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Post subject: Re: Not much on Vibroking-king
Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2016 2:33 pm
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The first time I saw Johnny Lang in 98(looked back at ticket stubs) was the first time I ever saw a Vibroking. He had a couple of them with ext cabs. It was at the House of Blues in New Orleans. We always like to go early and check out the stage setup. I really had no idea what I was in for and I'll never forget that awesome tone!


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Post subject: Re: Not much on Vibroking-king
Posted: Thu Jul 28, 2016 9:44 am
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Robert Cray used a V-K for many years, before switching to Matchless.


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Post subject: Re: Not much on Vibroking-king
Posted: Sun Jul 31, 2016 9:47 am
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I've got one and I like it a lot. Except it's been to two different techs for the ticking tremolo. One tech was the local Fender authorized repair shop. They couldn't cure the ticking and did a mod to try and lower the gain threshold enough to make the ticking less audible. All it really did was make the intensity knob not work until it was up to 6. The second tech was my personal tech and he undid the first mod but quoted me $200-$300 to cure the problem because he'd have to order a bunch of parts and build a new LDR bug from scratch (and have to do some experimentation to find the right components). The other option was to rip out the optical based trem and have him build a tube bias trem circuit from scratch. I didn't feel like going $300 into an amp that's still under warranty so I declined.

So, I'll use a tremolo pedal if I feel the need. It's just irritating to have a $4000 amp with something that doesn't work right and a Fender warranty service centre that's incapable of fixing it.

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Post subject: Re: Not much on Vibroking-king
Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2016 10:57 am
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Reverse the mod.
VibroKings do not normally tick.
Once you have the mod reversed, look for yourself to see if you can spot any wires that may have shifted position and are running too close to the the tremolo circuit.
If you're not comfortable doing that then have a tech look at it.
Not the same tech, he's an idiot.
I have had that exact same issue with a few Fender amps from the Black and Silver eras.
It was a huge mystery the first time I encountered it.
Took that first amp to several techs who found nothing and charged me for time spent.
I was into the repair of that amp for about $250 and still had the problem.
Then I discovered Lindsay at Edmonton Audio Works.
He is an amp magician compared to the other techs in town.
He knew exactly what I meant and fixed it in 30 seconds with a couple of zip-ties and charged me nothing.
I realise the VK is not the same circuit as those old amps but I'm betting the culprit is still the same thing.
It can't hurt to explore the option, anyway.
Even if the proximity thing is not the answer, that mod should be reversed.
Changing the design of an amp is not a fix.
It's like lopping off your head because you have a headache.
Techs who advocate castrating an amp because they can't figure it out should not be in business.

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Post subject: Re: Not much on Vibroking-king
Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2016 2:49 pm
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BMW-KTM wrote:
Reverse the mod.
VibroKings do not normally tick.
Once you have the mod reversed, look for yourself to see if you can spot any wires that may have shifted position and are running too close to the the tremolo circuit.
If you're not comfortable doing that then have a tech look at it.
Not the same tech, he's an idiot.
I have had that exact same issue with a few Fender amps from the Black and Silver eras.
It was a huge mystery the first time I encountered it.
Took that first amp to several techs who found nothing and charged me for time spent.
I was into the repair of that amp for about $250 and still had the problem.
Then I discovered Lindsay at Edmonton Audio Works.
He is an amp magician compared to the other techs in town.
He knew exactly what I meant and fixed it in 30 seconds with a couple of zip-ties and charged me nothing.
I realise the VK is not the same circuit as those old amps but I'm betting the culprit is still the same thing.
It can't hurt to explore the option, anyway.
Even if the proximity thing is not the answer, that mod should be reversed.
Changing the design of an amp is not a fix.
It's like lopping off your head because you have a headache.
Techs who advocate castrating an amp because they can't figure it out should not be in business.



I agree with you but it's been to two different techs (one Fender authorized and the other my personal tech). My tech is very skilled and repairs, rebuilds, and builds all kinds of amps. He can do it, however the VK circuit design has challenges such that the "classic" fixes are not effective. He even had a 90's VK from another customer in his shop at the same time and he compared the two. The fix of simply moving the LDR leads further from the neon bulb doesn't work now because at some point Fender changed the design from a single LDR to a dual LRD bug.

He CAN fix it by rebuilding the LDR bug however the cost for that is high because Fender will not sell parts for it which means he would have to build a bug from scratch and source a bunch of parts and do a bit of trial and error.

I can't see how Fender QC could have shipped the amp without noticing the tick so they either didn't do their job, or shipped it knowing the issue was there and isn't fixable.

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Post subject: Re: Not much on Vibroking-king
Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2016 3:36 pm
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I think the cost of a bug component is sounding over rated. Perhaps the gentleman is charging labor cost.
Add on the original issue, the ticking repair.

Never built one myself but someone else here on the forum was talking about it, he could do it.
http://www.mojotone.com/amp-parts/Fende ... h=Switches

Wait, what about Fender parts?
Your saying Fender does not sell any replacement parts to support their products, such as the Vibroking Amp?
Not sure how many other Fender amps have the bug.


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Post subject: Re: Not much on Vibroking-king
Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2016 4:05 pm
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jackhammer wrote:
Not sure how many other Fender amps have the bug.


All blackface and silverface tremolo-equipped Fenders use the opto-isolator system except for the Vibro Champ, Bronco, Princeton, and Princeton Reverb (these amps employ a bias-modulating circuit at the output stage). The blackface re-issues used to use the trem bug but it has since been supplanted by a digital oscillator (it doesn't address the "tick" issue but it does make these amps legally fit for European markets). Fender has issued a number of technical service bulletins (TSB's) over the years that purported to eliminate tremolo problems, usually by adding a suppressor cap and *carefully* re-positioning the wires in and around the trem circuit.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: Not much on Vibroking-king
Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2016 6:42 pm
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Powdered Toast Man wrote:
I've got one and I like it a lot. Except it's been to two different techs for the ticking tremolo. One tech was the local Fender authorized repair shop. They couldn't cure the ticking and did a mod to try and lower the gain threshold enough to make the ticking less audible. All it really did was make the intensity knob not work until it was up to 6. The second tech was my personal tech and he undid the first mod but quoted me $200-$300 to cure the problem because he'd have to order a bunch of parts and build a new LDR bug from scratch (and have to do some experimentation to find the right components). The other option was to rip out the optical based trem and have him build a tube bias trem circuit from scratch. I didn't feel like going $300 into an amp that's still under warranty so I declined.

So, I'll use a tremolo pedal if I feel the need. It's just irritating to have a $4000 amp with something that doesn't work right and a Fender warranty service centre that's incapable of fixing it.
Wait. So the amp is still under warranty and Fender cannot/will not fix it or (gasp) replace it? Since I know they won't cover tubes and perhaps speakers(?), does this mean the remainder of my 5 yr warranty on my TRRI is basically worthless and I don't have to bother finding an "Authorized Fender" tech in another state to have it fixed if it needs it?

This would be useful information (if true) for those of us living in the stix.


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Post subject: Re: Not much on Vibroking-king
Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2016 5:09 pm
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So here's a fun update. My VK is with my tech right now because it started red plating the reverb 6V6 power tube. My tech found that some of the resistors in the reverb power circuit were way off spec and failing. He also showed me how Fender uses the exact same cheap components in their $4000 hand wired amp as they do in their $400 Chinese Vaporizer or Hot Rod amps. Basically stuff that's rated for about 5 years before failure. The output transformer is even stamped "Tai Chang" on the side.

I'm paying for my tech to replace the power supply and cathode bypass caps, the plate and screen resistors, and the preamp plate load resistors with higher quality parts because I don't want to have to take it back into the shop any time soon. I didn't take it in for warranty repair because I don't trust the local Fender Authorized Service tech and they would just replace with the same crappy parts that are already in there.

I should have used my money to buy an amp from a reputable independent builder instead. "Hand wired" is an absolute marketing farce.

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Post subject: Re: Not much on Vibroking-king
Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2016 6:39 pm
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There is no finer production amp on the planet than a Fender manufactured forty or fifty years ago and maintained to spec with NOS vintage parts.

Period.

End of story.

Nothing follows.

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: Not much on Vibroking-king
Posted: Fri Oct 07, 2016 8:08 pm
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Retroverbial wrote:
There is no finer production amp on the planet than a Fender manufactured forty or fifty years ago and maintained to spec with NOS vintage parts.

Period.

End of story.

Nothing follows.

Arjay


Yep, I'm beginning to see why now. It's not that they're physically unable to build an amp just as well today, and it's got nothing to do with construction methods... It's quality of components used in the build. Basically all of today's amps have a planned obsolescence built into them. What else can it be when they're using caps and resistors rated for a lifespan of 2000 hours? You play that amp 1 hour a day for 5 years and that's 1825 hours. Now think about all those times you left the amp on for hours while you and your buddies were doing more drinking beer than playing. Or all those gigs where it's on for 5 hours straight. Or those nights you forgot to turn the amp off and it sat on overnight. All those things add up and those components are at end of life right around the time the warranty is up.

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Post subject: VIBRO KING = VIBRO CRAP
Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2016 8:32 am
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Whelp, just got a call from my tech. He fixed the red plating reverb 6V6 but the amp is still humming pretty badly while on standby mode. He's run all the options down and it's the power transformer. That's right, the power transformer is failing.

I'm stuck with the decision right now to either pay my tech to return the amp entirely to stock (put bad parts back in) so that I can then attempt to deal with the warranty process, OR just eat the cost of a new transformer and call it an "upgrade". (I've had the amp over 7 months so I'm well outside the return period).

I'm so pissed off and my god is this amp a piece of garbage. Note that this is not some used or abused amp I bought. It was off the showroom floor at the dealer. To anyone out there contemplating whether the high sticker cost is worth it, it is not. DO NOT BUY THE VIBRO KING.

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Post subject: Re: Not much on Vibroking-king
Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2016 9:31 am
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That sucks. How much is a new power tranny?

:evil:

Arjay

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Post subject: Re: Not much on Vibroking-king
Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2016 9:40 am
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Retroverbial wrote:
That sucks. How much is a new power tranny?

:evil:

Arjay


Had a look at the Mercury Magnetics catalog: $292.

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Post subject: Re: Not much on Vibroking-king
Posted: Sun Oct 30, 2016 9:42 am
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OUCH!

:shock:

You've got a tough decision to make.

Arjay

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