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Post subject: Re: ToneMaster Twin Reverb?!
Posted: Sun Sep 08, 2019 2:48 pm
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Back to the Sunnybrook Farm for you, Rebecca.

Leo did not scrimp on components -- pretty much everything in a vintage Fender amp was mil-spec. Allen-Bradley resistors, Astron and Mallory caps, Schumacher transformers, Carling switches, Switchcraft jacks, Amphenol sockets, and the same tubes the military was buying to get the SR-71 off the ground and put a man on the moon. True, he often diddled with a circuit design right on the production line but nothing was ever shipped from Fullerton that didn't meet his expectations and specifications. And every one of those surviving amps is now considered a near-priceless work of art.

You like the contemporary Fender trash?

Fine, buy it. Then three or four years later, buy another (because the first one broke and there's nobody around that's willing or able to repair it). Repeat ad nauseum.

Meanwhile, I'll just continue to play my '64 Vibroverb......

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: ToneMaster Twin Reverb?!
Posted: Sun Sep 08, 2019 3:20 pm
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CB91710 wrote:
T2Stratman wrote:
Didn't they learn anything from the last time they tried a Solid State Twin reverb? You can make em look like their tube brothers but it doesn't change whats inside!

:lol:

T2

You would think they would have learned, but then they did it again with the Stage Lead 212, which actually has a decent clean channel. Maybe that gave them the idea to try again?


CB yeah I remember those, and yes not bad SS amps. But I was referring to the Fender SS amps that they gave the same names to as thier tube line of the day. Calling a SS amp a Deluxe Reverb, Twin Reverb, etc., and making it look nearly identical is well just a marketing scheme.

T2

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Post subject: Re: ToneMaster Twin Reverb?!
Posted: Mon Sep 09, 2019 1:53 pm
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I've seen the inside of enough vintage Fender amps to know there was plenty of creative work going on and standardization was so-so. As far as mil-spec that's a meaningless term as plenty of "mil-spec" components are of marginal quality. It's a difference without a distinction. Lots of Fender tube amps from the "golden era" came off the line sounding like crap. They certainly could be made right in many cases, but they usually got shipped out as is. So you don't like modern Fender stuff, don't use it. I've got old stuff, I've got new stuff. I use what works well and sounds good. When I see working pros who are very good using modern Fender gear there's a reason. The pros I know use it because they like it and these are people without endorsement deals. But please go ahead and denigrate every single human who likes any modern Fender product. It clarifies exactly where you're coming from.


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Post subject: Re: ToneMaster Twin Reverb?!
Posted: Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:16 pm
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HooDooDude wrote:
When I see working pros who are very good using modern Fender gear there's a reason.

Yeah.

The event's promoter agreed to provide the backline then subsequently skimmed every nickel off that budget that he could, leaving just enough cash to rent a couple of Hot Rod Disgraces and Blues Jerkoffs.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: ToneMaster Twin Reverb?!
Posted: Mon Sep 09, 2019 3:53 pm
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LOL

Sometimes you take it just the eensy-weensy-teensiest little bit too far.

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Post subject: Re: ToneMaster Twin Reverb?!
Posted: Tue Sep 10, 2019 8:20 pm
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funny how times have changed. i'm old enough to remember repair shops that fixed your toaster-or electric razor-or even transistor radio. nowadays, you just throw them away and buy a new one. that 40" flatscreen you bought a few years ago is not working? just go get a new one, with likely a bigger screen and nicer picture for the same amount of money. is this where the amp world is heading? my 71 blackfaced twin and allen accomplice junior are fantastic amps, and they should last a long time.

i sell appliances for a living. first customer comes in, and washing machine is not working after 8 years of use. they don't want to fix it, and are ready for a new one-no complaints. the next customer complains because their washer only lasted 10 years.

the choice is yours on what to do with the new technology. i guess time will tell if it's a success.


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Post subject: Re: ToneMaster Twin Reverb?!
Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 7:02 am
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This whole thing where anybody that uses modern gear is tagged an idiot by one malcontent cracks me up. I remember seeing Duke Robillard live using a 4 channel solid state Peavey PA head into a 2 x 12 cabinet and him sounding fabulous. It is the artist that makes the gear sound good. If in your mind sounding good requires only vintage fairy dust you need to work on technique. Spent lots of hours in small dives in New Orleans and heard lots of guys playing Peavey Bandits that sounded incredible. Old Fender amps are definitely cool. But they're a pain in the $@! to haul around it you gig a lot. They can be heavy, finicky in some cases, expensive to re-tube with vintage tubes, and in some cases too valuable to take outside the studio. So people look for alternatives.


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Post subject: Re: ToneMaster Twin Reverb?!
Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 7:38 am
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So I just ran one of these Tone Master Twins through its paces. It delivers exactly as promised. It sounds like and old Twin, not a reissue. It has a broken in speaker sound and that sweet Twin tone from old vintage tubes. The reverb is perfect, the tremolo is great. And there are no odd hums, hisses, or clicks to hunt down. Best of all you can turn down the power and crank the preamp to get that great Twin breakup at volume levels that will be acceptable to all humanity. I've owned everything from a tweed Harvards/Vibrolux to mid-60's Twins/Deluxes/Vibrolux, brown Concert, even owned one of the holy grail 4 x 10 Matchless DC/30's. This amp holds its own. It's a great state of the art modeler in terms of doing one groups of things extremely well. Some folks want exactly that.


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Post subject: Re: ToneMaster Twin Reverb?!
Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 8:25 am
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HooDooDude wrote:
It's a great state of the art modeler in terms of doing one groups of things extremely well.

The proof of that will be how it's doing ten or fifteen years down the road (assuming it's not six feet under in some landfill).

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: ToneMaster Twin Reverb?!
Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:19 am
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So I assume you normally wait 10 to 15 years before purchasing any new product? Or is it that you want to find something to criticize but this is your last gasp? So far on this topic you make a lot of noise but not much sense.


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Post subject: Re: ToneMaster Twin Reverb?!
Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:24 am
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You own this whine-o-rama so do as you will, snowflake.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: ToneMaster Twin Reverb?!
Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 1:28 pm
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You really oughta think about some vocabulary building exercises. Getting your terminology from political imbeciles will only make folks think you're one as well.


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Post subject: Re: ToneMaster Twin Reverb?!
Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:14 pm
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HooDooDude wrote:
So I just ran one of these Tone Master Twins through its paces. It delivers exactly as promised. It sounds like and old Twin, not a reissue. It has a broken in speaker sound and that sweet Twin tone from old vintage tubes. The reverb is perfect, the tremolo is great. And there are no odd hums, hisses, or clicks to hunt down. Best of all you can turn down the power and crank the preamp to get that great Twin breakup at volume levels that will be acceptable to all humanity. I've owned everything from a tweed Harvards/Vibrolux to mid-60's Twins/Deluxes/Vibrolux, brown Concert, even owned one of the holy grail 4 x 10 Matchless DC/30's. This amp holds its own. It's a great state of the art modeler in terms of doing one groups of things extremely well. Some folks want exactly that.


Ok, so what will it sound like after the speaker actually breaks in?

Twin breakup? Since when has a Twin had breakup?

Don't get me wrong, I'm in favor of new offerings, but given the history of Fender, particularly Fuse software, I'm not convinced.

As far as I'm concerned, the jury is out for about 10 years.

Certainly, a touring musician can afford a new amp. If he has to replace it down the road he can expense it.

But let's face it, given the cost, I'm more likely to buy a vintage amp rather than something modern that I won't be able to find parts for or a schematic 9 or 10 years from now. Hell, I'll be happy to still be alive 10 years from now. But to find parts available for any product that Fender makes today 10 years from now? I'm not holding my breath, mostly because I'll probably be taking my dirt nap. But for my heirs, they'll have something that is still valuable. I could sell it, and leave them something more liquid than a vintage Fender amp or instrument, but I'd rather they have something that might encourage them to learn how to play. Stupid, I know, but I'll be leaving them more than that.


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Post subject: Re: ToneMaster Twin Reverb?!
Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:26 pm
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You check out the topic of Twin breakup as it is a well known sound and a very good one. It's just that nobody can stand to be anywhere near it when a real tube Twin is breaking up. But it is a great sound.

I can't argue that the jury is still out for you for a decade. Me, I've got a gig this weekend and this amp will be a dream come true for that. I've owned vintage and that's all well and fine. But I like the sound of a Twin but don't want the weight and finickiness of a vintage tube amp. They can always be sorted out, of course. But 55 year old products need care and feeding. I've owned lots of them over the years. They can be inconsistent, cantankerous, and to get the best performance you need to use NOS tubes that are increasingly difficult to source. I don't want to sit around and admire my museum piece. I have to go out and gig and need a reliable good sounding tool that gets me the tone and character of a mid-60's Fender tube amp. So it works for me. Maybe not for you. But neither one of us is crazy or illogical.


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Post subject: Re: ToneMaster Twin Reverb?!
Posted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 8:41 pm
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HooDooDude wrote:
You really oughta think about some vocabulary building exercises. Getting your terminology from political imbeciles will only make folks think you're one as well.

HooDoo, we are all friends here and you're not getting off to a good start. Let's drop it and move on. Peace and have fun. This is a great bunch of people.

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