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Post subject: Re: Really Promising New Amps from Fender
Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2011 3:13 pm
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Aspiring Musician
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well i'm glad we kids are getting acquainted. gotta admit i'm have a bit fun with you guys, & you've been good sports about it too.

now to address:
"I never said I was unhappy with the Mustang. I said it's not the end-all, be-all, holy grail of amps you make modeling amps out to be.
You love claiming tube amps are obsolete and plagued with problems while ignoring the fact that software based modeling amps have their own unique flaws as well. And while we're at it, let's talk about obsolescence. Moore's Law comes to mind. The software and hardware people purchase are practically obsolete before they even hit store shelves with the pace of development in the industry. Seems to me tube amps lasted quite a bit longer than any processor or software out there.
You should hang out on your own cyber commander forum if you want legions of fans at your feet Johnny, because it's just not happening here. Oh, wait. What? Your forums still are not working? Been under construction for a long time, haven't they? Maybe you should get that up and running and sell your junk over there, not here."

you sounded ummm, like a man with Mustang issues. never said it's the end-all-be-all. many thanks for the really informed Mustang review...
tube amps have issues. software has issues. software improvemets are downloadable, design can be quite flexible. tubes you gotta buy, but the design is "fixed". tube amp quality: totally based on components & the design itself, software quality: totally based on the design team and their sw dev process.
discussing moore's law makes sense only when you talk about cpu evolution - ps silicone is at about its design limits, hence multi-core designs. if everyone thought like you, everyone would simply wait, wait, and wait. it's always gonna be better next year. like the am deluxes. everything gets better, take a good look around. still watching a toob tv? or have you moved on to a flat screen? still look at vhs or blu ray? still drive a polluter or something a bit more eco friendly and reliable? blah-blah-blah.
legions of fans like you? no one's forcing anyone, especially you, to buy anything, it seems you've already bought a mustang and must be a very proud owner, toobs or not.
my website forum, when i feel like it, but for now, i like coming here for the entertainment, you're a real funny guy. as for junk, many thanks for another in-depth and really intelligent review. a really funny guy.

on another topic: computers. indeed computers can do the preamp thing & shape the sound, tracks can be digitally recorded & mastered pretty easily, can be emailed across the world, etc... i do expect this to be trend as the younger generation get into this business. for live sound, as you suggest, a pa system. the great thing about pa's is that they are already equalized & setup for the venue and you don't have to drag around really expensive/unique gear around. in a pinch, any computer will do, just load the software and away you go, no stopping a show because of equipment failure. for your kids home recording studio, this is a good and inexpense (nevertheless, you will get great results) way to go, its a great way to get a garage band recorded, moms & dads take note. this might be the "modern guitar amplifier (since 2010)".

ciao,
johnny.


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Post subject: Re: Really Promising New Amps from Fender
Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2011 3:40 pm
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johnny,
For someone who is always bashing tubes you seem to forget that your beloved Cyber Twin has 2 12AX7WA tubes in the preamp section...does that not give your Cyber Twin a nice "tube" sound??
ABS :D


Last edited by airbornestrat on Sun Jan 16, 2011 6:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post subject: Re: Really Promising New Amps from Fender
Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2011 4:30 pm
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Retroverbial wrote:
cedarblues wrote:
This tough guy is getting bored...... who wants to hold my hand?


Stop rattling his cage!

:lol:

Arjay


"Please do not annoy, torment, pester, plague, molest, worry, badger, harry, harass, heckle, persecute, irk, bully rag, vex, disquiet, grate, beset, bother, tease, nettle, tantalize, or ruffle the animals."

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Post subject: Re: Really Promising New Amps from Fender
Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2011 5:45 pm
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I have owned my hot rod deluxe tweed for 2 years and never touched it, other than to hook up a hotplate. So it is proof that Tubes have less problems. Software updates in the first weeks....Fark that.... And how can anyone compare pure audio gold tube sound to digital tone..... It's just not possible for any clean tone and we all know that.....Admitadly i will buy one of these things and like my line 6 when it was the new toy....i will play with it for a few weeks, it will get put away and gather dust. This software will do exactly to guitars what happened to cameras....50% of peoples time will be editing instead of playing, Like itunes it shits me. Buy a record and listen, Take a photo and enjoy it. (buy the new poloroid you will have more fun with photography than you've had in years, or ever if your gen why. And plug in a gold tube amp and turn it up till it breaks up and ROK the fuc out!!!........or Sit on here and edit Fuse and in between editing fuse, the weekends photo's downloading, music for itunes then get on this forum and have a bitter cyber female relationship with Johnny the over complicated frustrated downloader about the virtues of ss digital amplifiers!!!!....

.lol......I have to sit on them to make money.....but spare time on this idiot box....ur kiddin!!!!

Peace,Waves, Motorcycles Acoustic guitars and tube amps to you all!!!!

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Post subject: Re: Really Promising New Amps from Fender
Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2011 8:36 pm
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Johnny, I'm a fan of technology, I appreciate many things about it, I buy the latest phones, I know a thing or two about computers, I prefer to watch blu-ray... you get the idea.

Being in the IT industry, I can tell you there's no guarantee that software or hardware will never fail, it will happen eventually... I don't have any experience with these new amps but I can tell you that my tube amps have been a lot more reliable than any of the newer technologies I own or use on a daily basis. Turn the amp on, plug in, play my music, turn off. Repeat. Sure some of us like to mess with tubes til we find the tone we like, it doesn't mean anything is wrong with the amp... some people do it with pedalboard full of pedals, I prefer to try different tubes.

Here's the way I see it, yes technology is great, yes it has changed many things in our lives, but so far it hasn't been able to duplicate or improve the tone I hear in a good tube amp. All this digital stuff is wonderful but there are certain things that cannot be duplicated. It's like telling me that some car racing simulation game is better than a lap around Sebring in a real car! I've done both, the real thing is still my choice. Am I happy to be watching HD on my Plasma TV? Hell yeah! So, just cause technology works in some area it doesn't apply to everything, not yet at least.

Maybe, whoever invented this whole tube amp thing, and whoever decided to make it into a guitar amp, got very lucky with this wonderful formula that works for most of us. It has nothing to do with technology or glory days or whatever... maybe one of these days some new technology will come along to replace tubes and the world will be a happy place again :) until then I'm very happy with my sweet sounding and reliable Fender tube amps.


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Post subject: Re: Really Promising New Amps from Fender
Posted: Sun Jan 16, 2011 8:54 pm
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Another way to look at it: Guitarists have been using tube amps for over 50 years with great success. You can still buy an honest-to-goodness 1957 Fender Twin or a 1959 Bassman. If the real thing is too much, you can buy any of several clones. Each year there are more and more tube amps introduced at NAMM. The "tube sound" is part and parcel of the electric guitar sound.

Now, who believes that 50 years from now a 2011 Mustang amp will have the same value and be as revered as that Twin and Bassman are today? Who believes that 50 years from now Fender will be releasing reissues of the Mustang amp?

The Twin and Bassman are like a 57 Chevy: Beautiful when new and a real ground breaker. They are still around today and worth lots of money and are still ground breakers. A Mustang amp (and any number of other modeling amps) is like a 2011 Prius: built for a specific purpose, not particularly noteworthy outside of that purpose, and definitely not ground breakers. How many 2011 Priuses will be around in 50 years? Probably about as many as Mustang amps.

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Post subject: Re: Really Promising New Amps from Fender
Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 9:51 pm
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hi bluesky, cedarblues, & airborne

first, i appreciate the reasoned responses, i owe you my thoughts:
yes, we have a lot to owe to tube amps, great tones, great music, no denying that one bit. i absolutley agree with you, SOME tube amps sound great. my beef is value for the money, and from personal prejudice, the reliability - i freely admit this is a personal prejudice. tone-wise, SOME tube amp sound great, my fav tube amps tone wise are still the showman & TRRI. btw, not all tube amps sound good, some are crappy and same is true for SOME ss amps (however, most modelers have been pretty good).

the thing i can't support is the mythology, mysticsm, and the status quo of tube amps. it's the wild variety that makes things happen. the one thing i've noticed in these discussions is some kind of fanatical allergy to non-tube amps, computer "amps", software. why the fear? you're surrounded by it. and you all lived life, got your knocks, maybe even had to write your own epitaph to get over fear of death (tough guys, you know what i mean). so i take shots at the status quo, maybe you should too. live.

about duplication: why duplicate? a tool like the SE gives you freedom to experiment & try new stuff. i've been bangin on this a long time. yes the SE has tubes in it. the way i dial in the SE, you could either use tube circuitry or SS and sound pretty good. yes, the tube circuitry does sound good, and so does the rest of the amp & its effects. bottom line is that the SE is great package. and i'll be keeping my SE's for a very long time (and my JC-120).

ozrv, not sure you'll understand, i can't respond to room temperature IQ remarks. sorry.

ciao,
johnny.


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Post subject: Re: Really Promising New Amps from Fender
Posted: Mon Jan 17, 2011 11:02 pm
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johnny stecchino wrote:
the one thing i've noticed in these discussions is some kind of fanatical allergy to non-tube amps, computer "amps", software. why the fear?


Why is it so hard to understand that we simply prefer tube amps? Its not fear. I have a digital camera, a Blue Ray player, I work with computers, etc., but I simply prefer the sound of a tube amplifier and a couple of analog pedals. Like I said earlier, tube amps have been making great tones for over 50 years and they still continue to be built. Will they be around in another 50 years? Will guitars be around in another 50 years? Don't know. All I know is what is available now and for the near future. And I know what I like. That's all there is to it.

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Post subject: Re: Really Promising New Amps from Fender
Posted: Tue Jan 18, 2011 4:30 pm
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ozrv, not sure you'll understand, i can't respond to room temperature IQ remarks. sorry.

l :lol: :lol: :lol: ...Is that the room temperature in your computer room little Johnny?

Excuse me that i don't put enough depth of intelligence and passion into my "cyber life" for your approval, No doubt i just slapped it off whilst still thinking of the gourgous point waves i just surfed or the new SRV lick i have just learned going round and round in my head or the beautiful Harley ride on the way to work. etc, Or life outside the computer room.

But never the less continue the discussion please i enjoy informed information on a subject that is of great personal interest to me. Also it looks like the more computer room time you do the warmer your computer room will get thus giving me a higher IQ, it's win win for everybody!!!! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

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Post subject: Re: Really Promising New Amps from Fender
Posted: Tue Jan 18, 2011 5:36 pm
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bluesky, your "we" is some, not all. we of at least another persuasion prefer the SE (and in my particular case, also a JC-120). let's keep the "we" to "some" shall we?

ozrv, like i said, i can't respond to room temperature IQ remarks. let's talk when there are signs of intelligent life.

anybody had a chance to test the FUSE software and deep access Mustang tones? your thoughts? any issues with the user interface? any comparisons to the SE (or any other amp)?

ciao,
johnny.


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Post subject: Re: Really Promising New Amps from Fender
Posted: Tue Jan 18, 2011 5:51 pm
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johnny stecchino wrote:
bluesky, your "we" is some, not all. we of at least another persuasion prefer the SE (and in my particular case, also a JC-120). let's keep the "we" to "some" shall we?


I was referring to myself, Arjay, and the others in this thread who don't share your fascination with modeling amps. You were not part of the "we". I would have thought that would have been obvious.

johnny stecchino wrote:
anybody had a chance to test the FUSE software and deep access Mustang tones? your thoughts? any issues with the user interface? any comparisons to the SE (or any other amp)?


Again, there is a forum here where this is the main topic of discussion, but you don't really seem to undertand that.

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Post subject: Re: Really Promising New Amps from Fender
Posted: Tue Jan 18, 2011 6:36 pm
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bluesky636 wrote:
Again, there is a forum here where this is the main topic of discussion, but you don't really seem to undertand that.


Indeed!

If this were a C/L post I'd flag it as "miscategorized".

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: Really Promising New Amps from Fender
Posted: Tue Jan 18, 2011 7:00 pm
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lol.....Intellectual Johnny the frustrated forum blogger......

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Post subject: Re: Really Promising New Amps from Fender
Posted: Tue Jan 18, 2011 7:04 pm
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We would all be better off debating with a tree stump. All he does is throw juvenile insults at other users and misquote things you've said. He doesn't get it and likely never will. He can't even post in the correct forum category.

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Post subject: Re: Really Promising New Amps from Fender
Posted: Wed Jan 19, 2011 1:23 am
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ok, i understand that "we" is you & your gang. got it.

talking to tree stumps and various nuts, couldn't agree more.

ozrv, if only "we" can progress beyond using mono-syllable words and some of the teenage euphemisms... are you under 18? or 21? depending on the state, you could be forgiven.

so back to amps and things... what tube amp does the mustang beat out, just for comparison's sake? better yet, what tube amp (and a rack full of effects) does the SE beat out, again for comparison's sake?

ciao,
johnny.


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