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Post subject: Re: Some Hot Rod Series amps Made in China?
Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 9:42 pm
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Yes, we certainly don't mind some healthy sparring here and there, particularly when there's a potential for good factual info to be shared as a result of said sparring ... but there's really never a need to take conversations to a mudslinging personal-attack level.

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Post subject: Re: Some Hot Rod Series amps Made in China?
Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2016 1:16 am
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I guess this wasn't a "tongue-in-cheek" thing, after all? :D


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Post subject: Re: Some Hot Rod Series amps Made in China?
Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2016 10:54 am
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Well, my tongue is firmly in cheek.
But I'm still trying to recover from that stiletto red type font.
Could you pass me some of that white out to staunch the flow?


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Post subject: Re: Some Hot Rod Series amps Made in China?
Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2016 4:06 pm
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I know this thread is supposed to die. Thanks to The Fender Forum admin, and thanks to all the forum members who make this a great place. Kind of got off track.

I just wanted to give TimsAudio some support. You don't deserve any red-font criticism. I think your very knowledgeable in electronics (and others here too) and really like all your posts. You always have the tech- technical side which converts me. That post about the conductive glue pen got me going. Thanks for the greats posts!


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Post subject: Re: Some Hot Rod Series amps Made in China?
Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2016 4:39 pm
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jackhammer wrote:


I just wanted to give TimsAudio some support. You don't deserve any red-font criticism. I think your very knowledgeable in electronics (and others here too) and really like all your posts. You always have the tech- technical side which converts me. That post about the conductive glue pen got me going. Thanks for the greats posts!



+1000


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Post subject: Re: Some Hot Rod Series amps Made in China?
Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2016 5:25 pm
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Yep TimsAudio was attacked for no reason at all, when he tried to placate and extend the Olive Branch he got an undeserved kick in guts for it. I started this thread so I'll take responsibility for that but it's a shame such an inappropriate and unbalanced anger response was triggered by a simple statement of fact and an enquiry as to whether that fact was also news to other members as it was to me.



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Post subject: Re: Some Hot Rod Series amps Made in China?
Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2016 9:38 pm
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Now Snowy, you are blameless for asking a perfectly good question.
The first rude response was uncalled for, The second, I was baiting him to continue the conversation.
It takes two to fight and I was baiting a $#&!@*. So I got flamed again. Big deal. His red fonts don't express anything beyond his own anger. These are dominance displays, similar to a 3-year olds tantrum or a bosses pointless tirade. The point of the display is simply to impress pecking order dominance. That doesn't work very well on the internet.
Red fonts, cuss words, and tirades don't translate into dominance when they are only bits of digital fluff. Like Sarah said to David Bowie in the Labyrinth,"You have no power over me".
So go ahead and charge up your tweaky little $#&!@* and blast away. Just mind the terms of use of this site.
I used to argue with my aunt n uncle back in Missouri about Vietnam, the Draft, Nixon, John Birchers and all that stuff. It was fun honing our word skills, but if we got too outta hand, uncle would cut off the 3.2 beer he bought us. So we learned how to argue just enough not to get cut off. It was good training. Most folks don't really like to argue and just get mad. I really enjoy a good contest of ideas without the name-calling.
So stand back boys, I think I'm gonna throw my line back in and see if I don't pull up this dragon again.. Will he be talking or flaming? Ya think we can tame him?


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Post subject: Re: Some Hot Rod Series amps Made in China?
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2016 8:47 am
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Post subject: Re: Some Hot Rod Series amps Made in China?
Posted: Thu Dec 15, 2016 9:42 am
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BMW-KTM wrote:
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I'm with you, see how it unfolds
mud


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Post subject: Re: Some Hot Rod Series amps Made in China?
Posted: Wed Dec 28, 2016 10:58 pm
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I once had a Super Champ XD and the Transformer had a big sticker that said "Made In Tawaiin"


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Post subject: Re: Some Hot Rod Series amps Made in China?
Posted: Thu Dec 29, 2016 4:30 am
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Ryan41018 wrote:
I once had a Super Champ XD and the Transformer had a big sticker that said "Made In Tawaiin"

"Tawaiin" is correct spelling in Norfuk/Pitkern, the language of Norfolk and Pitcairn. (Not kidding.)
I doubt either has the industry to create fake transformers.


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Post subject: Re: Some Hot Rod Series amps Made in China?
Posted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 2:15 pm
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Just curious, but if the transformers are made in China, and the caps and resistors are made in China, and the pots, switches, and jacks are made in China, and the speakers are made in China, then does it made much difference which country final assembly is completed in?

And it's not that the Chinese can't or won't build equal spec, equal quality components than anywhere else in the world. It's that there has been systematic cost cutting going on in these supplied components for a long time now. Anyone who has worked on Fender amps has seen first hand what I'm talking about. Capacitor leads that bend like wet spaghetti. Switch solder tabs that are paper thin. Formerly made in America brand names and components like Illinois Capacitor and Schumacher transformers that have moved their production overseas to save money - and with those moves all of those tried and true construction methods are lost. We have transformers that are potted with plastic epoxy instead of resin. Why is that a big deal? Because the epoxy method is done in minutes versus hours - meaning they're prone to voids and air bubbles. These surface as problems down the road. Same with caps and resistors rated for just enough life to get the amp through the warranty period.

Do these problems show up immediately in the tone of the amp? Absolutely not! But sure your HRD amp sounds just as good as a classic Fender today, what about 5 years from now? Will it sound as good when all the cap values have drifted way off their original spec and you cook your output transformer when the screen grid resistors finally blow? Do 100% of the amps out there fail? Absolutely not! But it's the reliability and longevity that are the issues most of us have with these cost cutting moves.

Problem is that these import components are not unique to the HRD or import lines. You'll find all the same components in all the Fender USA amp lines as well. And this isn't a phenomenon unique to Fender either. Talk to any amp tech and they'll tell you this garbage is an epidemic across many popular amp manufacturers.

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Post subject: Re: Some Hot Rod Series amps Made in China?
Posted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 3:34 pm
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You are absolutely correct, PTM.

And (I'm sad to report) many of those same sleazy components can be found within the amps produced by the so-called "boutique" builders. It seems as though crappy parts are near-impossible to avoid now.

:(

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: Some Hot Rod Series amps Made in China?
Posted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 3:36 pm
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Powdered Toast Man wrote:
Just curious, but if the transformers are made in China, and the caps and resistors are made in China, and the pots, switches, and jacks are made in China, and the speakers are made in China, then does it made much difference which country final assembly is completed in?


Well as an Aussie I may not be qualified to comment but I'll say this much, I guess the difference for US citizens is that you have an American Company that chooses to employ workers in another country instead of in it's own backyard. That makes a BIG difference to the US workers who no longer have a paycheck.


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Post subject: Re: Some Hot Rod Series amps Made in China?
Posted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 4:39 pm
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No457 Snowy wrote:
Powdered Toast Man wrote:
Just curious, but if the transformers are made in China, and the caps and resistors are made in China, and the pots, switches, and jacks are made in China, and the speakers are made in China, then does it made much difference which country final assembly is completed in?


Well as an Aussie I may not be qualified to comment but I'll say this much, I guess the difference for US citizens is that you have an American Company that chooses to employ workers in another country instead of in it's own backyard. That makes a BIG difference to the US workers who no longer have a paycheck.


Hey man, I totally agree with you on that point. But the discussion seemed to be around perceived quality so that's more what I was speaking to. But yes, I believe in supporting your economy by buying products from companies that employ people in your community (where possible).

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