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Post subject: Pro Junior or Super Champ XD?
Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 9:46 am
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Guys:

I've narrowed down my search for a tube practice amp to two (2) Fenders. One has been a Fender mainstay for many years and one is new to the Fender stable. My choice must either be the Pro Junior or Super Champ XD. I've played both. Both have very nice tone, 15 watts, 10-inch speakers and about the same price. The only difference that I can see is that the Super Champ XD adds DSP and "amp voicing".

The problem is that I don't know enough about the inner workings of either machine to know which would be a better buy!

Is the Super Champ XD REALLY a tube amp? I mean, do the tubes actually produce the sound or are they amplifying a digital sound?

Please give me a hand with this and help me to justify my decision.

Thanks.


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Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 2:22 pm
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They are amplifying a signal coming from the DSP. Not much different than sticking a POD in front of a PJ. If you want to stay a tube purist, stick with the BJ/PJ/DRRI/600 products.

But the SC certainly deserves a listen. Many pro players are comparing the SC's tone favorably to the vastly more expensive DRRI.


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Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 5:00 pm
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Maruuk wrote:
They are amplifying a signal coming from the DSP. Not much different than sticking a POD in front of a PJ. If you want to stay a tube purist, stick with the BJ/PJ/DRRI/600 products.

But the SC certainly deserves a listen. Many pro players are comparing the SC's tone favorably to the vastly more expensive DRRI.


Pardon my ignorance, but why would you want to color TUBE tone? I can see coloring S/S tone, or perhaps sticking a timed effect or OD out in front of a PJ, but not changing the actual tone.


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Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 2:24 pm
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Because it's a modeling amp.


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Posted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 4:34 pm
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Maruuk wrote:
Because it's a modeling amp.


Well, now, that's interesting. Fender is marketing the SCXD as "not a modeling amp".


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Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 9:36 am
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FenderGuy53 wrote:
Maruuk wrote:
Because it's a modeling amp.


Well, now, that's interesting. Fender is marketing the SCXD as "not a modeling amp".


Just a guess here - modeling amps are often associated with solid state amps. Since a lot of folks prefer a tube amp, I think Fender was smart to emphasize the "tube" part of the amp over its modeling capabilities for marketing purposes.

I bought an SCXD because it was a reasonably priced tube amp that did not weigh a lot, and having built-in effects and amp model was a plus. It's powerful enough to do small gigs with, and sound betters than any solid state amp I own.

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Standard Stratocaster; Standard Telecaster; Gibson Flying V; Epiphone Dot; OLP TinTop. Fender amps: Twin Reverb 15, Deluxe 900, GDEC 30, Super Champ XD, Mini-Twin; Others: Line 6 Spider III; Crate DXJ112; Peavey Renown; Ashdown Fallen Angel FA50.


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Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 11:15 am
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I have a both the Pro and Blues Jrs and they have not been turned on since I got the SCXD. Nothing wrong with the Jrs its just the SCXD has become my "recording amp" Heck, I don't even plug in my Pod anymore.

I say for a practice amp get the SCXD, you will not be disappointed.


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Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 11:25 am
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chris63 wrote:
I have a both the Pro and Blues Jrs and they have not been turned on since I got the SCXD. Nothing wrong with the Jrs its just the SCXD has become my "recording amp" Heck, I don't even plug in my Pod anymore.

I say for a practice amp get the SCXD, you will not be disappointed.


Right now, I'm leaning toward the SCXD again.

Questions: If I put a OD pedal in front of the PJ, can I saturate the tubes without causing hearing loss? Is there a way to saturate the tubes without a pedal?

Thanks.


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Post subject:
Posted: Wed Jan 09, 2008 11:33 am
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You can swallow the FMIC marketing spin or simply note that the amp directly, without any ambiguity attempts to model a wide variety of other amps. And does a pretty decent job of it. That DSP is surprising a lot of folks with its quality of modeling and excellent EFX.

But I'd agree that the stealth value of the amp is in getting not just a tube amp into the hands of value-conscious customers, but a 6V6-powered tube amp. At the time of the SCXD's release, you couldn't get a 6V6 Fender amp for less than $849.

And according to Bill M., this is not just a tube power amp stage at play, but the 12AX7 is also a significant part of the preamp gain stage. So its not just the classic hybrid all SS front end with a tube output stage.

And thing is, both for stage work and working on recording projects, a guitarist often needs to approach each song with a unique palette of tones. Get the amp tone that really works for that tune organically. And unless you're John Mayer, you don't have amp techs building massive walls of amp and cab options in your backline. Last night I noticed Mary J. Blige's guitarist playing a Vetta amp. Another modeling amp. He went through 3 different amp tones in just one song.

Speed and efficiency is the friend of creativity and always saves money. Twisting a dial beats hauling 10 tons of amps any day.

The SCXD is a modeling amp. One might even say a super modeling amp. That's hot.


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Posted: Fri Jan 11, 2008 4:36 pm
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FenderGuy53 wrote:
chris63 wrote:
I have a both the Pro and Blues Jrs and they have not been turned on since I got the SCXD. Nothing wrong with the Jrs its just the SCXD has become my "recording amp" Heck, I don't even plug in my Pod anymore.

I say for a practice amp get the SCXD, you will not be disappointed.


Right now, I'm leaning toward the SCXD again.

Questions: If I put a OD pedal in front of the PJ, can I saturate the tubes without causing hearing loss? Is there a way to saturate the tubes without a pedal?

Thanks.


You can use some sort of clean boost and slam your preamp tubes on the pro jr. but that is preamp distorition. What you want is power tube distortion (IMO). A pedal can mimic power tube distortion it but can not get you there for real. An attenuator can help but then you lose the speaker interaction if you attenuate to much . So I would say if you want good real tube distortion then get a master volume amp like the Blues Jr. or a very low wattage ie Champ that you can crank and get real power tube distortion. That way you won't blow your ears out in your bedroom. Of course this is all just my humble opinion. I have a BMRI LTD with a hotplate that is the bees knees!


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Posted: Fri Jan 11, 2008 5:12 pm
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It depends on what you're trying to do. The Pro Junior has two tones: (a) Volume below 4 for clean; and (b) volume above 4 for dirt. But those tones are awesome. Billy Corgan of Smashing Pumpkins says the PJ is awesome in the studio.


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Post subject:
Posted: Fri Jan 11, 2008 5:18 pm
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I'd go with the Blues Junior over the Pro Junior because with the Blues Junior you can get fat tube tone at low volume using the volume (preamp) and master (power amp) controls. Crank the volume and turn down the master, or vice versa, and you get an excellent fat blues tone, all the way up to high gain modern rock tones. The amp also has sweet clean tones. It's extremely versatile with no need for solid state pedals or modeling. The Pro Junior is cheaper, but has not got the volume control and so if you want the blues tone we all need (whether we know it or not) we have to crank the F out of it and peel the paint off the walls of our house. The Blues Junior has a 12 inch speaker and that's really important. Classic Fender amps tend to have the 12 inch speaker (twinned 12s also is classic).

The amp Maruuk loves SCXD (I might have got that wrong) is running a hybrid computer/tube approach that's brand new and the latest thing. It's got the modeling like a Line6, but runs it out tubes to give you good sound. No question you can get fat blues tone at low volumes from that as well, but it's partially digital. Or, you can crank it and just let the power amp produce all the tone with the digital part set at a clean Fender.


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Post subject:
Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 12:44 pm
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The Super Champ XD is a tube amp. It has 2 6V6 tubes and a 12AX7 tube. Although it uses some solid state equipment, it sounds a lot like a tube amp. I think some of the warmth is gone, however. But if you like to play other things besides blues, I'd get the super champ. The voicings and effects are very well done, and kind of gives you a really good solid state amp in 1 channel and a tube amp in the other. Mind :shock: Blowing


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Post subject:
Posted: Tue Jan 15, 2008 2:20 pm
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You can always put a pedal or two in front of the Blues Junior for limitless possibilities. Personally, I like the all tube tones I get and the response. The bass capability of the 12 inch speaker is also grand. There's no reason to only have one amp, by the way. I have two and more may come along as my wife permits.


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