changed... humidity up and down... anyway... the guitar is just STELLAR now... Doesn't go out of tune AT ALL, rings like crazy unplugged, etc... the difference is night and day.

It's hard to imagine because the relic's 'look' old and broken in but they really need to be played and adjusted. Time also helps.


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Post subject: Re: Is there a time when the CS guitars wood "breaks" ?
Posted: Fri Apr 01, 2011 8:46 am
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I have an old wood dobro from the 30s and no matter how hot, cold, dry or humid it gets, the neck never moves anymore.


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