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Post subject: Black Plates
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 9:24 am
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I was thinking about swapping the valves in my hot rod deville, and i quite like the look of the old RCA 6L6GC "black plate," valves. But even though they are not made anymore, you can still get them. But electro harmonix do a re-issue of them, i was thinking about them perhaps.

What do you guys think?

Are they any good? How do they sound?


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Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 9:30 am
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It's bad enough that people keep buying guitars because of the way they look...

... don't start buying tubes that way.

Buy Winged "C"'s:

http://thetubestore.com/6l6gc.html

Or JJ/Teslas:

http://www.thevintagesound.com/store/jj ... c-p-9.html

And be happy. That Mike Matthews junk isn't worth throwing away, IMO. I used to run a tweed Princeton modified to run 6L6 tubes, and the Winged "C"s were awesome.


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Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 10:20 am
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The rca's are awesome tubes, and would most likely last longer than modern tubes depending on who they're from.

But I'm gonna have to agree with Slap Chop. I had =C= 6l6's in my old Mesa DR and they were my favorites for the amp. The have a nice smooth response which should go well with your Fender.

Unless you're experienced and knowledgeable with NOS tubes, you should probably steer clear of them when it comes to power tubes. Preamp tubes are a different story. Good GE, RCA, Silvania etc. 12ax7's really do wonders for the sound of your amp. But even then, it takes some research. The differences in Brands, size of the plates, and types can be pretty extensive. Put an odd cocktail in your amp in the wrong slots, and it won't sound very good.

If you're inexperienced with NOS tubes, stick with modern tubes until you do your research. Otherwise it can be a costly adventure.

By the way, the fact that a tube has black plates is virtually meaningless to their performance as compared to grey plates. So don't be fooled into thinking that black plate tubes are something extra special.

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Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 10:30 am
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Cool, however the winged Cs are apprently great for cleans but how are they for alot of gains.

I do use mostly cleans, but i occasionally use LOTs of distortion, so id like to them to be that california creamy distortion

Would the winged Cs be able to handle such versatility?


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Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 12:02 pm
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Yep. I had 'em in my Mesa Dual Rec. when I was playing hard-core. They shine in any situation.

But, for the record, power tubes aren't responsible for a whole lotta tone in an amplifier. It's the preamp tubes that shape the tones. When it comes to amplifiers, the dynamite is in the small packages. I find that a lot of times people have the concept backward.

The =C= 6l6's have a nice healthy balance in not having too much drag in the attack of the strings, and not too bold.

We're actually kind of similar in what we like to hear out of our amps. I felt like I wanted to darken up the distortion just a little without losing any beef in the gain. And I wanted to add some color to the bass tones. My HRDV seemed a litte high-strung. So my preamp section looks like this:

V1- Sylvania 12ax7 short-plate
V2- GE 12ax7a long-plate
V3- RCA 7025

So now it has a nice colorful clean channel with a rich tone in the bass, and the distortion is very smooth and defined.

I found that with this amp I had to do the opposite of what I needed to do with my Mesa. My Mesa had a truck-load of Bass and I had to tame it and bring out the highs. My Fender was high-strung in treble, and I had to tame those highs and bring out the richness of the bass. With a Fender, you're never gonna have "not enough treble". Just like with a Mesa, you're never gonna have "not enough bass". Fender has alway been known to have glassy highs and plenty of it in the treble eq. Mesas have always been known to have huge thick bass and plenty of it as well.. So sometimes it's necessary to try to find a middle ground to have more of an option in the amp's eq settings where they seem to be deficient to your taste.

The power tubes really aren't the way to go to shape your tone. You'll be pulling your hair out if you try to go that rout for that purpose.

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Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 12:33 pm
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HDRV? What amps that? some of these abbreviations are so confusing.

Id love to get rid of all the stock tubes since the're just average, would you recomend that preamp configuration for a Hot Rod Deville 212?


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Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 1:09 pm
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That was a typo. I have a Hot Rod DeVille 4x10.

I personally always recommend NOS 12ax7s. I do think you'd like that setup. Just make sure if you get them from ebay, that you get them from people who are in the business of selling them. You'll see them on there.

They'll list the test numbers, and usually have a lot more for sale. Steer clear of "estate sale" listings, or people who don't appear to know what they have. And always buy from someone who offers a return policy. Don't go for the "as is" listings.

Since it's rare for people to fake GE, Sylvania, and RCA 7025s, I wouldn't worry about that vey much. Generally people want to fake the more high dollar collectables. If you have any questions about whether a listing is legit, post a link here and I can identify what it is.

Typically NOS tubes have different labels on them. In other words if a listing says RCA 7025, and it says Realistic Lifetime on the tube, that's no big deal. The mica spacers inside of the tube should look cut off on the sides and there should be an acid etching with 7025 inside of an octagon. I know how to identify tubes by the guts, codes, and characteristics. That's why I said there's some research in order when buying NOS tubes.

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Post subject:
Posted: Tue Aug 18, 2009 1:16 pm
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ah, thank you. you probably just saved me alot of time, your too kind.


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