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Post subject: $200 Budget, decisions decisions...
Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2010 9:22 am
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So here's the scoop... I need something lighter than my 65'RI Twin to lug around. I have $200 bucks to spend. One choice is the VibroChamp XD, the other, Frontman 65R. I know they are pretty different amps... I've played them both and I'm leaning toward the Frontman. I really prefer tubes but the effects on the Champ are weak, and the amp is only 5w. I host a jam night at a local bar and this thing probably won't cut it. On the upside, with no effects and just using the amp voices, I think it sounds better than the Frontman. The frontman really isn't a "practice amp" and gets pretty loud...plently loud for a gig I'm guessing but there's something about the lack of "feel" playing a solid state amp, and I really don't like the drive channel (which I really wouldn't end up using anyway) There's something about the Champ and all it's digital features which has we worried as well...more junk to break down. The Frontman is simple which I like. Am I overlooking anything? Anyone have comments or suggestions?


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Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2010 10:04 am
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I'd shop around for a pre-owned Fender Pro Jr.

Guys like Jeff Beck, Eric Clapton, Warren Haynes, etc... all have used PJs from time to time. :wink:

I have two, I found one for $200 on craigslist!

Jeff Beck's Tweed Pro Jr (on top of Marshalls - not used) from MSG show :

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Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2010 10:27 am
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They are great little amps... for the same reason the little Vibrochamp won't cut it, neither would the Pro Jr. I suspect. I need it to stay clean at volume and cut through a mix...which could be comprised of anything from a heavy handed drummer to a blasting sax.

I've been stewing on it all morning...I might just have to suck up some of my tone snobbery and throw down on the Frontman... Sure, it's solid state, but will the drunk monkeys at the bar notice the difference in tone? Will I even notice once we're jamming onstage and not critiquing it at home? It's WAY lighter than the Twin, has 65w, isn't full of digi-junk, and will probably out live me. and best of all it's pretty cheap. Sold. CG opens in 36 minutes... In an out before the morning metal militia begins.


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Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2010 10:49 am
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If you like the sound of the VCXD but need more power, look for a used but mint 15w Super Champ XD...should be right around $200.

Or, wait another month, sock away another $50 and buy the SCXD new. :)


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Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2010 12:55 pm
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If the club has a PA, a mic in front of any amp will make it sound good. But I see the point and its why our guitar player bought a Blues Jr. for playing live vs. his silverface champ.

If $200 is all you have, it can only get you so far. I'd wait and save up more for a better amp - buy once, cry once. You've already got a great amp with the Twin, but it's heavy. Here's possibly the best investment in gear I made for our band 5 years ago that can help with that:

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/sto ... ogId=10053

Handles a twin, 210lbs of speakers, etc. with ease. Big Ballon tires in the front make it possible to lug some stuff down a few steps if needed. Makes loading in and loading out of bars and clubs a snap, even if we're not able to park right next to the entrance.

Other solution:
http://www.audiopile.net/products/Cases ... page.shtml

These guys make great stuff. I get my mic cables and racks from them and the stuff is well made.

good luck!

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Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2010 1:00 pm
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I'd go with the Frontman. Lower end tube amps just aren't the way to go. IMO,They really don't hold up to serious gigging and won't provide the clean you need. Beck and Clapton have techs on hand as well as a lot of backup amps in case something goes wrong. Plus, do you really think the amps are stock? They both endorse Fender equipment. :wink:


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Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2010 1:52 pm
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I got the Frontman... I've been playing on it for a few hours now with a few different guitars and I think it was the right decision.

Having said that, it ain't no tube amp! But, surprisingly, I've been able to find a few very usable settings (one for each channel) with no additional effects. Adding delay, an octave pedal, and a tube screamer only sweetened the deal. I had to experiment with the tone and setting knobs, which are set very differently than on my Twin. And decided that the less sensitive imput (2) is more to my liking although it was suggested that it was best suited for instruments with active pickups.

It really boiled down to simplicity... the place I play at has a terrble PA so micing a little tube amp is a waste. It's far better to just plug in an amp there and play. The frontman has plenty of volume to handle the place and cut through...and for $200 it seems like a deal. Plus, it should be bulletproof with no tubes, the only thing that feels like it would break are the control knobs.

Biggest +'s: price, weight, output, simplicity
Biggest -'s: reverb isn't really to my liking, cheesy feeling control knobs with unusual (IMHO) value sweeps, a little more hum than I might have expected, not as responsive as a tube amp. *I'll be the first to agree that some of these gripes are just the nature of the beast. For $200, you can't expect a solid state amp with spring reverb to sound like a $1500 amp with tube reverb.


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Posted: Sat Mar 13, 2010 2:42 pm
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I think you made the right choice with a $200 budget. While it may not sound quite as good as the more expensive tube amps, I think against the inexpensive ones it will hold its own. I've heard a couple of these in the hands of capable players and I have to say they sound good. They have a very nice clean channel.


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Posted: Sun Mar 14, 2010 9:30 am
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JamGuy wrote:
I got the Frontman... I've been playing on it for a few hours now with a few different guitars and I think it was the right decision.

Having said that, it ain't no tube amp! But, surprisingly, I've been able to find a few very usable settings (one for each channel) with no additional effects. Adding delay, an octave pedal, and a tube screamer only sweetened the deal. I had to experiment with the tone and setting knobs, which are set very differently than on my Twin. And decided that the less sensitive imput (2) is more to my liking although it was suggested that it was best suited for instruments with active pickups.

It really boiled down to simplicity... the place I play at has a terrble PA so micing a little tube amp is a waste. It's far better to just plug in an amp there and play. The frontman has plenty of volume to handle the place and cut through...and for $200 it seems like a deal. Plus, it should be bulletproof with no tubes, the only thing that feels like it would break are the control knobs.

Biggest +'s: price, weight, output, simplicity
Biggest -'s: reverb isn't really to my liking, cheesy feeling control knobs with unusual (IMHO) value sweeps, a little more hum than I might have expected, not as responsive as a tube amp. *I'll be the first to agree that some of these gripes are just the nature of the beast. For $200, you can't expect a solid state amp with spring reverb to sound like a $1500 amp with tube reverb.


No, it ain't no tube amp. but the Champs aren't really "true" tube amps either, they have a bunch of digital effects and really aren't built for hard gigging. I think you made the right choice. I also think it will be way more reliable than a low end tube amp.

At least you have something to get you through. Save your money until you can get a more professionally built tube amp.

Good luck with your new amp! :wink:


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Posted: Sun Mar 14, 2010 10:58 am
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I would save your money, and get a better amp then them too. nothing like the fell of tubes and for 200 your not gonna get it


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Posted: Sun Mar 14, 2010 12:56 pm
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I'd still love a smaller tube amp like a DRRI or even a S.F. Princeton but for the gig I've got rolling right now the Frontman will work great. It will be nice not having to deal with or worry about tubes. I'm still finding some cool tones with it and am thinking of replacing(or at least experimenting with) the speaker. I've got a early 70's Wilder...the same kind found in some S.F. Fender's. I'm wondering if it might offer less high end, which this little amp seems to be full of.


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Posted: Sun Mar 14, 2010 2:36 pm
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http://www.tedweber.com/
765-452-1249

Call or email these guys. Tell them what you like your amp to do and they will recommend an excellent quality and great sounding speaker.

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Posted: Sun Mar 14, 2010 3:35 pm
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+1 on the Webers - they have a variety of tonal and price options that can help you out.

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Posted: Sun Mar 14, 2010 5:22 pm
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Just installed the Wilder speaker... sounds much warmer than the original stock speaker and the whole rig seems louder and even a little noisy as far as any hum. Didn't need the "louder" as this little amp roars already but overall it sounds great... did I just say that a solid state amp sounds great?
:shock: [url][URL=http://img696.imageshack.us/i/wilderspeakerfrontman.jpg/]Image[/url][/url]


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Posted: Sun Mar 14, 2010 5:28 pm
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I may not have my facts right...can't seem to find any info on these being stock in any Fender amp. They were produced from 65-71 though...still doing some research.


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