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Post subject: replacing stock speaker in 64 vibroverb custom
Posted: Sat Dec 11, 2010 11:28 pm
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Has anyone replaced your stock eminence 15" speaker with something else in a 64 vibroverb custom? What would be a good match to try and get close to an original vintage jbl or evm or Jensen ?


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Posted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 12:22 am
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Why don't you simply find an original JBL D130F and buy it?

That's how you get "close" to the SRV sound.

HTH

Arjay

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Posted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 1:11 am
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Location: In a house....unless I'm at work....then I'm in a shop.
Or just have your old speaker re-coned.

It will do a world of difference for far less money.

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Posted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 3:15 am
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Yes recone it in a good shop


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Posted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 12:23 pm
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Jeffytune wrote:
It will do a world of difference for far less money.


If "saving money" is your primary concern, go buy yourself a Strat Pak and call it a day.

People with a $2500 guitar amp are likely to be a bit more serious about their craft.

And serious tone costs serious money.

Arjay (seriously concerned about his tone)

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Posted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 1:39 pm
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I agree with Retoverbial . I read the post to fast the 12th December. About Jensen speaker; put it in a garbage and buy a good one.

This is a gift for your tone, your amp and you


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Posted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 2:56 pm
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There are some good Jensens around......

But they were all built thirty or forty years ago.

:mrgreen:

Arjay

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Posted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 4:46 pm
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Yes Retroverbial. I just talk about the Jensen use in this post for the 64 vibroverb custom


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Posted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 5:26 pm
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I've heard original '64 Vibroverbs with the three OEM speakers that were used back then with these amps (Jensen C15N, CTS ceramic, and Oxford 15L8) and they all sounded sweet. But none were as ballsy as the JBL D130F, which was often a dealer-installed option. If a Vibroverb ever falls into my lap -- either an original or a re-issue -- the JBL will be my speaker of choice.

Arjay

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Posted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 5:47 pm
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I've heard good reviews of the JBL D130F,it's supposed to be the closest they have to the tone of the fabulous old style JBL K-120s.

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Posted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 7:28 pm
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guitslinger wrote:
I've heard good reviews of the JBL D130F,it's supposed to be the closest they have to the tone of the fabulous old style JBL K-120s.


WTF????

The D130F is the original Lansing guitar speaker

It was developed by JBL engineer Harvey Gerst in 1962.

The K120 did not appear until some twenty years later.

I don't know who you've been listening to but they don't know sh*t from Shinola.

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


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Post subject: thanks for all the feedback guys
Posted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 9:02 pm
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I guess my question was a little vague. I have a 64 vibroverb custom which is the 2003 customshop reissue. Does anyone have one? Do you like the Eminence Speaker ? I have read up on the history of the amp and speaker combos used by SRV and understand he used EVM's during the last year or so he was living. I wonder why he didn't stick with the JBL's. Maybe because he pushed them to the limit. I would love to find a nice JBL or EVM but, if what I have is close to either of them what would be the point? I have seen some jbls and evm's on ebay but some were models unfamiliar and some were 16 ohms where as I need to use an 8 ohm speaker.


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Posted: Sun Dec 12, 2010 9:34 pm
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Arjay,it seems that I made a wrong assumption from something I read on another forum.A poster had been saying the D-130 F was comparable to the K-120 for sound quality and since my K-120 is quite old and due to the numeric designation of 130 on the other JBL I wrongly thought that the 120 came first when it was the other way around.Anyway the K-120 is a phenominal speaker,I have one in my old Leslie cab and it seems that the more volume you crank out of it the better it sounds.BTW I bought my Leslie with the K-120 in it in the late 70s but I don't know how long the speaker had been in it and it wasn't the original speaker.

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Posted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 12:01 am
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I have several K120s too -- sonically, they're indistinguishable from the original D120F (12" alnico JBL).

But the D-series were the first ones out of the gate, starting with the 15" D130. This full-range driver began life around 1955 as a hi-fi speaker. Leo decided that his then-new flagship combo the Vibrasonic needed a brighter and tighter sounding driver than Jensen or Oxford could build and specified the D130 exclusively. Shortly thereafter, he mandated this model for his new 85-watt piggyback Showman Amp as well. However, the D130 highlighted some deficiences that were later to become notorious once Dick Dale began using the Showman for live performances. The result was a fortified version designated by JBL as the D130F ("F" for Fender). A 12" version followed thereafter, called the D120F. This speaker was based on the 12" D131 full-range hi-fi driver with structural enhancements as per the D130F. Next up was a dedicated 15" bass guitar speaker known as the D140F. It was based on the D130F but used a heavier ribbed cone, copper (in lieu of aluminum) ribbon voice-coil, and stiffer suspension. The last of the original "F-series" JBL speakers developed for musical instruments was the 10" D110F which appeared in mid 1965. It too traces its lineage back to a hi-fi speaker, in this case a woofer.

Continuous power-handling capability for these speakers when mounted in an open-back infinite-baffle enclosure are:

D120F, D130F......35 watts RMS
D140F......50 watts RMS
D110F......25 watts RMS

These specs are approximately 30% higher when the speaker is used in a bass-reflex (ie: sealed-back) cabinet

The K-series speakers were a high-power version of the original D's developed in the early '80s. These drivers used the existing "D" frames and alnico magnet structures but were fitted with the cone/coil assembly used in the ceramic-magnet E-series speakers. Thus, power-handling capability was doubled in each case. Most D-series speakers have long since been reconed using the E/K parts sets and it is very rare to see any that still have their original cones and coils.

How does all of this relate to a re-issue '64 Vibroverb?

The OEM Eminence driver chosen for this Custom amp bears more of a relationship to the ceramic Oxfords and Jensens normally found in an original Vibroverb. The Emi does not sound "bad" -- but neither does it deliver the gritty warmth of an alnico JBL. Which is why many players prefer the D130F over more modern designs.

As for the Electro-Voice EVM's, they're also a fine speaker engineered in similar fashion to the JBL but having a still-heavier magnet structure (18 lbs vs 11.5 lbs). The EVM's (and their predecessor, the EV-SRO model) may require a stronger baffle board to support the added heft. Sonically, the high end is rolled off slightly from the Lansing's, with some additional emphasis on the mid-range. Both speakers have tight, well-defined bass response. The EVM is designed for 100 watts continous program material.

HTH

Arjay

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Posted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 12:29 am
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Retroverbial wrote:
Jeffytune wrote:
It will do a world of difference for far less money.


If "saving money" is your primary concern, go buy yourself a Strat Pak and call it a day.

People with a $2500 guitar amp are likely to be a bit more serious about their craft.

And serious tone costs serious money.

Arjay (seriously concerned about his tone)


Cost was not the main thrust of my comment Sir, I have seen many time were someone will puts in a high dollar speaker (Like a JBL or Elecrtavoice) and then looses the tone they had to start with because the speaker will not break up like the stock one would.
What is wrong with rebuilding the stock speaker? I mean if you want to monkey around with a an amp, why not use a reissue and not ruin a 1964 classic amp?

Serious tone cost serious money?
Let me guess, your in the used gear business. :roll:

Great tone comes from, yes good quality gear, but more importantly, from Talent!
It make no difference how much you spend on gear if you do not have talent to back it up.

All I can say is this. I had a nice tube amp (It was not a fender) but it had a nice tone and the speaker would break up at the right volume. Ten years later, the speaker had torn from dry rote, and all my buddys kept telling me to change the speaker to a better one, so I got a JBL guitar speaker and swapped it in......it flat ruined that amp. It was the right amperage range and all (So the salesman said it was) but even at 10 the speaker would not break up, it was just clean clean clean.
I hated it.
Sold that one and bought a stock replacement speaker, and all was good again.

More expensive speakers do not make better tone, they will make DIFFERENT tones, some more to the type of music you play and what you like, some not to what you like at all.

Bottom line is, he must have liked the tone of the amp when he bought it, and since he did not state what type of music/tone he wants we are left to assume he liked the amp and wants it to sound it's best and re-coning would then be the best choice.

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At first all you want are Hearts and Diamonds.

But in the end, all you really want is a Club and a Spade.

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