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Post subject: Current Production equivalent for older Groove Tube 12AX7?
Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 1:21 pm
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My amp is a Fender Blues Deluxe Reissue amp that is at least 3 years old, and it still has the original preamp tubes in it, which I want to replace. The preamp tubes are labeled “Groove Tube GT-12AX7”. There is no suffix after “12AX7” on the label like “C” or “R” or “R1”, etc., which is how all Groove Tubes' current 12Ax7 offerings are labelled. :( The coloring on the label of my old tube is yellow in color.

I’d like to get a replacement tube that is the same as the one I have now – are any of Groove Tube's current tubes the same as this one, even thoguh they are labelled differently now? If not, is their any tube out there that sounds really close to this tube?


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Post subject: Re: Current Production equivalent for older Groove Tube 12AX
Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 3:08 pm
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Look at the glass closely for the original label, such as "12AX7WA Made in Russia" in faint black lettering. :idea:

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Post subject: Re: Current Production equivalent for older Groove Tube 12AX
Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 5:46 pm
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i have the same tubes. they were in my bdri i bought about 3 yrs ago. there's no label other than the one he said was on his. my suggestion is to get a set of 12ax7wc tubes that would be a great tube in that amp. ecc83's work nice too. 12ax7wc gives that amp a "tweed twin" sort of sound and the ecc83's will be a LITTLE more marshally especially with a set of jj 6l6...some where in the jtm45 type of tone.IMHO.


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Post subject: Re: Current Production equivalent for older Groove Tube 12AX
Posted: Tue May 22, 2012 10:10 am
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yes, like blackstrat71 says, my tubes do not contain any other labeling other than the Groove Tube markings.

thanks for the suggestions blackstrat71.


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Post subject: Re: Current Production equivalent for older Groove Tube 12AX
Posted: Tue May 22, 2012 10:41 am
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Could either of you post a closeup pic of one of the yellow labeled tubes? If there are no other markings on the glass, they might be Chinese (-C). Sometimes you can identify the Chinese tubes visually. Not all, but some have the extra metal tabs on the Plates, or other features that set them apart. :idea:

Chinese preamp tubes have come standard in this amp for awhile, and so have the WC, but typically the WA or WC will still be visible on the glass along with Sovtek and Made in Russia. I am a Sovtek fan, but in this amp the Chinese preamp tubes will give a creamier/smoother overdrive, while the WC will be a little harder-edged modern sound. Either are good, depending on your preferences.

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Post subject: Re: Current Production equivalent for older Groove Tube 12AX
Posted: Tue May 22, 2012 4:17 pm
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i can guarentee that they are not chineese (12ax7-c). i have a set of those too. they sound completely different. way more distortion/ fuzz mids are more pronounced. damn nice set i might add. i like them but they don't work in all ocassions. i'm thinking he may need to go to the G.T. web sight and look at some tubes and locate them from a dealer if that is truly what he is after. personolly i'd go with the wa series but they can get a little "popcornish pops" in the signal. i'm really not sure what the G.T. web site has to offer for an equivilant tube set. the f.s.t. set does sound nice though. i made my own set of those with two 12ax7_c and a matched 12at7 j.j. . it works nice with the bdri for a nice blues sound. i like the bdri as loud as it will get when i want it to. just for good measure i also have an ac30 only because i'm a rory fan. i can run amps from both of his eras. i like for my fender amps to get the boosted fender sound and be LOUD. loud and clear is what fender does best. on that note the wc tubes are nice and loud too.


Last edited by blackstrat71 on Wed May 23, 2012 2:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: Current Production equivalent for older Groove Tube 12AX
Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 2:22 pm
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shimmilou, I will take some pics of the tube and post them in a reply later tonight when I am home.

Additionally, for whatever it is worth, a Groove Tube representative responded to my inquiry to them, and stated that the closest Production tube to this old tube, would be the 12AX7-R.


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Post subject: Re: Current Production equivalent for older Groove Tube 12AX
Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 7:06 pm
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Here's those pics:

Image



Image


Image


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Post subject: Re: Current Production equivalent for older Groove Tube 12AX
Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 7:38 pm
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Thank you very much, great pics and the details are apparent.

As I suspected, those are definitely Chinese, note the extra metal tabs on the side of the Plate (and the triple mica spacers). If you want the same tubes, the 12AX7-C will be the same as what you have shown in the pics, although with a different label. :idea: Not sure why the rep said "R" when they are clearly Chinese, maybe if he saw the pictures? The yellow label is what suggested Chinese to me in the first place, but seeing the tube clinched it.

Check the GT site for pictures of each tube. In the picture of the -C, you can see the triple mica spacers, even though the extra metal piece isn't visible, it's there.
http://www.groovetubes.com/iframeGT12AX7C.html

While the -R, -R2, and -R3 have only two mica spacers (although the picture for the -R is actually a picture of the -C). The -R2 is distinguishable by its longer Plates.
http://www.groovetubes.com/iframeGT12AX7R2.html

Forgot to add:
I believe that the -R is the Sovtek WC, the -R2 is the Sovtek long Plate, and the -R3 is the Electro Harmonix (EH).

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Post subject: Re: Current Production equivalent for older Groove Tube 12AX
Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 8:28 pm
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After comparing a pic of a "C" to an "R" to this old tube, it does look like a "C" as shimmilou says.

Funny thing to note: the groove tubes website has a picture of a "C" tube listed in the description of an "R" tube - FAIL! haha - the label on the tube in the pic clearly states "C". here it is:

Image



I went through the effort of finding a correct pic of an "R" elsewhere on the web - here it is:

Image


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Post subject: Re: Current Production equivalent for older Groove Tube 12AX
Posted: Wed May 23, 2012 9:00 pm
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Good eye. :wink:

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Post subject: Re: Current Production equivalent for older Groove Tube 12AX
Posted: Thu May 24, 2012 4:31 am
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fender deffinately puts different tubes in their amps from time to time. my bdri came with russian tubes with yellow g.t. label. the tubes that were in mine don't have the extra spacer. they could have been e.h. tubes because they don't sound as clear or as punchy and they're a bit sterile. e.h. tubes are good though. the original tubes don't sound like wa,c or wc. i have a set of all 3. right now i'm running 2 wc and a 12at7 p.i. this is a bit cleaner and you have to crank it to get breakup.fender does the bright punch sound real well. i use a booster i built to push the frontend. think rory gallagher "photo finish". i wish my bdri would've came with c's. they do sound good.


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Post subject: Re: Current Production equivalent for older Groove Tube 12AX
Posted: Thu May 24, 2012 7:30 am
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:lol:

Yes, sometimes it can be difficult to figure out which tubes that you have. Maybe the rep was thinking about your tubes. :lol: I like the WC in my BJr, all three positions, seems perfect for that amp. I used the WA for years in my HRDlx for great cleans, then found that the Chinese tubes in all three positions was great for the drive channel, very smooth, and still great cleans. But, now I'm using an Ei 12AX7 in V1, a GT 12AX7-C in V2, and a Sovtek 5751 in V3 (PI), for a little different sound, still great. For a friends BDlx, a Sovtek 5751 in V1, EH 12AX7 in V2, and a GT 12AT7 in V3 (PI), makes for some sweet, harmonically rich cleans, and very touch sensitive, great sound for that amp. Experimenting is really the only way to know which tubes sound best, and having some spares is a good idea. I enjoy swapping and comparing tubes from time to time if the mood strikes me.....and it does strike at times. I am surprised that I haven't worn out the sockets in my HRDlx, as I have swapped the tubes dozens of times. Sometimes the swaps are necessary (noise, microphonic), sometimes for fun, and sometimes use the amp to test various tubes. :)

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Post subject: Re: Current Production equivalent for older Groove Tube 12AX
Posted: Thu May 24, 2012 10:56 am
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+1 on the mood to swap tubes.


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Post subject: Re: Current Production equivalent for older Groove Tube 12AX
Posted: Thu May 24, 2012 5:28 pm
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One little ditty about Russian made tubes, is they tend to have "dimpled-pie plate ring" getters. Whether in gain stage or output tubes.

Ring at top of 12AX7. And on bottom part of 6N6C (6V6GT).

Image

Image


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