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Post subject: Re: Fender Supersonic 22 noise
Posted: Thu Mar 17, 2011 10:40 pm
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Retroverbial wrote:
I'd sure prefer a great amp over a great warranty.

My last new Fender was a '78 Twin Reverb, with a one-year term. In 2001 it finally required some servicing (tubes, biasing, caps).

:lol:

Arjay



I agree, a great amp would be better. However, buying new with today's amps it's always good to have a 5 yr warranty, just a little insurance.


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Post subject: Re: Fender Supersonic 22 noise
Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 10:21 am
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I took my Supersonic to a repair guy and he fixed the reverb which helped remove some of the noise. He also said the remaining white noise is the result of how the amp was built. He couldn't work on it any further because of the limited space on the circuit board.

Are there any known mods out there that address this?


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Post subject: Re: Fender Supersonic 22 noise
Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 1:25 pm
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bump


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Post subject: Re: Fender Supersonic 22 noise
Posted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 6:44 pm
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Retroverbial wrote:
I'd sure prefer a great amp over a great warranty.

My last new Fender was a '78 Twin Reverb, with a one-year term. In 2001 it finally required some servicing (tubes, biasing, caps).

:lol:

Arjay


+1 My 76 Twin did the same duty. A one year warranty was the norm on most amps way back when they used great components and way better workmanship. Even with lousy lead dress my Twin went over 30 years of hard gigging with never a hiccup. As
an Egnater fan, I chose the Rebel 20 over the 30. I just like the tone a bit better. I never tried a SS 22 that didn't hiss like a box of Cobras. Never liked the gain channels either. Fender was never know for making good sounding distortion channels in their amps. If you want better distortion, I'd go Marshall, Mesa or the higher end Egnater amps.

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Post subject: Re: Fender Supersonic 22 noise
Posted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 2:07 am
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63supro wrote:
Fender was never know for making good sounding distortion channels in their amps. If you want better distortion, I'd go Marshall, Mesa or the higher end Egnater amps.


I think one of the best saturated-gain amps that FMIC offered was the old Zinky-designed Prosonic. The selectable rectifier offered some useful tonal variations and the S/N ratio was acceptable for general stage use. The only "monkey in the wrench" was, it didn't do blackface cleans as well as its cosmetics would suggest. Hence, it lost potential market share to players who insisted on the traditional "Fender" sound. But in half-stack configuration, the amp had few equals in the milieu of heavy, modern OD rock.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: Fender Supersonic 22 noise
Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2011 10:07 am
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I just picked up my amp from the service center and there is a considerable drop in the noise. The repair guy just applied the new Fender tech note & fix regarding the reverb and decrease the bias level. He said the amp was running too hot and noticed the noise dropping as he was adjusting the bias level. There is still a little noise but not as much as before.


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Post subject: Re: Fender Supersonic 22 noise
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 7:22 pm
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The reverb recovery tube is always in circuit - yes the fets kill the input but - the output is always there, the signal goes through resistors a noise source, the tl072's are commercial junk- look at the tle2072 devices to drop in or opa jfet types (TI), National has good chips too (TI now as is Burr-Brown devices) you will NEVER EVERY have a QUIET guitar amp with tubes...EVER unless it has a gate on it....now Audiophile stuff - different- but a simple check of the schematics will show what i mean....

http://www.ti.com/product/opa1642 jfet more high end

this one WILL DROP IN (get the DIP through hole device not the SMD device)
http://www.ti.com/product/tle2072a

i did it for my supersonic 22 + my rodie's (i bought him a CS tele and a supersonic his is black mine cream.....all biased correctly and dimed and on clean mode - HEAVEN

BTW I "ain't" no stinking hobbyist either.......at least some of you don't think so.....



every tube amp i have had since 1963 has puked noise...TURN UP THE AMP and get the signal out of the noise floor..etc etc etc.... heck even single tube non complex minimal component stuff in the signal path produce noise...

Hum with the cab out of the chassis, the inside of the supersonic has foil that foil is grounded when you screw in the chassis...now this is anal but i have found using deoxit-d+gold per their site's instructions for use- lower my foil to ground resistances from 22 ohms to about 3 ohms typically (a difference in potentials due to resistance generates noise - think not (i did the grounds for the patriot missile system for Raytheon way way back when).......most amps will grab noise from the either if the chassis is open to 60Hz, 120Hz (a by-product of the rectification process (Google the stuff) and associated harmonics that ate generated ...the transformers can make mechanical vibration- as well as emi and other types of magnetically induced noise...

take a series of electronics classes on line and you will learn all about that crap.

Now when i worked in Hollywierd 78-83 at a studio- we found the power grounds sucked different resitances and when the hollywierd power grid took it's daily poop once everyone in LA turned on their A/C and stuff..SO...we dug a big a$$ed hole and drove a 2" copper rod...that was about 4' into the earth and we added rock salt to the hole...then we drilled and tapped then attached ALL GROUNDS to that point including incoming power..line earth...nice nice drop in 60 hz garbage- i do this for every house i buy - or at least i split off the grounds a for the studios and keep them separate from the power grounds- that produces good results....and believe you me ground is a NEBULOUS subject as ground isn't...cuz it is supposed to "return" to the power generation point - for me Bonneville at the dam..yeah right let's see the "ground" has to "return" to Bonneville via, sand, gravel, rocks, dirt, salt water, fresh water, ...past 1000's of noise sources...etc etc etc see the scope of the problem...

buy some deoxit d and gold...follow the directions to a tee...clean very darn thing you have that touches your sound...all power in the wall socket (turn off the circuit breaker in the house first for those outlets, clean you POWER cords, go inside..clean and coat the connectors that connect ground to the foil shields, and to the chassis - if possible - do your input jacks, your instrument jacks...BLAH BLAH and all cords...trust me goblins are killed that way unless ya got yourself a mess- then bring in a pro-Rollo out

AND TV's and your computer doesn't matter what type - generate noise back into the power system- the college i taught at for 6 years...we had to do a ton of crap - IAW with the power company's PERSISTENCE to clean that crap up-

the government or whomever can look in at your computer simply by sniffing power lines..and another little tid bit- they can track up to 10 heartbeats through concrete 4' thick (i get great mags about sensor apps etc since if i need some extra dough i design snarky crap with sensors).....sleep tight - i don't thus ya know why I play the blues now-and some honky tonk an Merle +Chet too.

FYI
http://www.caig.com/

http://www.gcaudio.com/resources/howtos ... noise.html

http://www.google.com/search?sugexp=chr ... amplifiers

GOOD FREAKING LUCK :mrgreen:

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Last edited by rollo on Wed May 30, 2012 8:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: Fender Supersonic 22 noise
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 7:37 pm
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Rollo, very interesting. Are your copper ground rods ok, per city ordinance? SCE is kinda touchy about messing with that sort of stuff.

Thanks!


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Post subject: Re: Fender Supersonic 22 noise
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 8:14 pm
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Separate grounds, not a good idea. Not only unsafe, but ground loops can also introduce noise. Isolated neutral OK, but separate ground is a no-no. The ground is all about safety and should be done properly as BMW2002Ti mentioned. And depending on your location, messing with the electrical system in your house without a license can affect your insurance should something bad happen. :idea:

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Post subject: Re: Fender Supersonic 22 noise
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 8:17 pm
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BMW2002Ti wrote:
Rollo, very interesting. Are your copper ground rods ok, per city ordinance? SCE is kinda touchy about messing with that sort of stuff.

Thanks!


never bothered checking and have done it at each house i elect to put in a studio or backline jam space- but GOOD POINT and you should have an electrician help ya out- cuz i do not wanna hear about one of you SMOKING..... "me needs your dough"

Hell i am an EE and i wired one of my Server(s) redundant supply outlets wrong by attaching the ground wire to NEUTRAL - a no no.... EVEN THOUGH in SOME installations white and copper are tied together at the J-box...but check with an electrician-

I douche EVERYTHING with deoixt-D....NOT WD-40 - made with wierd crap dudes...no oils in your electronics (people do it)

http://www.wd40.com/about-us/myths-legends-fun-facts/

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Post subject: Re: Fender Supersonic 22 noise
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 8:30 pm
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shimmilou wrote:
Separate grounds, not a good idea. Not only unsafe, but ground loops can also introduce noise. Isolated neutral OK, but separate ground is a no-no. The ground is all about safety and should be done properly as BMW2002Ti mentioned. And depending on your location, messing with the electrical system in your house without a license can affect your insurance should something bad happen. :idea:


I star ground EVERYTHING to the power ground but instead of the -rebar or galvanized (resistance) rods power companies use- Lowe's i know for sure (just did one in my office shed) has 1" copper rod just for this use...went and bought one for 30 bucks or so.i have seen some SILLY stuff people do (like a well known well known pro in Santa Monica did)...my Gawd..but it is QUIET.....

the foil to ground connection inside the supersonic 22- and the standalone reverb and i believe my VK's can't remember... but i take the chassis (please protect the electronics and make sure you vacuum THOROUGHLY the chassis guts...but i take steel wool, clean the chassis where it will connect to the foil and i then clean with deoixit D...and coat with deoxit Gold and i use a rag and clean the foil where the connection is made with the same procedure (no steel wool...for obvious reasons) - old old fart out

BTW i sometimes bond the powercompany's rod to my rod (no comments about MY rod-OK....) :oops: :mrgreen:

Mariners are ROUTING Texas..21-8 whoopee-just won - yeah

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Last edited by rollo on Wed May 30, 2012 8:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: Fender Supersonic 22 noise
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 8:30 pm
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Rollo, Thanks for your reply! I've had to redo I don't know HOW many sockets that were WD-40'ed or doused with old Cramolin. I a firm believer in D-5. And now GN-5.


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Post subject: Re: Fender Supersonic 22 noise
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 8:40 pm
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BMW2002Ti wrote:
Rollo, Thanks for your reply! I've had to redo I don't know HOW many sockets that were WD-40'ed or doused with old Cramolin. I a firm believer in D-5. And now GN-5.



i had a ripp'n 2002 with Webers in Denver- then moved to a 3.0 CSI (wish i had it now)

but my SAAB 99 EMS - beat them all......of course it has Jack Lawrence Headers, exhaust an aped FI system, dropped and properly set up and such + MSD 6A.... Born in LA - hot rodder forever.....

well, Porsche guy forever.....

but when i turned on all the illegal lights on the SAAB on i could run between El Paso and white sands at night - ripping and they could see me from the night slopes in Ruidoso New Mexico. Once was pulled over by a Texas trooper on that run (worked for Raytheon then - to eat) and when he came up the pot smoke was billowing out the sunroof, the Allman bro's Fillmore east roaring in the car and a high as heck Schnauzer in the seat next to me rocking out- he let me go...and said a bunch of funny s^&t- before he split he was a youngster too. - he dug the car - and the weed :roll:

gotta go to the studio now for a bit cuz i am organizing my stuff- week 4 now..... :shock:

now that high crap wasn't as bad as the day and night my wife and i moved her up to Yarrow bay- in her 74 merc 280c - black- aped carb, MSD 6AL, a parrot, two Schnauzers, all my best jazz axes in the trunk and one suitcase (most of the crap was moved pro)..and we had been tooting weed for 12+ hours just baking I5 due north- the second i got into WA state- it was about 3:30a + she was sleeping, the parrot was toast and just singing away one dog ..dead to the world (and the same dog from Texas i had...was high as hell with me and wide awake (i'm like Dr. johnny fever - medical now.... i am old))..and beat to heck....the cop wrote me but only for speeding...just outside of Centralia or Vancouver can't remember - 1985 Aug....i was pissed when she sold that car - it had POTENTIAL indeed. :mrgreen:

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Post subject: Re: Fender Supersonic 22 noise
Posted: Wed May 30, 2012 8:54 pm
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BMW2002Ti wrote:
Rollo, Thanks for your reply! I've had to redo I don't know HOW many sockets that were WD-40'ed or doused with old Cramolin. I a firm believer in D-5. And now GN-5.


People do stuoooooooooopid s^&T with that stuff.... :shock:

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Post subject: Re: Fender Supersonic 22 noise
Posted: Thu May 31, 2012 2:56 am
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Rollo, I had a 1972 Alpina 2002Ti. Basically stock, except dual Weber side drafts and Tii boxed suspension parts. Put in a 4:11 1600Ti rear end, so not so good top end. But, the midrange was hard to beat. Which is best for slaloms, IMHO. Alpina struts and bars sure made that car understeer. Sure was nice to scoot around the freeways.

The only Porsche I "owned" was putting a 2.2 E engine into a VW bus. Was kinda funny watching ppl in Mercedes expressions, as I passed them going up Sherwin Grade, on the way to Mammoth. Kinda a joke now, as I think the motor only had 160HP at the rear wheel. But, boy could those small Porsche engines rev. Red line was a starting point. I'd shift the darn thing a good 1K R's above the line. I loved rebuilding those engines, as they are like Swiss watches. With cranks bigger than most V-8's. I've never seen a Porsche with a fried or spunned bottom end.

Fastest car I've experienced is a friend's 997 Turbo. Darn thing is scary fast, as you have no idea how fast you are going until you look at the dash or the lines in the road flasing past you.

Ah... memories.


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