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Post subject: Replacing Speakers on Solid State Amp?
Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2009 8:41 pm
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Aspiring Musician
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hello, this is a long post and i deeply appreciate anyone reading through it and answering any questions included towards the end. i have many questions and im sure you all have been in my place looking for help at one time.

i currently use a fender FM212 for gigging, which is of course solid state. clean channel ain't bad, and is often marked as the high point on this amp. i have questions regarding upgrading speakers, but first some background info. if you need it:

i use a boss bd-2 blues driver into fm212 clean channel pretty much at all times. i adjust volume and tone knobs to adjust amount of gain i need (switching between rhythm and lead). i use a standard strat almost always

i have noticed that as i increase guitar volume, the tone seems to get a bit shrill and fizzy. i can see why people would label this as sterile sounding. i have remedied it a bit by simply lowering treble and using more bass. i also modded the bd-2 with more bass and different clipping for slightly smoother drive. i also keep the pedal level low so it is not driving the preamp, and then use the amp volume as a master. i mean its not terrible sounding, but there is certainly room for improvement. it could definitely be more full and round sounding. yes, its not tube, i realize that people are saying that right now, but i am tight on cash and im trying to make my gear work for me without breaking the bank.

QUESTION SECTION: (please be straightforward and honest. only unbiased opinions are helpful. please dont just go on a rant about how awesome tubes are. thanks)

first i was wondering if it would even be worthwhile to upgrade speakers on the fm212 since it is solid state. what do you think? would it help to bring more life to my tone, or is it truly a waste?

regarding the "shrill, fizzy" effect when using drive from the bd-2, is it strictly caused by the solid state preamp, or could the stock speakers also have something to do with this? would better speakers respond differently to my overdrive and relieve that problem?

i like the traditional "fender" tone, bright and clear, yet with healthy sounding bass. i want a clear and articulate yet full and round tone. i play blues, jazz, and rock. i usually like to play with low gain. im not big with higher gain amounts. but sometimes i need a bit more if playing rock.
are there particular types or brands you might recommend?

if anyone knows this...regarding the "Special Design" 12" speakers used on some FM212 models...are they made by Eminence, or something else? i was just curious

thank you to those who have read this post with an open mind and have helped any way possible. it is deeply appreciated


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Post subject:
Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 9:26 am
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Aspiring Musician
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My opinion, yes a speaker change could help you find the tone you like better. But it's not that easy, a speaker does have to be matched to the amps voice somewhat. I put a celestion tube 10 in my peavey SS practice amp. The tube 10 is designed to work with tube amps. The original speaker was blown were it sounded good distorted but would not clean up. It had fizz at the cleanest of settings. At first I was disappointed with the tube 10 speaker. While it did clean up, it just did not sound right. Working with the eq, and finding some strange eq settings I was able to get a great tone with it. The setting I used with the old speaker sounded terrible with the new. Plugging straight into the amp, it sounded ok, but I just use the amp as a slave for my 2101, and it sounded a mess. Very fizzy under distortion and no bass response. I corrected it by cranking the bass up to about 6-8 and taking all the amps mid and highs almost completely out as well as keeping the pre gain and way down and no saturtation. As weird as this seems, it made the digitech sound like it does through a normal power amp. After researching the tone controls on the Old Peavey, I found that there tone knobs/stack on that amp are not typical and flattening the tone knobs in the middle did not work like it does on other amps. Adding any high's or mids above 2 just made this fizzy distortion when using my 2101. The new settings removed the nasty SS fizz I was getting. In addition, I had to keep the 2101's output level very low, or it clipped the input stage of the peavey, which again sounded fizzy. In the end, I waas able to tweak out some great tones at practice levels, but its probably not an ideal setup

Driving the front end of a SS amp is not as satisfactory as doing it to a tube amp. Your blues driver is probably designed to drive a tube preamp into clipping which sounds harsh on SS amps. A speaker may help, but will not eliminate the problem. However, I do not think that Fender speakers break up that well anyway, they are designed to preserve that clean tone into high volumes in general. They can sound harsh and sterile in distortion. There is a reason that Marshall and Mesa amps are the common back drop for Rock music and they both use celestion speakers in their higher end stuff

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Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 9:33 am
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Check out Scumback speakers. They are Pre-Rola Celestion clones and sound fabulous in either Tube or Solid State amps. I recommend the Big Mike Mix, ask Jim about it.

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Post subject:
Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 9:38 am
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CAFeathers wrote:
Check out Scumback speakers. They are Pre-Rola Celestion clones and sound fabulous in either Tube or Solid State amps. I recommend the Big Mike Mix, ask Jim about it.


When did Rola take over Celestion? I now wonder if mine are Pre-Rola. My marshall cab is a 1991 or 92.

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3. 2008 Am Std Strat in 3 tone sunburst


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Post subject:
Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 9:40 am
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firstrat wrote:
CAFeathers wrote:
Check out Scumback speakers. They are Pre-Rola Celestion clones and sound fabulous in either Tube or Solid State amps. I recommend the Big Mike Mix, ask Jim about it.


When did Rola take over Celestion? I now wonder if mine are Pre-Rola. My marshall cab is a 1991 or 92.


Pre-Rola Celestions are from the 60's-70's.

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Post subject:
Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 9:45 am
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Ohh ok. Celestion has still been making some great speakers post-rola imho, what would be the benefit of buying a pre-rola clone? Price? Tone (Which is subjective)?

I have had Celestion gt-75's, V30's and a tube 10 and loved them all

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1. mid 70's Ventura MIJ Gibson l6-s clone (Pre-lawsuit) in Black with Rosewood FB and EMG 81 BR/ 85 Neck
2. ESP KH2 Neck Thru
3. 2008 Am Std Strat in 3 tone sunburst


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Post subject:
Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 9:52 am
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Rock Star
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Yes, Celestion still makes some excellent speakers. Pre-Rola Celestions were the cream of the crop and often one speaker from that era will sell for well over $1,000.00!!!!
I had the chance to do a side by side comparison of Pre-Rola Celestions and Scumbacks. The Scumbacks won hands down.

If you go to the Scumback Speaker page there are sound clips of them being used in different setups.

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Post subject:
Posted: Fri Apr 03, 2009 10:07 am
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http://www.scumbackspeakers.com/index.html

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I didn't Lose my mind, I traded it for this guitar.


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