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Post subject: Re: My Weber 5F6A Bassman Build-Up Thread
Posted: Fri Jan 27, 2012 11:11 pm
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Location: Natural Bridge, Virginia
Yes. It works. And it sounds great. Whew.

I took the suspect cap off of the old, small cap board and stuck an ohm meter probe on the negative end of the cap case and the other end in the hole. Sure enough. There was a short to the case. In the trash that cap went. :lol:

So I built up the new larger board and put electrical tape over the wire ends. I wasn't taking any chances. I also marked the wire so I knew where to connect them on the circuit board.

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I drilled the dog house and installed a plastic grommet.

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I used Super-Lock fastening tape to hold the insulating board to the top of the chassis and the cap board to the insulating board.

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I also used the same tape to hold the dog house to the chassis.

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Before I wired anything up, I test fit the chassis in the cabinet to make sure the dog house cleared the top speaker. It did ....barely. :lol:

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Then I went in and connected the cap ground and wired the cap wires to the right places on the circuit board. This is so much cleaner than using the small cap board and was actually easier to work with. I wish I had done it this way to begin with.

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I then l pugged in the solid state rectifier, clicked on the power switch followed shortly afterward by the standby switch. I checked the open circuit heater and plate voltages. Everything looked good, so I powered the amp down, unplugged it, and installed the old tubes from my BDRI. They were Groove Tube 12AX7s and 6L6Rs (really Sovtek 5881WXTs).

I turned both volume knobs all the way down and turned the power switch on. No sparks or smoke. So I held my breath and hit the standby switch. The amp didn't explode. I turned the normal volume up and heard a slight hiss. YES! I turned the normal volume down and the bright volume up and was greeted by a ........ high pitched whistle. Crap. I turned the bright volume knob down and thought for a minute. So I pulled V1 and slowly turned the bright volume up. Dead quiet. Ah ha. Not much in front of V1 to go bad, so I swapped another tube into the V1 socket. I turned the bright volume back up and heard ...... HISS! All right. I had a bad tube! I then plugged in my AVRI 52 Tele, turned the volume up a little and hit the strings. Guitar sounds! No hum. No hiss. Nice and quiet.

Feeling bold now, I unplugged everything, turned the amp off and unplugged it. I pulled all the Grove Tubes and the solid state rectifier. I then installed the new JJ GZ34 rectifier tube, 6L6GCs, balanced 12AX7 (phase inverter, V3), 12AX7 (cathode follower, V2), and NOS JAN GE 12AY7 (V1). Plugged my guitar in and turned the amp on. Oh. Music. Sweet music. Well, what passes for music when I am playing. :lol:

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I set the output tube bias to 38 mA cathode current (about 36 mA plate current) at 432 VDC plate voltage using my bias probe and DVM. The speakers are quite stiff, so I didn't play very loud ....yet. I checked all inputs, volume controls, tone controls and presence control. Everything worked as it should, so I screwed the back panels on the amp.

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I'm gonna clean everything up now and play the amp for a little bit before I go to bed (its 1:00 am Saturday morning). I'll be back later this weekend for a final wrap up and some lessons learned. I'll be sleeping soundly tonight. :D

Oh, I have a TASCAM portable digital recorder on it's way from Musician's Friend. It should be here next week. You'll be sorry that you asked to hear me play the new amp. :lol:

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Last edited by bluesky636 on Sat Nov 03, 2012 11:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: My Weber 5F6A Bassman Build-Up Thread
Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 1:56 pm
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I won't be sorry! I want to hear that bad boy!

Great build! :D


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Post subject: Re: My Weber 5F6A Bassman Build-Up Thread
Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 2:06 pm
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Awesome Bill,

The whole amp looks great, bet it sounds great as well. 8)

Not sure if you do but, if you wanted to get a nice cover made for it, check out Studio Slips, Susan there made me two custom padded covers for my 5e3's and they are fantastic quality and fit like a glove.

http://www.studioslips.com/

Here's one of my amps with the cover fitted.
Image

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Snowy


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Post subject: Re: My Weber 5F6A Bassman Build-Up Thread
Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 2:43 pm
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Location: Natural Bridge, Virginia
Butterscotch wrote:
I won't be sorry! I want to hear that bad boy!

Great build! :D


Don't say I didn't warn you. :lol:

Thanks. :D

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Post subject: Re: My Weber 5F6A Bassman Build-Up Thread
Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 2:44 pm
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Location: Natural Bridge, Virginia
No457 Snowy wrote:
Awesome Bill,

The whole amp looks great, bet it sounds great as well. 8)

Not sure if you do but, if you wanted to get a nice cover made for it, check out Studio Slips, Susan there made me two custom padded covers for my 5e3's and they are fantastic quality and fit like a glove.

http://www.studioslips.com/

Snowy


Thanks. :D

I am looking for a cover. I will definitely check them out. Thanks.

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Post subject: Re: My Weber 5F6A Bassman Build-Up Thread
Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 10:41 pm
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Bill...WOW, sure does look good assembled. Glad you got it all reworked...I wonder how many times you get a bad cap in a kit like that? Didn't see this one earlier today, was working my own amp project, I did finish the Bantam...sounds wonderful, but I suspect yours might sound a skosh better! Can't wait to hear the tone of that beauty!

T2

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Post subject: Re: My Weber 5F6A Bassman Build-Up Thread
Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 11:21 pm
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Location: Natural Bridge, Virginia
T2Stratman wrote:
Bill...WOW, sure does look good assembled. Glad you got it all reworked...I wonder how many times you get a bad cap in a kit like that? Didn't see this one earlier today, was working my own amp project, I did finish the Bantam...sounds wonderful, but I suspect yours might sound a skosh better! Can't wait to hear the tone of that beauty!

T2


Thanks.

I don't think the cap was bad to begin with. Because of the difference in size between the 450 VDC caps that were supplied previously and the 500 VDC caps supplied in the current kit, the front and rear edges of the new caps sit right at the edge of the metal eyelet, actually touching the eyelet. After pulling the bad cap off the small cap board and examining it closely, I have two theories as to what caused the failure:

1. When soldering the cap to the board, I touched the outside of the cap can just above the eyelet, melting a hole in the blue can coating. When I applied power, the high voltage arc'ed from the eyelet to the hole, shorting the cap, or ....

2. When soldering the cap to the board, a small blob of solder stuck to the plastic can coating. When I applied power, the high voltage arc'ed to the solder blob, melting a hole in the covering and shorting the cap.

Using the larger cap board completely eliminated that problem.

The amp sounds as good as it looks. :D

Please post some photos and words about your amp build. 8)

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Post subject: Re: My Weber 5F6A Bassman Build-Up Thread
Posted: Sat Jan 28, 2012 11:56 pm
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Well, I have just finished spending the last several hours playing each of my guitars through the 5F6A - Strat, Tele, Esquire, humbuckers, single coils, stacked humbuckers.

I can now answer the question that I think is on everyone's mind, not the least mine: Does the Weber 5F6A sound like a 1959 Fender Bassman?

I can say absolutely and unequivically ...... I dont have a clue! :lol: I have never heard a real 59 Bassman except via You Tube over crappy computer speakers. I can, however, say the following things about the amp's sound:

1. This puppy is LOUD! I don't think I will ever be able to crank this thing up to the point were I get power tube overdrive and stay in the same room with it. Plugging into Normal input #1 with Normal input #2 jumpered over to Bright input #1 and setting both volume controls to "6" with the guitar volume on "10", the amp is just on the threshold of breakup. It is really cranking at that point. I have my eye on a pair of NOS JAN Philips 5881s (25 watt tubes) at KCA NOS tubes that I might ask for as a birthday present. They should help achieve that classic Bassman tone. I do have to say that the 5F6A sounds better with my Fulltone Full Drive 2 MOSFET driving it than the BDRI does. It sounds very natural.

2. The amp sounds similar to, but still different from my BDRI. The 5F6A is a much brighter and more resonant amp than the BDRI. But the brightness is not harsh. It has a very smooth, extended top end with very tight lows and solid mids. I have the treble and bass set on "6" and the mid set on "5". Presence is set on"6". The bridge pickup of my AVRI 52 Tele sounds very punchy and smooth. No harshness at all. It will be interesting to hear if there is any diference once the speakers are broken in. The BDRI is rather dark by comparison, even with the Presence set on "10".

3. Listening to the amp, the hum levels are noticably lower than the BDRI. Hiss is slighty greater than the BDRI and is affected strongly by the setting of the Presence control. Doing a little research into the subject this evening indicates that the hiss is a known problem with the 50's implementation of the Presence control. The new Reissues have a slightly different configured setup for Presence which is supposed to reduce the hiss level. I may look into modding my amp to the Reissue Presence configuration.

4. Having two cranked 40 watt tube amps in a 20'LX18'WX24'H room means never having to worry about getting cold while playing. I think the 5F6A and BDRI together could heat an entire house. :lol:

5. After the speakers break in for a few more hours, I'll check the amp bias and see where things are. I have it currently set to 38 mA Cathode current (about 36 mA plate current) and 432 VDC plate voltage. Just slightly over 50% max plate dissipation. I'll try cranking it up a bit in a few weeks.

Thats it for now. Its 2:00 am and time for bed. I'll do some lessons learned on Sunday and then record some demo samples when my digital recorder arrives next week. I can't wait. I'll have a few more photos tomorrow too.

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Post subject: Re: My Weber 5F6A Bassman Build-Up Thread
Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 7:09 am
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Some sweet day I'll build my dream amp, I so want a low powered twin chassis in a 4X10 Bassman Cab.
Nice Pine etc..... cab with a set of alnico tens in it, AHHHHHH !!!!!

But I'm clutzy at best with a soldering iron, I would want it done in a day and it would most likely take me months so......

But Nice Job !!!! Enjoy!

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Post subject: Re: My Weber 5F6A Bassman Build-Up Thread
Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 7:39 am
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blues bondsman wrote:
Some sweet day I'll build my dream amp, I so want a low powered twin chassis in a 4X10 Bassman Cab.
Nice Pine etc..... cab with a set of alnico tens in it, AHHHHHH !!!!!

But I'm clutzy at best with a soldering iron, I would want it done in a day and it would most likely take me months so......

But Nice Job !!!! Enjoy!


Thanks. You definitely need patience to build one of these, but it is worth it. :D

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Post subject: Re: My Weber 5F6A Bassman Build-Up Thread
Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 9:20 am
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I reckon that if you crank that amp, you'll blow out a wall! :lol:


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Post subject: Re: My Weber 5F6A Bassman Build-Up Thread
Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 9:36 am
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Butterscotch wrote:
I reckon that if you crank that amp, you'll blow out a wall! :lol:


WHAT???? I CAN'T HEAR YOU!!!!!

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Post subject: Re: My Weber 5F6A Bassman Build-Up Thread
Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 2:20 pm
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Here's a few photos of the 5F6A in its new home.

The 5F6A:

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The 5F6A with its BDRI younger brother:

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The 5F6A and BDRI with my 5F1 configured Champion 600 and Frontman 25R:

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My entire "Fender" family. In front, my ARVI 52 Telecaster, my heavily modded 2009 MIM Standard Strat, and my Squier Esquire:

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Last edited by bluesky636 on Sat Nov 03, 2012 11:21 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: My Weber 5F6A Bassman Build-Up Thread
Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 5:15 pm
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Well, I've been playing the new amp with all of my guitars and I have to say it sounds great with each of them. It is a very easy amp to dial in. Very crisp and percussive. I still haven't had the nerve to crank it all the way up and strike a single power chord, but I will soon. I'll let you all know if I survive. :lol: :lol: :lol:

Anyway, as promised, here are a few lessons learned that anyone considering building an amp (especially if it is the first time you have done something like this) may want to consider. So here we go.

1. Do a lot of research. If you are not familiar with tube amp design and construction or your only experience has been changing tubes, borrow or buy a couple of books on the subject. I received my BSEE in 1976. Tubes were still taught then but were on their way out. I wanted to refresh my memory on them so I bought the following books:

http://www.amazon.com/How-Hot-Rod-Your- ... pd_sim_b_8

http://www.amazon.com/Guitar-Amplifier- ... d_sim_b_22

http://www.amazon.com/Guitar-Amplifier- ... pd_sim_b_3

http://www.amazon.com/Circuit-Analysis- ... pd_sim_b_6

I have also have this book on order:

http://www.amazon.com/Radio-Designers-H ... d_sim_b_25

And of course, I have this book because of the great photos:

http://www.amazon.com/Soul-Tone-Celebra ... 375&sr=1-2

2. Research the companies that offer tube guitar kits. A few of the more popular ones are:

Weber - https://taweber.powweb.com/store/kits.htm

MOJO Tone - http://www.mojotone.com/amp-kits

Marsh - http://store.marshamps.com/index.php?cPath=21

Ceriatone - http://www.ceriatone.com/

Allen Amplification - http://www.allenamps.com/

and many more. Prices cover a wide range. Some kits may have better quality parts and the price reflects that. Many kits offer optional upgrades. I found it cheaper to buy my kit without tubes and to buy better tubes on-lne from a tube specialty company (Eurotubes primarily). The only parts I found to be cheaply made in my Weber kit were the speaker connectors which I promptly replaced. Also, keep in mind that some sellers offer full instructions for their kits, others just a schematic and wiring diagram.

3. Once you have picked a dealer, choose your amp (2 and 3 are kind of interchangeable as far as order goes). If you have never worked on an amp or built anything before, you might want to choose something simple like a Champ or maybe a Deluxe type kit. Leave that Blackface Twin Reverb for a later time when you have more experience. Or, if you are like me and want to make use of that degree you got years ago and think you know it all, dive right in. There is usually someone around to help bail you out. :lol:

4. Ok. You've picked your dealer and amp kit. Do you have tools? If you have been working on guitars or pedals for a while, you probably have the basics: soldering iron, wire cutters/strippers, needle nose plyers, tweezers, various screw drivers, socket and adjustable wrenches, etc. For the most part, that is all you need. You'll also need a good DVM and depending on the amp type, maybe a bias probe to safely set the amp bias. Weber has a nice selection of specialty tools to consider:

https://amptechtools.powweb.com/index.html

5. Once the kit arrives, do a complete parts inventory. If things just come in a big bag, separate all the components into individual, labled bags. Instead of trying to read the resistor color code, just measure the resistor value with your new DVM.

6. Did you pick an amp kit with full instructions? Good. Follow them to the letter. If like mine and the kit came only with a schematic and wiring diagram, prepare to make mistakes and do things over. Study every bit of documentation that comes with the kit. You may find that the proper order to do things is elusive and you may have to remove something that you just installed to install something else. Find photos of your amp being assembled by others. Many sites have a help page that you can go to. Weber has an amp building forum and also has photos posted of kits assembled by others. There are a lot of DIY amp forums on the Internet.

7. Take your time. I can't stress this enough. It took me a month of weekends, working until 2:00 or 3:00 am sometimes, to complete my kit. Make sure all your solder joints are clean and shiny. Proper wire dress is critical to avoid hum or possible shorts. Check everything over twice. Then check it again. If you think you made a mistake, you probably did so check it a fourth time.

8. When you are ready to turn the amp on for the first time, make sure another adult is at home, a fire extinguisher is handy, and 911 is on speed dial. Just kidding, but the first time can be nerve wracking. Don't install the tubes yet. Just make sure that the rectifier is installed (tube or solid state). Turn the main power switch on and watch for arcing or smoke. If all is well, throw the standby switch if the amp has one. Measure all the open circuit power supply voltages and tube voltages and check them against the schematic. They will be a bit high, but you will know if there is a missing power connection. Shut everything down and unplug the amp. If you have some old but working tubes, install those so you don't risk damage to your expensive NOS tubes. Turn the volume control all the way down. Turn the amp on and again watch for sparks or smoke. If all is good, measure the DC voltages again. Slowly turn the volume up and listen for a slight hiss. Hiss is good. Loud hum or squeals is bad. If you get hiss, check and adjust the power tube bias (if necessary), turn the amp off, plug in your guitar, turn the amp on and make music. If a problem ocurred, you will need to trouble shoot. Books and forums are a big help here.

9. When all is working properly, pat yourself on the back. Congratulations. You have just built the best guitar amp in the world. Why is it the best? Because it was the product of your two hands. Now, go make some joyful noise. :D :D :D

I already have a few mods for my 5F6A in mind:

1. Investigate and possibly install the presence circuit used on the current Bassman Reissues.

2. Replace the tone caps with Orange Drops.

I'm sure there are others.

I'll try and post some sound clips as soon as my recorder arrives.

I'd like to thank everyone that listened to me rattle on about building this amp. Your comments and suggestions were helpful and greatly appreciated. Building this amp was a big challenge and an awful lot of fun. I had a few problems but with your help, I was able to overcome them.

Now if I could just play the damn guitar better ....... :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Post subject: Re: My Weber 5F6A Bassman Build-Up Thread
Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 9:06 am
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Congrats Bill! Great job. Can't wait to hear the clips.

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