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Post subject: Re: Looking for 1st tube amp under $800US
Posted: Mon Feb 02, 2015 10:17 am
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I've read good things about Jet City products and they seem to offer great value for money.

Hiwatt has a great history, but that can be irrelevant subject to where the amps are made these days.

There are a good many odd brands around which seem to offer good value for money. I have a Bugera V5 which I am very pleased with indeed.The Fender 600 Champion has the edge sound wise but the Bugera offers greater flexibility.

Interesting comments on the RAT Amps webs site http://www.ratvalveamps.com/subzero-tube-20r in respect of the Subzero. These amps seem to offer spectacular value for money if you can be bothered to open them up and Loctite all off the fixings.

I have quite a fancy for the Subzero 5W combo or head...but with three 5 Watt tube amps already it is a little difficult to justify another one, even if it costs less than a reasonable stomp box. 8)

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Last edited by John Sims on Tue Feb 03, 2015 1:57 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: Looking for 1st tube amp under $800US
Posted: Mon Feb 02, 2015 10:42 am
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63supro wrote:
Hi Dan,
That Hiwatt is 18 watts. I tried one and really liked it. If I just didn't just build my own 18 watt Marshall clone, I probably would have picked one up. For me it's no contest between a Hiwatt and a Blues Jr. The Blues Jr always sounded small and boxy to me with its internal speaker. Fane makes some really fine speakers. I don't know where your located, but VHT makes some really nice hand-wired amps as well as Jet City and the Peavey Classic is another great amp, but between those two amps, Hiwatt gets my vote.


That's great to hear from someone else who's tried both. I thought the sound of the Hiwatt was much more of a true traditional vintage sound -which for my bluezy style suited really well. As good as the Blues Juniors are I'm afraid I have to admit that the Hiwatt is even better.
Thanks for your input mate, I think you've finally convinced me which one to chose!
:-)

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Post subject: Re: Looking for 1st tube amp under $800US
Posted: Mon Feb 02, 2015 1:49 pm
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Dan999 wrote:
63supro wrote:
Hi Dan,
That Hiwatt is 18 watts. I tried one and really liked it. If I just didn't just build my own 18 watt Marshall clone, I probably would have picked one up. For me it's no contest between a Hiwatt and a Blues Jr. The Blues Jr always sounded small and boxy to me with its internal speaker. Fane makes some really fine speakers. I don't know where your located, but VHT makes some really nice hand-wired amps as well as Jet City and the Peavey Classic is another great amp, but between those two amps, Hiwatt gets my vote.


That's great to hear from someone else who's tried both. I thought the sound of the Hiwatt was much more of a true traditional vintage sound -which for my bluezy style suited really well. As good as the Blues Juniors are I'm afraid I have to admit that the Hiwatt is even better.
Thanks for your input mate, I think you've finally convinced me which one to chose!
:-)


Dan, Just noticed you're in Australia, I hear equipment prices are insane. I'll tell you what, If you like the Blues, If you have access to any kit amps, I built a copy of a Fender 5e3 Tweed Deluxe and a Marshall 18 watt 1974x that just screams the Blues. Both great amps. Jet City amps are designed by Mike Soldano of Soldano amp fame. Nice solid amps. If you can get that Hiwatt for a good price, it would seem to fit the bill, especially with a half power switch.

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Post subject: Re: Looking for 1st tube amp under $800US
Posted: Thu Feb 05, 2015 2:45 pm
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Yeah mate, you're right about equipment prices being insane! You see, until about 9 months ago the Australian dollar was equal, if not slightly higher than the the US dollar. Then over the last 9 months or so it has gradually dropped to 0.78cents to $1US. This has caused the price of imported goods to go up a fair bit...especially electronics. Really sux!
The cheapest I've seen a Fender Blues Junior is $699-AUD, just to give you a bit of an idea how inflated the prices are here.
Australia recently signed a Free Trade Agreement with Japan and China in 2014 due to take effect soon. This will mean we won't have to pay duty and import taxes and will bring down prices from those countries. Because the USA uses different voltage to Asia and Australia importing an amp say, from the USA, would end up costing heaps to convert for it to be usable here.
:-)

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Post subject: Re: Looking for 1st tube amp under $800US
Posted: Thu Feb 05, 2015 2:56 pm
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That does suck Dan. On the amp I just built, there are different voltage taps on the power transformer just for that. Dan, I would seriously snag the Hiwatt.

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Post subject: Re: Looking for 1st tube amp under $800US
Posted: Sun Feb 08, 2015 2:30 am
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Well...Duh.

Which was the point of my first response, which you trashed. Didn't get too far did you. Clown.


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Post subject: Re: Looking for 1st tube amp under $800US
Posted: Sun Feb 08, 2015 5:07 am
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Drubbing wrote:
Don't know how helpful the replies will be, as US posters will suggest all sorts of amps under $800, that you can't get, or imported to Oz, for under $800.

You are a complete sad sack aren't you? You didn't tell me anything I didn't already know you moron. In fact you displayed your ignorance in saying I can get amps imported from the USA...Yeah, and then pay a few hundred getting the transformers replaced so that it can be used with Australia's 240 volts!!

You are a just a loser so go away.

:-)

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Post subject: Re: Looking for 1st tube amp under $800US
Posted: Sun Feb 08, 2015 7:48 pm
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Dan999 wrote:
Drubbing wrote:
Don't know how helpful the replies will be, as US posters will suggest all sorts of amps under $800, that you can't get, or imported to Oz, for under $800.

You are a complete sad sack aren't you? You didn't tell me anything I didn't already know you moron. In fact you displayed your ignorance in saying I can get amps imported from the USA...Yeah, and then pay a few hundred getting the transformers replaced so that it can be used with Australia's 240 volts!!

You are a just a loser so go away.

:-)



I would just ignore the fool that's messing with you. Don't even read his comments or respond to them. It's a waste of time. We know a fool when we see one.

As far as the amp goes, one of the main criteria that I look for in an amp purchase is "reliability" and the associated "fixability".

Fender is probably widely available in your part of the World. They are also very dependable, well designed amps, based on old proven circuits that any experienced amp man will be able to work on well into the unforeseen future. And, the parts for the Blues Juniors are "always" going to be available. Therefore, the Fender Blues Junior would be a good solid purchase that you can expect to be dependable and highly fixable.

Another thing to consider is that there is "zero" substitute for the "Fender Clean" that the Blues Junior will provide you.

I enjoy playing Blues Juniors but own a Deluxe Reverb RI and a lacquered tweed special edition Hot Rod Deluxe with an alnico speaker. I dig the Blues Junior because it has a master volume and you can turn up that preamp volume to drive the front end for some grit and overdrive, and turn down the master volume so you can have great overdriven tone at low volume. The fat button is useable. The EQ is good. It is a loud fifteen watts. Plus that fifteen watts is an "estimate". The actual wattage is probably more than fifteen watts.

There are many, many excellent mods for the Blues Junior as pioneered by BillM. There are great speaker replacements to get even better sound out of it. A more sensitive speaker will make it a lot louder.

For me, the Blues Junior is very decent stock, right out of the box. I dig the amp.

Is the Fender more available where you are and more easy to get fixed? I would look at those important things.

Plus the design of the amp is just plain going to be a real good, proven design, that should be reliable and produce the sounds that you want for many years to come. Plus it has EL84 tubes that you can just pull out of it after they wear and plug a new matched set into the amp - without having to "bias" it. This is a big plus because it saves you time and money and you can experiment with different rated EL84 power tubes.

You don't need a standby switch on an amp like the Blues Junior, or Fender would have put one on there, but there is a simple BillM mod to put a standby switch on it.

There is no substitute for a Fender amp, in my opinion. Having a nice Fender is a definitely a great addition to any guitar rig in my opinion.

I would seriously think about the Fender and all the positives that it represents, expecially that "Fender clean" sound that comes along with it. You can get any number of pedals for overdrive, etc. Also the Fender reverb on the Blues Junior is very nice.

Good luck and I hope you give the Fender a close look. Maybe you will just decide to work a deal on it with the salesman and be able to get it for a price that you can walk out the door with it. They "want" to make sales, and losing a sale to a different company is not something they want to do, so they will be willing to work with you. Maybe you can lock in a great price and put a down payment on it, or just plain buy it and walk out with it.

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Post subject: Re: Looking for 1st tube amp under $800US
Posted: Mon Feb 09, 2015 6:46 am
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I agree with you about the BJr 1Duffy1. I would point out that the 15 watt output power rating is not just an estimate, but a clean 15 watts of output power (minimum THD) with a specific AC signal voltage input at a specific frequency, measured with a resistive load connected to the output. Push the amp to distortion, and/or add pedals to the input and yes, you can get more wattage out.

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Post subject: Re: Looking for 1st tube amp under $800US
Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:17 pm
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Spent the last twelve months scraping up for a Blues Jr.... and just ordered a Ibanez TSA15 combo instead! I was wooed away by the ability to switch from 15 watts to 5 and the video comparisons between the two. Hope I made the right choice!

There are some trade outs: the TSA has a built-in Tubescreamer circuit but the Blues Jr. has a built-in Reverb. TSA uses 6V6 power tubes and Blues Jr. uses EL84s. But the TSA has phenomenal cleans at the highest levels and has a steady volume gain whereas the Blues Jr. is "Hot-Rodded" and jumps up in volume high early on the dial.

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Post subject: Re: Looking for 1st tube amp under $800US
Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2015 7:23 pm
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Tiger J wrote:
... the Blues Jr. is "Hot-Rodded" and jumps up in volume high early on the dial.


I have never heard that about the BJr, and I believe that you are mistaken. I have heard it about the HRDlx, which is a bit exaggerated IMO, but not the BJr.

I have both the HRDlx and BJr, neither have the mythical "zero to wide-open" syndrome.

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Post subject: Re: Looking for 1st tube amp under $800US
Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2015 8:52 pm
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shimmilou wrote:
Tiger J wrote:
... the Blues Jr. is "Hot-Rodded" and jumps up in volume high early on the dial.


I have never heard that about the BJr, and I believe that you are mistaken. I have heard it about the HRDlx, which is a bit exaggerated IMO, but not the BJr.

Lou, my HRDlx had it, and I didn't find it exaggerated at all. Compared to my Twin, Bandmaster, Vibrolux and just about any amp I've owned or built, that volume dial on the Hot Rod series was pretty touchy. That was the first time I ever experienced anything like that. Usually the volume was way more gradual on all my other amps. It's not mythical and very well documented. That's why that little volume box showed up on Ebay that you hooked up in the effects loop. Juston Holten had a mod for it. That was the least of my concerns with mine though. Seems like it may have been a part of the Hot Rod thing to make it seem a lot louder than it really was. Mine never got much louder after about four on the volume dial.

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Post subject: Re: Looking for 1st tube amp under $800US
Posted: Thu Feb 12, 2015 9:28 pm
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I've heard about it on the HRDlx, but not the BJr. The only way that I can see that some HRDlx have "touchy" vol pots is that maybe some mistakenly had a linear taper pot instead of the audio taper specified in the schematic, or some other abnormality, but it doesn't appear to be normal anyway. I know for sure that every HRDlx that I have ever tried doesn't have a vol pot issue, including mine. :shrug:

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Post subject: Re: Looking for 1st tube amp under $800US
Posted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 1:10 pm
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I've only ever played the Blues Jr. III at GC... it did seem to get loud early in the dial but I figured that was the design. I have not played the TSA... had to buy it on faith (at $200 less than a BJ new - which certainly helped! :wink: ) But one of the YouTube comparisons or Strat-Tele Talk forum discussions about the two amps brought up the subject that many claim the 15-watt BJ is "louder" than the TSA at 15-watts. It was explained that the BJ just gets louder faster on the dial and the TSA has a more levelled volume increase across the dial. The person in the discussion called the BJ "Hot-Rodded."

I did think that the BJ was part of Fender's "Hot Rod" series of amps. But I am new to all of this and wouldn't argue with any of y'all who know way more about the equipment and playing in general!

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Post subject: Re: Looking for 1st tube amp under $800US
Posted: Fri Feb 13, 2015 8:22 pm
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Originally, the series of amps were called "F.A.T." series amps, later changed to the "Hot Rod" series, and included the PJr, BJr, HRDlx, HRDvl. The HRDlx and HRDvl are "hot-rodded" versions of the Dlx and Dvl amps that preceded them, but the PJr and BJr have no previous versions, and are not "hot-rodded" so-to-speak. If the BJr is to be considered "hot-rodded" it would be in comparison to the only other previous amp that is anywhere close to the BJr, which is one of Leo's amps, the Tremolux with EL84s.

So, on one hand, it is said that the BJr is not loud enough to gig with, yet gets too loud early on the dial? It can't be both ways, and no, the BJr doesn't get that loud early on in the volume dial, even if the master is already cranked. If you know how to use a Master Volume, leave the master down, turn up the volume to get the amount of distortion desired, then turn up the master, the volume increase is as smooth as any tube amp. And I still say that the so-called volume "jump" on the HRDlx is at least a little bit exaggerated. :wink: I do agree that the "More Drive" channel on the HRDlx, with the Drive pot cranked, the Master is very touchy, and that goes back to knowing how to use a Master volume control. It makes me think that this is what people mean when they talk about the volume "jump", not the clean channel volume, but the Drive channel Master volume, which is a separate control for a separate channel.

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