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Post subject: Tube Amp: Hot Rod Blues Jr. NOS <or> Carvin Nomad ??
Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 3:12 am
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I've been singing and playing guitar semi-professionally for 52 years: acoustic, acoustic-electric, and electric. 13 years ago a burglar stole my sweet little Mesa Boogie Studio .22 -- a wonderful little (and LOUD!) tube amp. Fortunately the burglar overlooked my '68 Gibson ES-335 (I bought it new in '69.) That sweet tone factory is still my favorite axe -- dang thing nearly plays itself.

My music is mostly '60's & '70's melodic rock, and fingerstyle instrumentals.

Since the little Boogie left, I've been playing the ES-335 through a variety of "modern" SS amps. The time has come to get another tube amp, dedicated to the tremendous variety of sounds that beautiful Gibson cranks out. I don't gig so much any more; much of my playing is at home, solo or jamming with friends. Portability (weight) is a factor, and I don't want to go too big/powerful for practice, but do want sound versatility and quality that'll let me use the same amp for larger gigs, driving satellite speakers or a PA setup.

I want to buy new (warranty), and have set a price cap for this purchase at $500 - $600 (street).

Two amps are among my top contenders. I really like the Fender Hot Rod Blues Jr. NOS (15watts / single channel / 1x15" Jensen speaker) for its tonal range, its size, and the design and build quality. I've played this amp with the ES-335, and they're a sweet pair together.

The other contender is Carvin's Vintage Series Nomad (50 watts / two footswitchable channels / 1x12" speaker) -- a little powerhouse that packs a lot more features & options than the Fender. I have not played the Carvin, since I live far from Southern California, but have found their tube amps to be generally high quality and durable. Many of my pro-musician friends swear by their Carvin gear; of course most of those same people have nothing but praise for most Fender amps.

There's no arguing with the versatility of having two channels, footswitchable between "clean"/rhythm and "lead"/punctuation settings: advantage Carvin. But the Fender is, well, a Fender tube amp -- it has that sweet, warm, clean "Fender sound," that can trend by degrees over into some really nasty, edgy tooth-rattling when you ask it to.

No doubt I could easily let my ear decide if I could play the two amps side-by-side, but again, Carvin's self-distribution system setup prevents that from happening for me ... even though I do like the value-for-price that their no-middleman system permits.

So: anybody here played either of these amps? Anybody played them both?

It's worth noting that most factory-based online forums discourage the heresy of discussing competitors' stuff on their forum "boards" -- but I've notice that Fender's forum community (here) has an easy confidence that only a mature, time-tested product line can enjoy.

So please give it your best shot. What would YOU choose (for my circumstances):

Fender's proven Blues Jr. NOS,
or
Carvin's versatile Vintage Nomad? :?:

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Last edited by bobwords on Sat Dec 11, 2010 2:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 5:00 am
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I am one of the old guard at the Carvin Forums and have owned 2 Belairs, a V3, and an X212B - all Carvin (not to mention about 8 Carvin guitars at one point). So I think I can give an opinion here. My current rig (listed below) doesn't include any Carvin amps. The simple reason is that they are good amps but they don't do anything great. Of course, many of my "brothers" over there would rather shoot themselves than say that, but I believe in an honest opinion about the gear.

I found that all of the amps had a sort of hollow sound to them. It was as if the sound had to travel through a 10-foot wooden tube to get out of the amp. That was something that drove me nuts about the amp. I've had 2 Hot Rod Deluxes and have settled on the Twin Reverb as my main amp and none of those amps have that problem. I will admit that I have always considered the Twin to be the holy grail of tone. It is what I love. I always wanted my Carvins to sound Fender.

Another huge difference between the two is the Nomad is an EL84 powerhouse. It is loud but very Voxy. You are going to get a completely different tone from it than you would the Blues Jr. The Nomad is much more compressed than the Blues Jr. but does have some exceptional chiminess to it. I have only noodled around on a Blues Jr. but prefer the openness of its tone compared to the Nomad.

Another area that you will definitely see a difference is the breakup. I can't speak for where the breakup is on the Blues Jr. but if the Nomad is just like the Belair (and it is minus a speaker) you will be hard pressed to get it to have some natural breakup. I had the Belair's volume at 8 on the clean channel and it showed no signs of breaking up. So if you want massive amounts of headroom on the cleans, then, between the two amps, the Nomad will win out.

As for the versatility that you speak of - if you are thinking that you will like the Nomad's Soak channel then I hope that you aren't as disappointed as I was (should you decide to get it). The Nomad's Soak channel is likened to someone throwing a blanket over the amp. This is a great analogy. The sound becomes very muffled and muddy sounding. The only time that I had the Belair's Soak channel sounding somewhat good was the one time that I had it cranked well beyond normal useable settings. For the most part, straight from the amp sound on this channel just doesn't cut for most people who get the amp. There is something about it that completely changes if you record it. I always ask if that's the same amp that I had when I hear it recorded. There's always the now infamous Hasserl mods for the Nomad as well which are supposed to clean up a lot of that muddiness but will take the amp closer to Marshall territory in the Soak channel. It doesn't sound like that is what you're after.

For me the Soak channel was useless. I never used and eventually unplugged the footswitch just to get it out of the way. I rarely play without a hint of reverb (which is nice but not quite as strong as the Fender reverb - the output level of it seems a little weak when maxed out) and I never used the effects loop. I prefer a straight up amp that may very well be a 1-trick pony but at least it does that one trick exceptionally well. I can - and do - use pedals to change my tone. Which for dirt I use either a ProCo Rat pedal or a T-Rex Moller Overdrive.

So in the end, do I think that the Nomad is a bad amp? No. You just need to make sure that it is what you are looking for. You may not be in So Cal, but don't forget that you do get a 10-day money back guarantee on it. I know a lot of the guys working at Carvin. If you decide to get it and try it out then not like it, just call up Carvin CS and ask for Bart. Great guy. He will be more than happy to help you out with no pressure to keep it. When I was trying all of the amps out, he eventually asked me what I was looking for. I told him I wanted a Carvin amp that sounded like a Twin. He said the X212B is the closest you're gonna get but if you want a real Twin sound, get the Twin.

If you happen to look at the X212/X100 series amps, don't forget to specify which power amp tubes you want. One thing says it comes with 6L6s while something else will say EL34s. Mine came with EL34s, but I wanted 6L6s. No problem at all. I had a new amp in 3 days and the other one was picked up. But the 6L6 versions will have a more Fendery openness to them with a killer overdrive. The EL34s are more Marshall in tone. They still have that hollowness to them that I mentioned about the Nomad.

Remember Fender's ad campaign a few years back - The Soul of Tone? To me the Carvin amps are good, but just don't have that soul to them. Just be sure that it is what you like before committing to it beyond the 10 days trial period.


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Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 7:48 am
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I know you want to buy new, but for $500-$600 you could find a used Deluxe Reverb reissue.

Or you could get a new Vox AC15C1 (sorry Fender) awesome amp in your price range. I'm just not a fan of Blues Jr's and cannot give an opinion on Carvin amps becuase in my 20+ years of playing I've never even seen or heard one in person. Which begs the question, "who buys Carvin gear, and how do they stay in business"? Maybe Carvin amps are a rare thing in my area. I would be hesitant to buy one before playing it too.

dvlsadvc8t - Thanks for the details of Carvin amps. That's the first I've heard about these from someone who owned one.

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Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 9:06 am
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Here is a link to a new/barely used DRRI on craigslist for $750 but he's hard up for money so you could probably talk him down.
http://batonrouge.craigslist.org/msg/2090558831.html

Also a Egnator Rebel 20 Head and Cabinet for $500. I know Supro loves them,
http://batonrouge.craigslist.org/msg/2092116501.html

I have no idea if these are good deals or not as I've not been in the market for a amp in a while. Good luck in finding what you want!! :wink:


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Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 9:17 am
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metropolis74 wrote:
Which begs the question, "who buys Carvin gear, and how do they stay in business"?


According to Carvin's website, "Craig Chaquico, Steve Vai, Allan Holdsworth, Bunny Brunel, Timothy B. Schmit and Frank Gambale".

Not a very impressive set of endorsements IMO.

Arjay

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Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 12:07 pm
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A DRRI sings with a ES335. I'd skip the HRD series in general. You're a seasoned guy like quite a few of us. I had a HRDlx mine was a piece of unreliable garbage and I went with an Egnater Rebel 20 which a little over a year later, I still love and has been totally reliable. I too had a Twin. A 76 SF that I finally sold after 34 years of totally reliable service. It was too loud and heavy for what I do now. I've never owned a Carvin amp, but have played out of a few including the Nomad. It's a good amp, just not a great amp. I would seriously consider a DRRI either new or used.

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Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 1:08 pm
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I'm with Supro -- a 335 and a DRRI is a match made in heaven.

And if channel-switching is high on your "must-have" list, you can add one of these to your signal chain......

http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/prod ... sku=153931

You'll have instant access to either channel (or both simultaneously) and the pedal allows you to keep them "in phase" using the 180-degree switch.

HTH

Arjay

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Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 3:04 pm
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I have to agree,the drri sounds good with just about anything.One of fenders more solid amps.It sounds good with anything .I still have a blues jr that use for rehearsals sometimes,but am quickly reminded why I use the drri to gig with.


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Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 5:41 pm
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dvlsadvc8t wrote:
...Another huge difference between the two is the Nomad is an EL84 powerhouse....


Great post dvlsadvc8t! Just wanted to point out that the BJr is also EL84 output tubes. I would get the BJr and install an adjustable bias pot, great little amp with that mod alone. :)

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Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 5:51 pm
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shimmilou wrote:
dvlsadvc8t wrote:
...Another huge difference between the two is the Nomad is an EL84 powerhouse....


Great post dvlsadvc8t! Just wanted to point out that the BJr is also EL84 output tubes. I would get the BJr and install an adjustable bias pot, great little amp with that mod alone. :)


Thanks for pointing that out. I wasn't sure if it was and didn't have time to look it up when I posted. I still think there's a little something missing in the Nomad.

To be honest with you, Iw as actually thinking of the Blues Deluxe Reissue not the Blues Junior. I can definitely say that I have never played anything through the Blues Jr., but my impressions of the Carvin still stand. It has its own distinct sound that you either like or don't.

BTW, Arjay, don't forget to add Joe Walsh to that list.


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Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 6:03 pm
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Carvin should add it -- that's who I got those names from.

The last time I saw Joseph Walsh play was in the mid '70s and he was using a pair of Sunn Model T tops and a quartet of Sunn 412S cabs.

Loud?

Hell, they could've heard him all the way on the surface of the moon!

:mrgreen:

Arjay

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"Here's why reliability is job one: A great sounding amp that breaks down goes from being a favorite piece of gear to a useless piece of crap in less time than it takes to read this sentence." -- BRUCE ZINKY


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Posted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 6:23 pm
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Retroverbial wrote:
Carvin should add it -- that's who I got those names from.

The last time I saw Joseph Walsh play was in the mid '70s and he was using a pair of Sunn Model T tops and a quartet of Sunn 412S cabs.

Loud?

Hell, they could've heard him all the way on the surface of the moon!

:mrgreen:

Arjay


I bet. He wasn't too terribly quiet when I saw his solo tour back in '07. BTW, he's listed down in the endorsers section but not in the signature artists section. http://www.carvinguitars.com/artists/


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