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Post subject: My Blues Jr. experience.
Posted: Wed May 05, 2010 11:58 pm
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I don't get it..

I need someone to show me the light on this one. I bought one today at a pawn shop for $200. I hurt my back loading my DeVille last month, and when I saw this amp, I was hoping to at least get somewhat the sound of the DeVille in a smaller size.. Not happening.

First thing I did was A/B it with my older Studio 85, and the 85 just sounded better and had a more manageable eq. So then it was time to bust out the NOS preamp tubes. Let's see how it responds. First batch I put in was the same I use for my DeVille for recording which consists of Valvo, Amperex, GE. Sparkle with Bass.

Still wasn't very manageable. The Euro type preamp tubes really brought out the weird mid tones of the amp. Not it's strong point. Trebles were a little shrilly. So I dropped in some darker tubes. Telefunken lp, Sylvania jhs, GE lp. That's a freaking golden lineup. Strong, and darker to curb the mids and highs a little.

Finally it started sounding like it could hang with the SS 85. But only in one sense. It's not any "better" in my opinion. Just more open sounding. I wouldn't consider it a "sparkly" sound, but it can create some cool Classic Rock tones. The 85 leans toward more of a modern clean, and I still find it more manageable in the eq, and I still like the reverb of the 85 better.

So I'm thinking.. You know. I have some REALLY pimp tubes in this amp. Expensive ones that have never let me down (and still performed great). But seriously?? I have to do that to get a BJ up to par (or maybe better depending on the subjectivity of tone) with a Solid Stae 85?? I'm adjusting the eq and the knobs feel weak. I can wiggle them like they're fragile. I look inside at them and.. REALLY??? Those pots are embarrassing to look at. For real?? The SS even has better pots?

So right next to the BJ I have an Ampeg SS-70 amp as well. I plug into it and it kicks the Hell out of both amps without even trying. Sparkle, Bass, manageable eq, airy and bluesy, and with an adjustment, modern and crisp sounding.. I have a Fender tube amp next to it with pimp NOS tubes, and the Ampeg SS sounds more like a tube amp than the actual Fender tube amp does.

If I have to modify the heck out of this amp to get it to sound great, then what's the point? Why bother? I'm just not so much of a hobbyist I guess in that department. I don't wanna deal with having to mod the guts. I don't have the time for it, and why deal with tube issues if I don't have to. If it was worth it I would. I barely wanna deal with the DeVille, but it hasn't given me any problems yet (knocking on wood), and this BJ is nowhere near being able to sound like the DeVille.

I'm sorry but I just don't get it.. Maybe this amp was built with the intentions of modding by the buyer. I don't know. I wanted to like it better than I do.

Was I expecting too much out of it? I mean.. Is it so much to expect that in it's stock state, it sounds better, and has stronger parts than an earlier SS model?

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Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 12:10 am
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Well the amp is a 6BQ5/EL84 platform and no amount of modding or tweaking is gonna give it the "beef" or "punch" of something with 6L6s. A different speaker might make a more dramatic change in tone but that means yet more $$$. Frankly I've never understood the appeal of these amps -- I've played them in stores several times and they all invariably sound like a soul-less fizzy mess.

Arjay


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Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 3:49 am
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The blues Jr is a great amp IMHO, but its characteristics may not suit everyone's taste. So many people mod the Jr to try and make it something it was not intended to be. I feel bad that you do not care for the great amp you have on your hands, but I am guessing the type of music you gravitate to is not compatible with what the Jr. is capable of or designed for. For some, the amp is perfect. Others may find it completely useless for their needs. I LOVE my Tweed NOS BJ, but I play clean and at lower to moderate volumes - no effects, just my strat and the amp. Doesn't get any better than that to me.

By the way, the Jensen speaker in my tweed is VERY different sounding than the stock Eminence in the tolex version.... :wink:


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Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 4:05 am
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It was $200. New they're $400, but I'm sure you knew that. Economical Fender tube amp with reverb, 12" speaker and a master volume. Pretty darn good deal if you ask me. And it meets (just barely) airline carry on specs. If yours is older, which I'd guess it is, it may not have the more desirable ckt board as what they've used for the last handful of years.

At home I play through 2 DRRI's in //. But my drag around amp is a Bj NOS. I absolutely love this little dude. Gave $414 for it 2 yrs ago, brand new, not a blem. The NOS does have a different speaker than the Special Design by Fender (Eminence) than yours. Jensen C12N, the 50w version of the ceramic 100w Jensen Fender puts in the DRRI, the C12K. Other than the covering, the speaker is the only difference between the NOS and standard Bjs. I think they're ~$85.


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Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 8:09 am
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twosbrs wrote:
The blues Jr is a great amp IMHO, but its characteristics may not suit everyone's taste.


How true! When I bought my Blue Junior, I demoed it along with a Blues Deluxe Reissue, a Deluxe Reverb Reissue, and a Princeton Reverb Reissue. I went to the music store expecting to come home with a DRRI or PRRI, since they are of higher quality and built better, not to mention that the DRRI is a VERY popular amp. At lower volumes (which I normally play), I found that I didn't care for the DRRI or PRRI at all (too thin, plinky-sounding, and mid-scooped). The BDRI had the nicest, fullest clean tone of them all (to my ears), but I didn't need 40 watts since I've had a Hot Rod Deluxe in the past and knew how loud it was. So, I went for the Blues Junior which had the second nicest tone. Everyone hears things differently, so I guess that my ears prefer more mids. I do wish that it was built better!


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Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 9:29 am
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Shredd,

just curious. i think i remember you being one of the strong supporters of the Pro Jr. How would you stack that against the Ampeg and Studio 85? i know many people prefer PJ tone over the BJ.

fwiw, i have all JJ's in mine, Ragin Cajun spkr. (i know, almost every PJ owner did the same thing...so nothing new there). i like the upper mid presence they offer, tubes and spkr. i think the brown label stock spkr is unable to handle what JJ's dish out, i do recall some harshness at high levels with that one installed. heck, you probably remember my spkr inquiries earlier on.
definitely not "the fender" sound, but close. its got a bit of marshall in it i'd say. cant argue with that combo.

DISCLAIMER: I do not intend to make this be another PJ vs BJ thread. simply asking for opinion and comparison with amps stated in OP.


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Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 10:18 am
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twosbrs wrote:
The blues Jr is a great amp IMHO, but its characteristics may not suit everyone's taste. So many people mod the Jr to try and make it something it was not intended to be. I feel bad that you do not care for the great amp you have on your hands, but I am guessing the type of music you gravitate to is not compatible with what the Jr. is capable of or designed for. For some, the amp is perfect. Others may find it completely useless for their needs. I LOVE my Tweed NOS BJ, but I play clean and at lower to moderate volumes - no effects, just my strat and the amp. Doesn't get any better than that to me.

By the way, the Jensen speaker in my tweed is VERY different sounding than the stock Eminence in the tolex version.... :wink:


I guess I just have a different opinion on it. I think you need to modify it to have a more tolerable sound. And that being the case, I'm not seeing what's so great about it.

I play Reggae music which utilizes the clean channel more than anything else and typically uses Blues tones for the genre. So I don't think it's a case of style of music as much as it is what I would need it for, which is live gigs more than anything. I would love to have a nice smaller tube amp for gigging since most of the time our amps are mic'd. The amp doesn't sound BAD right now, but then I have to ask myself if it's worth dealing with a fragile tube amp over a Solid State that's just as good. We have a lot of shows coming up and I don't have the time to "pimp my ride".

I would also have to say that at lower levels, my Ampeg SS70, Roland JC-55 and Fender 85 are all better sounding amps than the BJ in their stock states. Just my opinion. I'm pretty sure I'll end up selling the BJ.

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Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 10:23 am
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Last edited by nikininja on Thu May 06, 2010 1:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 1:08 pm
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msvolpe wrote:
Shredd,

just curious. i think i remember you being one of the strong supporters of the Pro Jr. How would you stack that against the Ampeg and Studio 85? i know many people prefer PJ tone over the BJ.

fwiw, i have all JJ's in mine, Ragin Cajun spkr. (i know, almost every PJ owner did the same thing...so nothing new there). i like the upper mid presence they offer, tubes and spkr. i think the brown label stock spkr is unable to handle what JJ's dish out, i do recall some harshness at high levels with that one installed. heck, you probably remember my spkr inquiries earlier on.
definitely not "the fender" sound, but close. its got a bit of marshall in it i'd say. cant argue with that combo.

DISCLAIMER: I do not intend to make this be another PJ vs BJ thread. simply asking for opinion and comparison with amps stated in OP.


You must have someone else in mind. I have no experience with Pro Jr. There was a time when I thought I wanted one of the smaller Fender amps. I'm just not so sure anymore after testing this one out.

I think the Studio 85 is a nice amp. Not open like a tube amp, but I do like the sound coming out of it. It does retain a Fender sparkle, just a different kind, if that makes any sense. It can't get an open sound like a Fender Tube amp, but it's very clean and manageable. I don't think I'll ever willingly get rid of it.

The Ampeg SS70 is on a whole different planet. It's quickly becoming my favorite amp to use. The real test for me is going to be how it stacks up to my DeVille with NOS tubes. Now that's a challenge. I love both amps right now. I know this much, the Deville won't have a chance at beating the Ampeg in the distortion channel. Not even close. It has one of the best SS distortion channels I've ever heard come out of any SS Combo, and can hang with many tube amps I can think of. It's the main strong-point of the amp. The clean channel has a really touchy treble knob. You have to be careful with it. There's no possibly way to tolerate it all the way up. I'm pretty sure you would do ear damage. But so far, there hasn't been any sound I can't re-create with this amp to a respectable degree.. Not saying exactly, but usually comes very close, and in some cases spot on or better (more enhanced). Marshall, Fender, Roland, you name it, it has a way of doing all of them somehow.

That being said, I would be hard-pressed to believe the Ampeg can't hang with a Pro Jr. And I just don't know about the 85, but that would be irrelevant for me in my case. The Ampeg is far above the 85.

I will say this. If you ever get a chance to pick up an Ampeg SS70, don't hesitate. I found mine for $100. Best amp purchase I've ever made so far bang for the buck.

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Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 1:52 pm
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Retroverbial wrote:
Well the amp is a 6BQ5/EL84 platform and no amount of modding or tweaking is gonna give it the "beef" or "punch" of something with 6L6s. A different speaker might make a more dramatic change in tone but that means yet more $$$. Frankly I've never understood the appeal of these amps -- I've played them in stores several times and they all invariably sound like a soul-less fizzy mess.

Arjay


+1 I don't get it either. Why buy an amp you have to mod to make it sound mediocre at best? The classic Fender sound never came from a pair of EL84's.

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Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 4:27 pm
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I'm sorry, but what exactly did you expect for $200?

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Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 4:29 pm
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63supro wrote:
Retroverbial wrote:
Well the amp is a 6BQ5/EL84 platform and no amount of modding or tweaking is gonna give it the "beef" or "punch" of something with 6L6s. A different speaker might make a more dramatic change in tone but that means yet more $$$. Frankly I've never understood the appeal of these amps -- I've played them in stores several times and they all invariably sound like a soul-less fizzy mess.

Arjay


+1 I don't get it either. Why buy an amp you have to mod to make it sound mediocre at best? The classic Fender sound never came from a pair of EL84's.


+2 It's like the guys all over Youtube who take Champion 600's and then dump $300 worth of mods into it. For the cost of the amp plus the mods you could have gotten into a 5F1 clone.

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Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 4:58 pm
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The thing is their not a £200 amp, their £480 here new. You can buy a 100watt Marshall head for another £60. It beggars belief. The FM212(yes I know its SS) is a good deal cheaper too. Both sound significantly better, never mind offerings from the likes of Laney and Ashdown.

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Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 6:11 pm
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Powdered Toast Man wrote:
63supro wrote:
Retroverbial wrote:
Well the amp is a 6BQ5/EL84 platform and no amount of modding or tweaking is gonna give it the "beef" or "punch" of something with 6L6s. A different speaker might make a more dramatic change in tone but that means yet more $$$. Frankly I've never understood the appeal of these amps -- I've played them in stores several times and they all invariably sound like a soul-less fizzy mess.

Arjay


+1 I don't get it either. Why buy an amp you have to mod to make it sound mediocre at best? The classic Fender sound never came from a pair of EL84's.


+2 It's like the guys all over Youtube who take Champion 600's and then dump $300 worth of mods into it. For the cost of the amp plus the mods you could have gotten into a 5F1 clone.


I'm guessing that's what passes for "progress" these days, PTM.

There was an early period during my lifetime when I could merely walk into any well-stocked music store, write a check, and be playing a brand-new Fender amp at a gig that very same night -- no mods, no tube-tweaking, no speaker swaps, no nothing.

And you know what?

They sounded MIGHTY DARN GOOD!

Now those same amps today command five, ten, even twenty times what they cost when they were new.

And it's no mystery why.

Arjay


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Posted: Thu May 06, 2010 7:17 pm
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I had a Tweed BJ for almost a year and there were things that I liked and disliked about it, but as already stated, you can't expect it to be something it's not; it is what it is...

I sold it a few months ago and bought a Supro Sahara, and I certainly have no regrets. :D

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