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Post subject: Re: feedback from reverb in frontman 25r
Posted: Thu Dec 05, 2013 1:20 pm
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horax wrote:
Just called my GC, and they actually received a shipment of the frontman 25r's yesterday, so I can go in and see if they all do this or not.


I can tell you for sure that mine does not do it. I think you just got a bad apple.

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Post subject: Re: feedback from reverb in frontman 25r
Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 12:28 am
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I'm hoping that's the case.

However, I think the champion has me intrigued a bit at this point.


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Post subject: Re: feedback from reverb in frontman 25r
Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 2:10 am
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bluesky636 wrote:
AaronK,

Your post has absolutely no bearing on the operation of the Frontman 25R reverb.


Geez, Bluesky, for a technical person you really missed the point of the post. The Reverb Tank spring/coil design is fairly similar in all fender amps, so my post is relevant to troubleshooting reverb feedback, as I have personally solved that issue on my amp, have you?

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Post subject: Re: feedback from reverb in frontman 25r
Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 2:52 am
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AaronK wrote:
The Reverb Tank spring/coil design is fairly similar in all fender amps, so my post is relevant to troubleshooting reverb feedback, as I have personally solved that issue on my amp, have you?


No it is not.

Image



If you took even one minute to examine this demonstrative photo that bluesky posted of a Frontman 25R's innards, you'd understand immediately that you stepped on your own dick with your sweeping over-generalization and apparent ignorance of the facts.

And as for you "solving technical issues", Bill was repairing amps before you popped your first zit.

:lol:

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: feedback from reverb in frontman 25r
Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 5:41 am
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Retroverbial wrote:
AaronK wrote:
The Reverb Tank spring/coil design is fairly similar in all fender amps, so my post is relevant to troubleshooting reverb feedback, as I have personally solved that issue on my amp, have you?


No it is not.

Image



If you took even one minute to examine this demonstrative photo that bluesky posted of a Frontman 25R's innards, you'd understand immediately that you stepped on your own dick with your sweeping over-generalization and apparent ignorance of the facts.

And as for you "solving technical issues", Bill was repairing amps before you popped your first zit.

:lol:

Arjay


Sorry Arjay but you are the dick now, you clearly have no understanding of how a spring reverb works. My posts clearly talk about the spring assembly and not the housing and the look of it. And I can clearly see in the photo what I am referring to. I thought you were smart, but you are nothing but arrogant. And just because someone has been fixing things for a long time doesn't mean they are good at it. So chill out and read the post properly and stop letting your egos get ahead of your intelegence.

Just so it's easy for you, here is the important finding as to what cause my reverb to feedback: (this is in that post)

"So I took a close look at mine and after a long hard check and fiddle I found that one bead was sitting way too close to the reverb transformer plate, and with gravity added it was REALLY close."

...and one other thing, I thought we were merely suggesting possible causes for the OP's issues so that he may attempt to get a solution. If my suggestions did not apply then so be it, Bill didn't have to incorrectly oust me because he did not understand the concept.

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Post subject: Re: feedback from reverb in frontman 25r
Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 7:15 am
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Last edited by bluesky636 on Sat Dec 07, 2013 8:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: feedback from reverb in frontman 25r
Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 8:23 am
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AaronK wrote:
...I took a close look at mine and after a long hard check and fiddle I found that one bead was sitting way too close to the reverb transformer plate...


Hey AaronK,

Could you post a picture of this if you get a chance. I can't quite figure out what this bead is, maybe it is something on specific models of reverb tanks? Perhaps ferrite beads?

I have been at this sort of thing for more years than I care to remember, yet I still learn something new quite often. Sometimes, when I'm feeling like an eggspurt, I have a humbling experience. 8)

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Post subject: Re: feedback from reverb in frontman 25r
Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 11:05 am
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AaronK wrote:
Sorry Arjay but you are the dick now, you clearly have no understanding of how a spring reverb works.


Personal insults are the last refuge of a neophyte vainly attempting to defend an untenable position.

Go play with your ferrite beads, pal.

:lol:

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: feedback from reverb in frontman 25r
Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 10:11 pm
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Really guys - do I have to explain myself?

Ok here goes:

This is what I call a "ferrite bead" (also known as a magnetic core):
Image

Fender Accutronics type Reverb Tank assembly:
Image

Reverb Tank in question:
Image

Correct mounting and bead alignment:
Image

General Fender orientation (showing offset bead alignment which caused my feedback):
Image

If the bead is not centralized with gravity in affect it can cause excessive feedback sensitivity, thats what I found in my case.

*EDIT: Also note that the spring reverb in most guitar amps works by twisting the spring rotationally and not by vibration. This is what helps a reverb tank block most normal cab vibrations from interfering with the signal too much. So these ferrite beads are magnetized left to right not top to bottom in order for them to operate in this manner. Therefore when I rotated the bead on mine to fix the alignment, I may have also reduced it's field sensitivity, thus combined alignment and field rotation, eliminated it's sensitivity to feedback.

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Last edited by AaronK on Sat Dec 07, 2013 4:15 am, edited 4 times in total.

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Post subject: Re: feedback from reverb in frontman 25r
Posted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 10:39 pm
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Now you're making sense, Aaron.

And that's scary.

:mrgreen:

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: feedback from reverb in frontman 25r
Posted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 5:50 am
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Thanks AaronK

The picture of the reverb tank that you posted looks exactly like the one posted by bluesky636. Now I see the beads in a photo that I have of another Accutronics, never really noticed them before.

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Post subject: Re: feedback from reverb in frontman 25r
Posted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 8:07 am
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Upon closer examination of the 25R spring assembly, I have located the beads described. Please accept my apologies.

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Post subject: Re: feedback from reverb in frontman 25r
Posted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 8:15 am
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Accepted, no harm done, I am tough enough to take it.

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Post subject: Re: feedback from reverb in frontman 25r
Posted: Sun May 18, 2014 2:56 pm
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OT post, since we got the 25R guts out, I was pondering the idea of having a point to point version of the 25R built (only the clean channel, no hi gain section, no aux in or headphones out).

Anyone would care to advise on the best way to go about this and what might be the cost to build this? I would get a new chassis and cabinet to put the circuit in. The 25R clean channel sounds fantastic but I'm concerned about the durability of the thing, considering the low price. If I could get a top shelf version of this circuit made this might be my ultimate amp.


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Post subject: Re: feedback from reverb in frontman 25r
Posted: Sun May 18, 2014 3:32 pm
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TC5A wrote:
OT post, since we got the 25R guts out, I was pondering the idea of having a point to point version of the 25R built (only the clean channel, no hi gain section, no aux in or headphones out).

Anyone would care to advise on the best way to go about this and what might be the cost to build this? I would get a new chassis and cabinet to put the circuit in. The 25R clean channel sounds fantastic but I'm concerned about the durability of the thing, considering the low price. If I could get a top shelf version of this circuit made this might be my ultimate amp.


Absolute waste of time and money. There are plenty of real amp kits available that are easier to build, sound better, and are worth more in the long run than trying to copy a 25R circuit.

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