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Post subject: Micing My HRD III
Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 6:55 am
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I am planning on getting an SM-57 to Mic my HRDeluxe III and I have one question about it. How should I set the settings on the Mixing Board for the "best" (subjective, yes) sound?


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Post subject: Re: Micing My HRD III
Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 8:15 am
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Subjective, indeed!

You're dealing with a myriad of variables when the topic is SR/PA systems. When you mic an instrument (or amp) the board's EQ controls will make or break the overall sound. As well, you'll be compensating for specific room acoustics, the frequency response and dispersion pattern of your main speakers, the type of mic, even the composition of the stage floor or band riser. Set the board's EQ controls to "flat" and use those settings as a baseline datum point. Hardwood or tiled floors and paneled walls make for an extremely "bright" room. In those instances, roll the highs back. Conversely, carpeting and drapery will suck the highs out of the mix so attenuate the bass accordingly. Avoid using any of the mixer's on-board effects for an amp mic (a little reverb or simple echo is okay). Position your amp mic to the front of a speaker, midway between the voice coil and the cone surround and slighty off-axis, with four to six inches of separation between the mic's diaphragm and the amp's grill cloth. A unidirectional mic (such as your SM57) does not do well merely hanging from the top of the amp -- use a short mic stand and add a goose-neck to it if additional height is required.

HTH

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: Micing My HRD III
Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 10:47 am
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This is a great site that shows (and lets you hear) how moving a mic slightly can sometimes be the best EQ:

http://www.seymourduncan.com/tonefiend/ ... he-basics/

Once you find a spot(s) you like, a small piece of gaff tape (not duct tape) on the speaker grill isn't a bad idea for future setup.

If you have your own mic, a Z-Bar is a great investment as it lets you position the mic where you want, but it also eliminates a mic stand -- great for when you are on those tight stages with little room to move. I have 2 for other band members.

I love the SM57, but for a little more money, I'm very happy with the Sennheiser E906 mics - I think they sound fantastic on guitar. Don't bother with the e609 -- it's too similar to a 57 to make a difference. Other benefit: no mic stand needed; as a side-address mic, it just drapes down over the speaker.

Key thing about your amp in the mix is that you're trying to reinforce your sound to the overall band mix; it should allow you to keep your stage volume lower so that everyone can hear each other, but you're not trying to push your amp to have the audience hear it.

The other thing is that while a guitar amp can cover a lot of frequencies on its own, you're playing in a band; leaving room for the other instruments is helpful and makes for cleaner mixes.

What I do when I'm mixing our band live or most sound techs do:

Levels - ensure that you have your amp at the level it's going to be at so that the soundman can set gain levels accurately. Don't be "that guy" who turns his volume down by half during soundcheck, and then turns up during the song, wrecking the band mix. Remember that if you're too loud, the soundman will just pull your fader down and then few people will hear you.

EQ
Lows - if the mixer has a HPF (high-pass filter), engage this. It cuts out everything below usually 80Hz; if it's variable I'll cut sometimes to 100Hz. Reason is that your bass player and the kick drum should rule the low end, not you. Most of the <100Hz is just mud anyway on guitar live.

Mids - guitar amps have usually a nice hump around 5K that suits the SM57 nicely; you may want to either tame that or accentuate it based on the mix.

Highs - adjust your amp tone controls to ensure the sound isn't too icepicky; if you need to roll off highs with a LPF (low pass filter), look to around 15KHz and play around there. Again, you're trying to remove excess audio information you don't really need.

Agree with Arjay on effects - depending on the venue, you usually won't need any.

Also in terms of the "best sound," it's the tone that fits best with the band for that venue - the EQ settings I've suggested are starting points; cutting the extreme lows and highs is what is called "tucking in the corners" and doesn't really change your sound, but it does wonders to clean up a mix. I do this on all channels; on vocals I'll cut up to 120Hz on male vocals, 150Hz on female vocals. Obviously, you don't cut the low end on bass or kick...

Good luck! Let us know if you're mixing or if this is for live shows.

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Post subject: Re: Micing My HRD III
Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 10:51 am
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Retroverbial wrote:
Subjective, indeed!

You're dealing with a myriad of variables when the topic is SR/PA systems. When you mic an instrument (or amp) the board's EQ controls will make or break the overall sound. As well, you'll be compensating for specific room acoustics, the frequency response and dispersion pattern of your main speakers, the type of mic, even the composition of the stage floor or band riser. Set the board's EQ controls to "flat" and use those settings as a baseline datum point. Hardwood or tiled floors and paneled walls make for an extremely "bright" room. In those instances, roll the highs back. Conversely, carpeting and drapery will suck the highs out of the mix so attenuate the bass accordingly. Avoid using any of the mixer's on-board effects for an amp mic (a little reverb or simple echo is okay). Position your amp mic to the front of a speaker, midway between the voice coil and the cone surround and slighty off-axis, with four to six inches of separation between the mic's diaphragm and the amp's grill cloth. A unidirectional mic (such as your SM57) does not do well merely hanging from the top of the amp -- use a short mic stand and add a goose-neck to it if additional height is required.

HTH

Arjay


Excellent points Arjay. The other factor which good soundmen are aware of is EQ'ing channels at the beginning of the night when no one is at the venue, but making sure it sounds great when it's packed with people -- the room sound will change dramatically. Indoor vs. outdoor is another big change as you gain/lose reflective surfaces.

Make friends with your soundman, and if there's a monitor mix man him too. Introduce yourself before the show, learn their name (vs. shouting "hey soundman, can you turn up the vocals?") and behave as you'd expect to be treated. You'd be surprised how far common courtesy and respect goes.

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'59? Bogen Challenger CHA-33, '65 Bandmaster, '65 Tremolux, 65 Showman;
'74 SF Princeton; '77 SF Princeton Reverb; Dr. Z Mini Z

Our band: http://www.facebook.com/thetoysband


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Post subject: Re: Micing My HRD III
Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 1:37 pm
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One more thing...

Hearing your amp is key, but too loud and it ruins the mix. Part of the reason we turn up is that if the amp is on the floor, you have to really crank it to hear 4-5 feet above with your ears.

Ensure that you have your amp either up on a chair, roadcase, or tilted back on the floor with either an amp stand or Fender tilt-back legs - that way, the amp is pointing towards your ears instead of your ankles. You'll be able to hear yourself much better at lower stage volume. I have an Ultimate Genesis stand for my Princeton Reverb or for guest guitarists, and my Bandmaster combo and my Showman have the Fender tilt-back legs.

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'59? Bogen Challenger CHA-33, '65 Bandmaster, '65 Tremolux, 65 Showman;
'74 SF Princeton; '77 SF Princeton Reverb; Dr. Z Mini Z

Our band: http://www.facebook.com/thetoysband


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Post subject: Re: Micing My HRD III
Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 1:57 pm
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Here's my "amp stand", Nedo......

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Folks in the next county don't have any problems hearing me.

:lol:

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


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Post subject: Re: Micing My HRD III
Posted: Thu Aug 16, 2012 3:19 pm
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Very nice! Guessing they don't need to add a lot to the PA when you've got that rig running! Like the fact that the Twin Reverb is up where you can hear it, and the dual 15's where you can feel it.

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'59? Bogen Challenger CHA-33, '65 Bandmaster, '65 Tremolux, 65 Showman;
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Our band: http://www.facebook.com/thetoysband


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