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Post subject: on-line reviews
Posted: Sun May 23, 2010 10:37 am
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i am in the market for a new amp. like many of you, i like to go online for information and reviews.

one thing that confounds me is the vast difference in opinions out there. since this is a fender forum i'll talk about what i have read on them. this does, however, apply to other amps too.

on e-bay i came across a fender princeton 650 amp, ond the price looks reasonable to me. one just happens to be in my hometown, and if i win i can pick it up and save shipping. sounds good so far, right?

i then go online to read the reviews, and i am astonished. while i see some good reviews, i also see many who say they returned them do to reliability issues, and some who complain about humming or noise.

my question is simple: how doo you sort through these and make an informed decision? when you read problems about these amps, do you still want to buy them?. i know fender is a great brand. there can't be that many problems.....or are there?

input is welcome


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Posted: Sun May 23, 2010 11:38 am
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I also have to depend on online sales, so I place a lot of importance on user reviews. The trick is to sift thru as many as possible and see if you can pickup on any trends, whether positive or negative. If a lot of folks are complaining about the same thing, it might be a good idea to look at something else. Then again, if the thing being complained about isn't something that comcerns you, those complaints my be irrelevant to you. For example, a lot of folk might complain about a particular amp not having an effects loop, but if you don't really use a lot of effects, that might be irrelevant to you. This is more relevant as far as inclusion or lack of features, goes, but if all the complaints are of the reiliabilty of a product,that product might be one to stay away from. Then there's the matter of personal taste as well, some equipment, while good quality, may not appeal to everybody. You kind have to read between the lines in some cases, Then there's the obvious reviews you can completely ignore, those of the "This gear sux azz." variety.
Again, read as many reviews as possible, look for trends, whether positive or negative, read between the lines and take everything with a grain of salt.
This is what I did when I bought my MIM Strat and SCXD amp last year, I read as many user reviews as I could, the trend in both cases seemed very good, any complaints were few and far between, and usually seemed to be a matter of taste than anything to do with quality or reliablity issues. All I can tell you is, that I am quite happy with my purchases, and I find myself in agreement with all those postive reviews I read.

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Posted: Sun May 23, 2010 1:06 pm
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That's it exactly. Most are only opinions as far as tone goes. What would be a deal breaker for me is reliability issues. Harmony Central is the last place I'd look. People go on there and trash a piece of gear after only spending five minutes with it at Guitar Center or just going by hearsay.

Gear forums are probably your best bet. I'd also steer clear of manufacturer forums for honest opinions. Why go to say a Marshall forum and ask die hard Marshall fans about gear or Gibson or even here for that matter. There are only a handful of folks willing to give honest opinions about gear on this forum, then the fans of a certain piece of gear will get all upset if you say something negative about it.

Best thing to do is research any problems. If you see the same problem popping up, I would be suspect. If it's about tone, only your ears and playing style will tell the tale.

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Posted: Sun May 23, 2010 3:05 pm
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63supro wrote:
then the fans of a certain piece of gear will get all upset if you say something negative about it.


Or the forum's sponsor/owner will ban your azz for being "too candid".

:mrgreen:

Arjay


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Posted: Mon May 24, 2010 5:59 am
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Arjay, at least I know who speaks honestly here. :wink:

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Posted: Mon May 24, 2010 9:09 am
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63supro wrote:
Arjay, at least I know who speaks honestly here. :wink:


LOLOL

I know you and I share many opinions about companies that have lain a proverbial egg.

I just try to be as diplomatic as I can when identifying the "hen".

:mrgreen:

Arjay


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Posted: Mon May 24, 2010 9:19 am
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It is hard to get an honest ,neutral online review.Go to Harmony Central and read a few and see what I mean. User-I bought my @@@@ amp yesterday and it sounds phenomenal ,gets that classic @@@ tone ,This is my first tube amp,my other one was a Frontman 15,which is exactly how old I am." Or ,"I went to @@@ and tried out a Deluxe reverb for 30 seconds and couldnt get a single good sound out of it.I have been playing for 20 years in a Slipknot tribute band and my Randall 3000 watt with 12 -12" greenbacks gets better distortion."I know this is an exaggeration ,but most of the online reviews are all over the chart.I know a few guys here who will give you an honest opinion, but it might not be the answer you are looking for.Like supro said ,visit other sites that arent brand specific and ask questions there.


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Posted: Mon May 24, 2010 10:09 pm
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By saying you can't get an honest reply, are you guys saying that everyone on this forum but you three are liars? Maybe you are trying to say that everyone here but you has the wrong opinion. Maybe, but I doubt it. As I've told you before, everybody can't afford your golden oldie picks. IMHO YMMV KOGA


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Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 12:01 am
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I love it when you talk dirty to me, GTG.

:mrgreen:

Arjay


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Post subject:
Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 5:55 am
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GTG wrote:
By saying you can't get an honest reply, are you guys saying that everyone on this forum but you three are liars? Maybe you are trying to say that everyone here but you has the wrong opinion. Maybe, but I doubt it. As I've told you before, everybody can't afford your golden oldie picks. IMHO YMMV KOGA
GTG,take my comments for what they were,tongue in cheek.Really mine were aimed at the so called user reviews that you see on Harmony Central.Guys bring an amp or guitar home and they play it for 5 minutes and write a review.I also read on there where some guy took a new deluxe reverb home and rewired it point to point because he said it was crap,not really understanding why he bought it in the first place.I understand about the money issue .Some of those Fender tube amps can be had brand new for 499.However (and I think Supro points this out quite often) you can buy used .Recently I saw a 2 year old deluxe reverb someone was selling for 525 bucks.I personally bought a 59 bassman reissue from the mid 90s for 350 bucks.Granted , it looked pretty well broken in,but sounds like a million bucks.There are different options out there.


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Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 6:26 am
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Nobody called anyone a liar. The thing is there are a lot of younger players here who have no point of reference. Us geezer types especially over 50 bought amps when all there were were tube amp and great sounding amps to boot. The Fender amps way back were, built better, had better components and did indeed sound better and that's a fact.

How many times here have you read I have a HRD... or Blues... it sounds incredible, what speaker of tubes do you recommend?
My point is if you have no point of reference, you honestly won't know what's great. Whatever you have at the time is the greatest thing since sliced bread.

The young players today might start out with a Frontman 15 and then move up to a Blues Jr or a HRD amp. Seems very few go the DRRI route. Not enough bells and whistles I guess.

I started out on a Danelectro DM10 and move up to a Vibrolux Reverb.
Nothing wrong with the Dano, Joe Perry even records with them. Both amps were hand wired and sounded great. After that came a Princeton, Bandmaster, Deluxe Reverb, Twin a couple of others like an Ampeg and a Sunn.
See what I mean, nobody is lying, it's a point of reference.

I would rather have my 74 Champ than a new Super Champ XD or Vibro Champ XD. I've played them both and my 74 SF Champ still comes out on top. That's why I use and Egnater Rebel 20 now. It can capture many of the tones I remember way back.

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Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 8:05 am
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63supro wrote:
Arjay, at least I know who speaks honestly here. :wink:


Aint that the truth. You'd expect us all to have a common goal and be big enough to hear/voice honest opinions without someone getting angry and taking your opinion on something as a personal afront to them.

All I've ever wanted is people to tell me when my playing or sound is bad. If I get a honest critique I can deal with it and improve. What I cant deal with is sycophantic people who tell you you sound great playing through a telephone speaker. There's no doubt some people here who hate my choice in amps/guitars/effects. It doesnt bother me, though I do value any honest input. If something is really amiss I want to know about it.

Personaly I think all online reviews are of no use whatsoever. At best your listening to someone elses playing, guitar and eq setup through a set of computer speakers.
It's never a acurate portrayal of how the amp sounds with you playing it, let alone how it pushes air.
I know it's not easy to get to the shop and try something for a good few people. I myself live in the back of beyond, England. The nearest decent new gear stockist to me is 70 miles away. Sometimes you just have to be patient and wait till you come across what your interested in.
Half the problem is todays microwave society. We want everything ten minutes ago. Makes me fond of the 80's when there was nothing any good around and you had to carefully pick through what you could find.

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Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 8:31 am
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I'm pretty lucky I guess. I have a Sam Ash that I could walk to if I wanted, a Guitar Center and Georges Music 10 minuets away and A bunch of shops in Philadelphia that's just a short drive away. Cintioli's is my favorite Mom & Pop shop. I buy small stuff from Sweetwater, great service and prices guitars and amps I never buy online. I need to see, hear and feel it before I buy it.

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Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 9:41 am
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Nicky hits it on the money (again) -- we as a society have become averse to patience and we all "want it yesterday". Such alacrity usually precludes any manner of due diligence when it comes to researching a potential purchase and products bought in haste often do not measure up to either expectation or perception.

As to gear reviews there isn't a single soul on this planet who's played every piece of musical equipment ever made. But in the sub-set microcosm that is Fender guitar amps there are a few of us here who do offer honest opinions based on decades of observation and personal experience. I've played thousands of Fender amps. I've repaired hundreds of them. And I've owned dozens of them. Hell, I own nearly a dozen of them right this moment -- and not all are "vintage" pieces. I cannot report on everything that works......but I can comment on those things I know which do not. If that makes me a "cork-sniffer" then so be it -- break out the stemware and start pouring.

I love Fender amps and I want each and every person who shares that interest to have a positive experience when they buy one. If my comments regarding "this" or "that" seem overly candid, that's the reason -- the only reason.

Arjay


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Post subject:
Posted: Tue May 25, 2010 10:36 am
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63supro wrote:
The young players today might start out with a Frontman 15 and then move up to a Blues Jr or a HRD amp. Seems very few go the DRRI route. Not enough bells and whistles I guess


There is a progression in a person's growth in music. Nobody automatically knows anything until they learn it. This is not personal to me, but I find it unfair and not in the spirit of this forum to rag on people's stuff. Young people get what they can afford or what their early growth leads them to. As experienced leaders, you can teach them and advise them, but your best advise is often unavailable to new guys. For instance, they can't afford a $1000 DRRI, so they take what they can get. Used is often not an option. The only one I've found in months sold for $1000.

I know a woman who is brutally frank, to the point of rudeness. If pressed, she says "Well, I'm just telling the truth."

Finally, do you remember when a young guy, maybe you, got a new car and excited took it to show it to everybody he knew? I'll bet nobody said the Corvette is a better car. Yours is cheap junk. Etc. True, but rude.

Your partners said "Wow, great car!" And it was, really.


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